damian@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU (Damian Conway) (08/07/90)
In <1990Aug6.162409.24034@ioe.lon.ac.uk> teexmmo@ioe.lon.ac.uk (Matthew Moore) writes: >(Morgan uses the elephant as an example of an animal partially adapted >to aquatic life - rudimentary fur, some evidence for face to face >copulation, webbing of digits, good swimming ability, and a built in >snorkel). Seems to me that homo sapiens fits in the same category, sharing all but one of those characteristics. Any info on that? damian ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ who: Damian Conway email:..!seismo!munnari!bruce.oz!damian where: Dept. Computer Science phone: +61-3-565-5779 Monash University quote: "A pessimist is never disappointed." Clayton 3168 AUSTRALIA
teexmmo@ioe.lon.ac.uk (Matthew Moore) (08/07/90)
<2829@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU> damian@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU (Damian Conway) writes: (Matthew Moore) writes: > >>(Morgan uses the elephant as an example of an animal partially adapted >>to aquatic life - rudimentary fur, some evidence for face to face >>copulation, webbing of digits, good swimming ability, and a built in >>snorkel). > >Seems to me that homo sapiens fits in the same category, sharing all but >one of those characteristics. Any info on that? > >damian Yes. No time for full repsonse, but the Hardy-Morgan theory does indeed postulate a decisive aquatic phase in human evolution. Comparative anatomy (and behaviour) are the main planks of the theory, with some contribution from the fossil record. As you say, humans possess the characteristics originally listed, plus a thick layer of subcutaeneous fat, and upright posture another aquatic adaption. References: the original paper by Hardy, in Nature (c 1963) a several page long summary in 'The naked Ape' (Morris). 'The Descent of Woman' (E Morgan) 'The Aquatic Ape: a theory of Human evolution' (E Morgan) Morgan possibly wrote another book recently, title not remembered.
kja@cbnewsd.att.com (krista.j.anderson) (08/08/90)
<> <> In article <2829@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU>, damian@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU (Damian Conway) writes: > In <1990Aug6.162409.24034@ioe.lon.ac.uk> teexmmo@ioe.lon.ac.uk (Matthew Moore) writes: > > >(Morgan uses the elephant as an example of an animal partially adapted > >to aquatic life - rudimentary fur, some evidence for face to face > >copulation, webbing of digits, good swimming ability, and a built in > >snorkel). > > Seems to me that homo sapiens fits in the same category, sharing all but > one of those characteristics. Any info on that? There's a fairly recent (1980s?) theory that humans are neotenous. That is, we are not fully developed in the womb at birth. We are fetal apes. What this does is to allow the head to grow quite large in proportion to the body. Then the bones of the arms and legs lengthen after birth. Evidence that humans are a product of neoteny: 1. relatively hairless 2. skull not yet closed at birth 3. larger head per body size compared to other primates 4. relatively helpless at birth 5. slow physical development 6. little teeth, chins and mouths compared to other apes 7. late sexual maturity Anyway, I have wondered about elephants, whether they are neotenous members of the mammoth/mastodon line. One thing that some molecular evolutionists liked about the theory was that it did a good job of explaining how a drastic phenotypic change could result from a small number of genetic changes, such as less than 1% between chimpanzees and humans. The book I read was called _The Monkey Puzzle_, 1985. I can't remember the names of the authors. -- Krista A. HONOR Our Neighbors' Origins and Rights!
paulc@hp-lsd.COS.HP.COM (Paul Carroll) (08/10/90)
> Yes, this seems to be an aquatic adaptation. Interested persons might want to > read _The Aquatic Ape_ which proposes the theory that man is an partially > adapted aquatic animal. Take a good look at the description above. We have > all of those except the built in snorkel and webbing of digits. We also have > the mammalian dive reflex.... Speak for yourself - it runs in my family, at least. (Only half funny, I suppose.) All of my step-brothers and step-sister have two toes joined together on each foot. My own brother, sisters, and myself have only a partial joining. One step-sister, who died a few hours after birth, apparently had severe webbing - I believe of both hands and feet. Perhaps there is some genetic reason as to why I like water sports and swim like a fish .... :^) ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Paul Carroll "Dear Lord, please break the laws + + HP Logic Systems Division of the universe for my convenience."+ + paulc%hp-lsd@hplabs.hp.com - Emo Phillips + ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
paulc@hp-lsd.COS.HP.COM (Paul Carroll) (08/14/90)
> All of my step-brothers and > step-sister have two toes joined together on each foot. As has been pointed out to me, this should have read "half-brothers and half-sister". I just wasn't thinking when I wrote it. Personally, I just think of them as brothers and sister, so I stumbled and mis-spoke (mis-wrote). As always, "open mouth, insert foot". ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Paul Carroll "I don't believe there is a single + + HP Logic Systems Division man, woman, or child alive in + + paulc%hp-lsd@hplabs.hp.com America today that doesn't enjoy a + + lovely beverage!" - David Letterman + ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++