schweige@aldebaran.cs.nps.navy.mil (Jeffrey M. Schweiger) (04/24/91)
In article <111465@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu> watters@anaconda.cis.ohio-state.edu (david r watters) writes: <In article <2133@aldebaran.cs.nps.navy.mil> schweige@cs.nps.navy.mil (Jeffrey M. Schweiger) writes: < <>Now, for more conjecture and opinion. I happen to agree that 2.0 should not <>be released until it's ready. Releasing an intermediate version of it, was, <>IMHO, necessary for the A3000, as otherwise some of the 3000's features, not <>presently part of other Amigas (ECS Denise, 2meg Agnus - although MegaChip <>2000 addresses this one). < <This is not total true. The A3000 also runs under OS1.3! It should have been <released with 1.3 if 2.0 was not ready. Obviously C-A felt 2.0 was ready <enough to be released in A3000's... well then, it is ready enough to ship in <A500's and A2000's and should be available as a upgrade for those that already <own machines. Everyone would understand that it was not the final or newest <version of the OS, just as A3000 owners know this. Yes the A3000 runs under OS1.3, but doesn't address the ECS Denise features. ECS Denise is part of the 3000, it is not presently part of the other models. <>I would rather wait a little while longer, and allow <>Commodore to get 2.0 right, than to have them get stuck supporting multiple <>configurations. I'm also quite happy that many of the Commodore engineers <>take time to participate on Usenet. They don't have to. < <I totally agree! However, I paid $3000 for a A2500/30. Two weeks later the <A3000 came out with 2.0 for $2500. I can't even get A2091 ROMS that work <as they should. Why shouldn't my machine also have 2.0? My Amiga Dealer <is still trying to tell me that the A2500/30 is C-A's flagship until the <A3000T comes out. ECS Denise is done! It's going into A3000's and Rejuvinated <A1000's... I got the 1meg Agnus... Add 2.0 and I am set! <So... Why can't we all get ECS Denises? Why can't we all get 2.0? We can't get 2.0 because Commodore says it isn't ready yet. The ECS Denise is going into the 3000. However, at present, there is an incompatibility between the ECS Denise and NewTek's Video Toaster. Until this is worked out maybe the ECS Denise should not be installed in the 500/2000. With respect to Rejuvinated 1000's: (1) this is a third-party product, not from Commodore, and (2) are you sure that they have ECS Denises? By the way, I heard somewhere that the A2091 6.6 ROMs are now released. Can anyone from Commodore confirm? <It should be all or none because I just can't see any reason why I shouldn't <drop an ECS Denise in my machine now, and 2.0 is -=* MORE *=- stable than <1.3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:-)!!!!!!! Depends on how you define "stable". < <note: If we were talking about a couple intuition bugs being fixed or some < smaller commands in the C directory it would be a different story... but < 2.0 is a totally new personality and way of life and that makes this a < very important issue! Yes it is, and that makes it even more important that it be done right. <Dave Jeff Schweiger Please note change in the newsgroup in the followup. I don't think that this discussion belongs in c.s.a.applications. -- ******************************************************************************* Jeff Schweiger Standard Disclaimer CompuServe: 74236,1645 Internet (Milnet): schweige@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil *******************************************************************************
DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu (04/24/91)
2000s have been shipping with the ecs denise for a while now (over a month). I don't know anyone who bought a 500 recently, so I don't know about that. -- Dan Babcock
roddi@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU (Roddi Walker) (04/24/91)
In <47722@ut-emx.uucp> greg@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Greg Harp) writes: [blah blah] >didn't (you didn't say whether you did). As for the ECS Denise, I don't >know why they don't sell them in the US. Someone told me (although I can't >be sure) that they are available in Australia. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) Yes, they are. I bought one for my A2000 about 3 months ago for $52 Australian. I don't think they are being sold directly by CBM Australia(*), as I bought mine from a private dealer who seemed to have little trouble procuring them. All in all,the new chip is just an improvement over the old Denise (hardly surprising considering the new chip is pin-compatible). It is certaily NOT a long-term solution to the Amiga's (now) underpowered graphics. Roddi. * - CBM Australia are the biggest bunch of losers I have ever seen. Incompetence of that magnitude needs to be actively worked for - no matter how naturally talented they are, they can't totally f*cked up. After fruitless months of trying to get an A2320 from them (ha ha - they need to sell their entire stock of the obsolete Microway Flicker Fixer to an unwilling public before they carry the A2320) I gave up. Similar story with the gadget (forgot the part number) that goes between the Amiga and the multisync monitor cable to fix up Productivity mode (without this gadget, the top two inches are totally distorted). They also sent a developer friend of mine an A2000+Bridgeboard instead of an A3000UX, 200MB Harddrive and all the other goodies. Go figure.
kent@swrinde.nde.swri.edu (Kent D. Polk) (04/25/91)
In article <2136@aldebaran.cs.nps.navy.mil> schweige@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil (Jeffrey M. Schweiger) writes: > >By the way, I heard somewhere that the A2091 6.6 ROMs are now released. Can >anyone from Commodore confirm? I don't know if the 6.6 roms by themselves are available, but I purchased one of the new 2091-50's a few weeks ago. It has the 6.6 roms in it. It appears the interrupt problem and the reselection problem are fixed. I say appears, as I normally have the Quantum 50M and a ST-157N hooked up. The Seagate definitely does NOT support reselection, but I leave it on for the Quantum. I did hook up a Quantum 105M from another 2500 last week (with reselection turned on) and successfully transfered files with both Quantums hooked up at the same time, but I wouldn't say it was a thorough test at all. I didn't want to push my luck, so I unplugged it as soon as I finished the transfer :^( ===================================================================== Kent Polk - Southwest Research Institute - kent@swrinde.nde.swri.edu "Duct Tape is like the Force... It has a Light Side, a Dark Side, and it holds the Universe together" =====================================================================
u3364521@ucsvc.ucs.unimelb.edu.au (Lou Cavallo) (04/25/91)
G'day, In article <47722@ut-emx.uucp>, greg@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Greg Harp) writes: [...] > know why they don't sell them in the US. Someone told me (although I can't > be sure) that they are available in Australia. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) I haven't bought one and I don't know how available they are but the ECS Denise is regularly advertised for sale in OZ Amiga mags here downunder. Prices vary, both above and below AUS$50 and I don't have a magazine handy to quote a price. I hope this helps confirm Gregs point. > Greg Harp yours truly, Lou Cavallo.
michael@hapuna.cs.ucla.edu (michael gersten) (04/26/91)
greg@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Greg Harp) writes: >A 2.0 release for the other machines would have to be on disk, similar to >the betas. The percentage of users who have enough memory that is in the >right place for the ROM image is quite small. In addition, loading 512K >from floppy at every bootup would be a pretty big pain, IMHO. Aside from >the memory a lot less Amiga owners have hard drives. Well, gee, let me put my 2 cents in. I've got a 2000, with an 8 meg memory board in the first slot. One of the big feautures of 1.3 as I heard it was that the RomTag system would allow replacement of any of the system libraries, including exec. So it should be possible to load in a copy of the rom code compiled for *normal amigados file output* (this should just be a flag to the linker, and require no changes to the code), and link it in the RomTag list. Presto! Now come on. RAD: does this, and reloads without any disk activity. Why not a RomTag for the new libraries? You'd only have to reload it at powerup, not at reboots; some of us have computers on 24 hours, so this would be less often than you might think. (My vd0: has never failed to recover even when my clock has been clobbered. If I used RAD:, it would probably be similar. But some software doesn't work with 1.3 RAD, and I never got 1.3.2 to check out its RAD:.) My next comment is that now that there are software kickstarters for the 500/2000 that just require an autoconfig board, there is even less reason for commodore to hold 2.0 back. I see your complaint now. "The last time C=A released beta copies without restriction, people complained that a buggy operating system was put out". Fine. Exactly. This is just what the O/S SHOULD SAY. Right now the system says "Release 1.3" when you reboot. How about saying "Warning -- This is a known buggy prerelease of 2.0 that should only be used by people willing to lose work while encountering bugs" instead? The benefits: 1. No one will use it thinking it is the real thing. 2. People who don't know what "beta" means ("Obviously, its a misspelling of `better') won't use it without realizing it. 3. The die hards can get it and play with it (and lose data) 4. If you put a date stamp in the message, and a date checker in the code, you can make sure that no one uses it for more than (say) 3 months -- tell them that it is now obsolete and they should get a new one. This would rely on the real time clock of the 500/2000 So what is C=A's reason for not releasing it? I don't know. Michael