[comp.arch] Cryo-refrigerators

muir@postgres.uucp (David Muir Sharnoff) (03/13/89)

In article <4409@pt.cs.cmu.edu> lindsay@MATHOM.GANDALF.CS.CMU.EDU (Donald Lindsay) writes:
>expected - like optic fiber.  (The single-mode optic fibers that are in
>the ground right now, have an intrinsic bandwidth of 35,000 gigahertz,
>in the IR window alone. This time, it isn't a typo.)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does this mean that you could store ~100GB
in a 3000 mile fiber loop?

Is an optical loop a viable storage medium?  Some benifits: n access points,
< 1 second access to ALL the data....  Problems: reliability.

-Dave
David Muir Sharnoff.			Postgres Research Project, UC Berkeley.
muir@postgres.berkeley.edu		(415) 524-2931

josh@klaatu.rutgers.edu (J Storrs Hall) (03/14/89)

muir@postgres writes:
    >expected - like optic fiber.  (The single-mode optic fibers that are in
    >the ground right now, have an intrinsic bandwidth of 35,000 gigahertz,
    >in the IR window alone. This time, it isn't a typo.)

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but does this mean that you could store ~100GB
    in a 3000 mile fiber loop?

    Is an optical loop a viable storage medium?  Some benifits: n access points,
    < 1 second access to ALL the data....  Problems: reliability.

Well, if you have something that will switch at 35,000 GHz, let me
know.  Optic fiber can be a viable storage medium if we come up with
the appropriate (read photonic) switching capability.  

A 3000-mile loop is a bit much, I would think.  You don't want that
anyway; it would give you 16 millisecond latency.  3000 miles of
50-micron fiber occupies about 250 cubic meters, the volume of a small
house. 

The only reason to talk about fiber is that we have fiber drivers now;
but if we had the photonic switching technology necessary to use it as
a storage medium efficiently, it would be easier to use free-space
storage (bounce the beam around between mirrors).  At a reasonable
limit for visible light you can store a bit in about a 5-micron cube
of empty space; this gives you 100 terabytes in an (empty!) 20-inch box.

Need those switches, though.

--JoSH

dietz@cs.rochester.edu (Paul Dietz) (03/14/89)

In article <Mar.13.15.58.38.1989.8399@klaatu.rutgers.edu> josh@klaatu.rutgers.edu (J Storrs Hall) writes:

>A 3000-mile loop is a bit much, I would think.  You don't want that
>anyway; it would give you 16 millisecond latency.  3000 miles of
>50-micron fiber occupies about 250 cubic meters, the volume of a small
>house. 

3000 miles x (50 microns)^2 = .012 cubic meters, or about 12 liters.

	Paul F. Dietz
	dietz@cs.rochester.edu

brooks@vette.llnl.gov (Eugene Brooks) (03/14/89)

In article <11020@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> muir@postgres.Berkeley.EDU (David Muir Sharnoff) writes:
>Correct me if I'm wrong, but does this mean that you could store ~100GB
>in a 3000 mile fiber loop?
>
>Is an optical loop a viable storage medium?  Some benifits: n access points,
>< 1 second access to ALL the data....  Problems: reliability.
In very early vacuum tube based computers this type of storage used coaxial
cable and was called a "delay line." Of course, modern memory storage devices
have made this technique a bit obsolete.

Now you might ask, just what is a vacuum tube? :-)


Is the news software incompatible with your mailer too?
brooks@maddog.llnl.gov, brooks@maddog.uucp, uunet!maddog.llnl.gov!brooks

joe@modcomp.UUCP (03/16/89)

> The only reason to talk about fiber is that we have fiber drivers now;
> but if we had the photonic switching technology necessary to use it as
> a storage medium efficiently, it would be easier to use free-space
> storage (bounce the beam around between mirrors).  At a reasonable
> limit for visible light you can store a bit in about a 5-micron cube
> of empty space; this gives you 100 terabytes in an (empty!) 20-inch box.
> 
> Need those switches, though.

Sounds pretty neat.  The cube will need, however, a *real good* battery
backup to keep those power glitches from dropping the 100 terabytes into the
bit bucket.

joe korty
uunet!modcomp!joe

bjornl@octopus.tds.kth.se (Bj|rn Lisper) (03/20/89)

In article <21874@lll-winken.LLNL.GOV> brooks@vette.llnl.gov (Eugene Brooks)
writes:
%In article <11020@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> muir@postgres.Berkeley.EDU (David
%Muir Sharnoff) writes:
%>Correct me if I'm wrong, but does this mean that you could store ~100GB
%>in a 3000 mile fiber loop?

%In very early vacuum tube based computers this type of storage used coaxial
%cable and was called a "delay line." Of course, modern memory storage devices
%have made this technique a bit obsolete.

I've heard a story that in the early days of computing, it so happened that
people used telephone lines as delay lines, as an inexpensive (relative to
the memory technology of that time) storage medium. Is there anyone out
there who knows more about this?

Bjorn Lisper