[net.music] Good & Bad Music, Motorhead, Mark Isham, Einstenze Neubaten

cim2@pyuxv.UUCP (Robert L. Fair) (07/19/85)

George B. makes several interesting points about 'Good & Bad Music':

>music has always relied on some sort of grammar to 
>maintain consistency. This grammar was imposed 
>either externally (by the Pope or society), or internally, 
>by the composers own rules.

This is at first sight seems intuitively correct: the assumption is that sounds
without any form or structure are not music, but just noise. 
As George goes on, the problem is recognising that form in the sounds:

>	The problem of deciding what is good and what is bad music then is
>linked to the listener's ability to decide whether the composer is
>using a consistent grammar.  If the grammar is externally imposed the problem
>is lessened.  Music that relies on traditional harmonic grammar is familiar
>enough that the listener can tell if "wrong notes" are being played.  Anyone
>who has heard a mediocre club band knows what I am talking about.  

OK, This is fine so far, but now things start to get a little hazy...

>	The rule that I keep is whether or not the performer or composer
>maintains grammatical consistency (stylistically and harmonically)
>throughout the piece.  If the piece is inconsistent, I judge it to be poorly 
>constructed, and therefore bad.  If the piece is consistent throughout, then
>I judge it to be well constructed and therefore good.  

The first part of this seems OK - If a piece is musically inconsistant
(without being *deliberately* inconsistant) and with poor structure
then it is likely to be a poor piece of music.

However, the second - a consistent piece is a good piece - is
not necessarily true, indeed it is often totally false!!

As a common example, many rock tunes are very consistant 
- many HM bands are *extremely* conistant, to the stage of being totally
indistinguishable without counting the hairs on the lead singer's torso,
yet how many people would regard that music as having *long-term*
musical merit, in this particular case the repetition of themes is
pretty brain damaging, with the notable exception of bands like
MOTORHEAD.

>	The danger with music that uses a grammar that is fully internally
>imposed both stylistically and harmonically is that the first time 
>listener will more than likely not understand the piece.
>To take an extreme example, a performance consisting of a man dressed in an
>ape suit, who comes out on stage, starts a chain saw, puts it down on the
>floor and then leaves the theater, will undoubtedly cause confusion in the
>audience (and a lot of heated "is it music" debate).

Have you ever seem a German group called Einstenze Neubatan (Collapsing
New Buildings) ? That is exactly what they do (Only without the
Gorilla outfit) They are **tremendously** sucessful as well - it
looks like lots of people like it. But do they go for the music??

Personally, I don't regard a load of chain-saws & power drills to be
music - and even if I did, I wouldn't *pay* to see it - I'd go
round the local construction site. Remember - It is the MUSIC that
we are considering here, not the VISUAL effects, although that is
worthy of discussion in its own right.

>	The advent of electronic means of score realization has brought 
>a new wrinkle.  Before, the composer couldn't get away with truly awful
>technique and a paucity of ideas, because the musicians wouldn't play it 

It actually takes quite a lot of skill to use electonic instruments
properly, particularly to emulate classical instruments.
While electronics can be used to hide a lack of ideas
some exceedingly good musicians are now combining classical & electronic
musics to produce a natural blend of the two, for example Mark Isham and
the Penguin Cafe Orchestra. 

>	We should make the effort to decide what is bad art and what is 
>good art and if we decide a piece is bad to say so loud and clear, because
>simply to think: 
>		     because no judgements can be made, 
>		     I can therefore make no judgements 
>
>will lead us (it has led us) into a black hole of mediocrity, with all pieces
>being accepted as great, and all composers being hailed as geniuses.

Yes - but remember what is good art to one person  in a particular
culture may be noise in another cultural group.


Rob. Fair - Where has all the pickled herring gone ?