[net.nlang] The British flag - correction and further note on terminology

ntt@dciem.UUCP (Mark Brader) (04/19/84)

Apologies if you got the first version of this posting as well.
I think I cancelled it in time.

Dave Peak is right about the flags (as far as I know), but needs a
slight correction on the nomenclature of the country.

	Great Britain - the island consisting of England, Scotland, and Wales
	Britain - the same
	British Isles = Great Britain + the island of Ireland + all
			associated offshore islands such as Isle of Man
			(Anybody know whether the Channel Islands count?)

All of these are geographical entities.
The political entity commonly called Britain (or even England, which
of course is just one part) is officially:

	The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

which tells you its geographical makeup.  Before the Republic of Ireland (Eire)
was created in 1921, the word "Northern" was missing.  And originally,
before Ireland, uh, entered the U.K, it was just "The United Kingdom of
Great Britain".

If your citizenship is of that political entity, you are officially a
"Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies", and you are also a "British
subject".  But the latter is a much broader term, including the citizens
of all countries in the Commonwealth.  (Until about the time Britain granted
independence to India, "British subject" was all there was; no "Citizen of
Canada", "Citizen of the U.K. and Colonies", and so forth.)

I may as well note that:
	the island of Ireland = Northern Ireland + the Republic of Ireland

Mark Brader

mmt@dciem.UUCP (Martin Taylor) (04/19/84)

===================
If your citizenship is of that political entity, you are officially a
"Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies", and you are also a "British
subject".  But the latter is a much broader term, including the citizens
of all countries in the Commonwealth.  (Until about the time Britain granted
independence to India, "British subject" was all there was; no "Citizen of
Canada", "Citizen of the U.K. and Colonies", and so forth.)
===================
Further correction. I don't believe the citizens of the republics in
the British Commonwealth of Nations are "British Subjects."  Only the
subjects of the monarchs of the various kingdoms (all of whom are
Queen Elizabeth) have that honour.

(I think).
-- 

Martin Taylor
{allegra,linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,floyd,ubc-vision}!utzoo!dciem!mmt

riddle@ut-sally.UUCP (Prentiss Riddle) (04/20/84)

So tell me -- is there a simple adjective I can use to refer to all
inhabitants of England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales and the rest of 'em?
I had been proud of myself for ceasing to call them all "English" (as
many Americans do) and substituting "British".  Now it seems that that
is inadequate, too.  Any solution?

--- Prentiss Riddle ("Aprendiz de todo, maestro de nada.")
--- {ihnp4,seismo,gatech,ctvax}!ut-sally!riddle

jsq@ut-sally.UUCP (John Quarterman) (04/20/84)

You could call them all "brits" like the oz do, using "pomes" for
just the English.  (Don't refer to a Scot as English in his earshot.)
-- 
John Quarterman, CS Dept., University of Texas, Austin, Texas 78712 USA
jsq@ut-sally.ARPA, jsq@ut-sally.UUCP, {ihnp4,seismo,ctvax}!ut-sally!jsq
					moskvax!kgbvax!mcc!ut-sally!jsq

gurr@west44.UUCP (05/02/84)

<>
Just a note ... it was once claimed by one of the aristocratic lunatic
fringe that one is only British if one has GAINED citizenship (ie been
naturalised) - otherwise one is English, Scottish, Welsh or Irish (just
ask the Welsh Nationalists - or the IRA for that matter!)


cbosgd
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	Dave Gurr, Westfield College, Univ. of London, England.