[comp.sys.amiga.misc] WB2.0 for non-A3000

peter@stca77.stc.oz (Peter Jeremy) (02/01/91)

There has been a lot of smoke and heat generated in the net regarding the
(lack of) WB2.0 for machines other than the A3000.  One question I haven't
seen asked (or answered) is why can't the existing WB2.0 be used on the
A500/A1000/A2000?

The only problems I can think of are:
Commodore Marketing - this is the most likely.

Contains 68030 specific code - Given that AmigaDOS has always supported
multiple CPU's (it supported 680[012]0 from day 0), I find it difficult to
believe that WB2.0 has been written specifically for the 68030.  It is
(barely) possible that the current version was compiled for a 680[23]0,
but this is just a matter of re-compiling with a different flag specified.

CATS are waiting for a real 68040 so they can test the 68040 support - this
is possible, but only explains why it is still `beta' rather than a final
release.

WB2.0 assumes the A3000 ECS chipset - I understood that the new chips were
compatible with the existing chips (and I think that the only difference
between the B2000 and A3000 is Denise anyway).  The code needs to start in
one of the compatible modes in any case (there may not be an enhanced
monitor attached).  It is possible that the drivers don't have sanity checking
code to ensure that programs don't request modes that are not available in
the hardware, but this would only affect programs that tried to use graphics
modes that weren't available.

Would one of the keepers of the AmigaDOS like to comment?

Anyone for `raw cold fish' :-)?
-- 
Peter Jeremy (VK2PJ)         peter@stca77.stc.oz.AU
Alcatel STC Australia        ...!uunet!stca77.stc.oz!peter
240 Wyndham St               peter%stca77.stc.oz@uunet.UU.NET
ALEXANDRIA  NSW  2015

limonce@pilot.njin.net (Tom Limoncelli +1 201 408 5389) (02/01/91)

In article <1222@stca77.stc.oz> peter@stca77.stc.oz (Peter Jeremy) writes:

> [Why no 2.0 for non-Amiga 3000 machines?]

For a 2000 or 500 to run AmigaDOS 2.0, it must be put in ROM.  They're
not going to burn (make) the ROMs until it's done.  ROMs aren't cheap,
do you want to buy them every month until they're ready?

Developers can use 2.0 if they have an MMU and use it like the 3000
does.  Developers can not share this version for many, many reasons.
(1) their nondisclosure agreement says so. 
(2) you don't want a million versions of an *unfinished* operating
systems running around.  (people that got beta-1.3 illegally are still
posting about problems that they wouldn't have if they just upgraded
to the real 1.3 release!)
(3) many more.

> The only problems I can think of are:
> Commodore Marketing - this is the most likely.

Don't blame everything on Commodore Marketing.  Their concern is how
to package it to the consumer... once it's done.
                                           ^^^^
> Contains 68030 specific code - Given that AmigaDOS has always supported

No that's silly.  C-A always planned on this running on all platforms.
By the way, how would marketing influence this?  Sneak in at night and
re-write code that was '030 specific? :-)

> CATS are waiting for a real 68040 so they can test the 68040 support - this
> is possible, but only explains why it is still `beta' rather than a final
> release.

I doubt they have to wait. :-)  Besides, the diferences between the
'030 and '040 shouldn't effect the OS or any program too much.

> WB2.0 assumes the A3000 ECS chipset - I understood that the new chips were

This has been posted over, and over.  2.0 does *not* require the ECS
chipset nor the Amiga 3000 ECS chipset.

I'm not sure why you think marketing is getting in the way.  When 2.0
is sanctioned as "done" I'm sure the race will be to see which happens
first (1) the first batch of ROMs are done and are used on the
assembly line (2) the upgrade kits and (this might be bigger) install
manual and rumor squasher manual are finalized.

I'd assume that (1) will take less time, which means that we'll see
Amiga 500, 2x00, 3000s shipping with 2.0 in ROM a couple weeks before
the upgrade kits are available.

Viewing past actions of the Amiga community, I assume that if the
difference is more than 2 weeks rumors of "no upgrade kits" will start
to spread.  I hope C-A includes a note with the Amigas that says
something like: "Tell you friends to start saving their dough!
Upgrade kits for Amiga 500s, 2000s, 2500s will be shipping soon!"

Tom
-- 
One thousand, one hundred, seventy five people died of AIDS
last week.  Did someone mention a war in Iraq?

peterk@cbmger.UUCP (Peter Kittel GERMANY) (02/02/91)

In article <1222@stca77.stc.oz> peter@stca77.stc.oz (Peter Jeremy) writes:
>There has been a lot of smoke and heat generated in the net regarding the
>(lack of) WB2.0 for machines other than the A3000.  One question I haven't
>seen asked (or answered) is why can't the existing WB2.0 be used on the
>A500/A1000/A2000?

It actually DOES run on any Amiga. The only thing currently needed is Fast
RAM as first autoconfigured device plus a utility program only available
for registered developers and not for the public. But when it is in ROM,
then every machine should work with it.

>Contains 68030 specific code 

Not true.

>CATS are waiting for a real 68040 so they can test the 68040 support - this
>is possible, but only explains why it is still `beta' rather than a final
>release.

Not true.

>WB2.0 assumes the A3000 ECS chipset 

Not true.

It's simply debugging. When all bugs have been removed, then it
can go into ROMs and hopefully also onto the other machines.

-- 
Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to  \\  Only my personal opinions... 
Commodore Frankfurt, Germany  \X/ {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmger!peterk

johnhlee@viola.cs.cornell.edu (John H. Lee) (02/02/91)

In article <1222@stca77.stc.oz> peter@stca77.stc.oz (Peter Jeremy) writes:
>There has been a lot of smoke and heat generated in the net regarding the
>(lack of) WB2.0 for machines other than the A3000.  One question I haven't
>seen asked (or answered) is why can't the existing WB2.0 be used on the
>A500/A1000/A2000?
>
>The only problems I can think of are:
>Commodore Marketing - this is the most likely.
>
>Contains 68030 specific code - Given that AmigaDOS has always supported
[...]
>WB2.0 assumes the A3000 ECS chipset - I understood that the new chips were
[...]

I believe that it has been stated publicly (by Commodore personnel and
others, but not officially) that WB2.0 does not contain 68030/020-specific
code, does not it require the ECS chipset, and in fact *will* run on A500s
and A2000s.  A stock A1000 cannot run release WB2.0 because the motherboard
does not support the new 512K ROMs.  Developers *are* currently beta-testing
WB2.0 on A500s, A1000s, A2000s, and A3000s because Kickstart is loaded into
RAM and executed from there.

So why is WB2.0 not out for A500s, A1000s, and A3000s?  Because it has
not completed beta-testing yet, and Commodore will not make a vapor-ware
announcement.  Current A3000 owners have a *pre-release* version of WB2.0.  

Patience can be difficult (for me, most definitely), but we all must wait
a bit more.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deadly rumors spread unchecked!  Next time on AmigaDos: The Next Generation.
	John Lee		Internet: johnhlee@cs.cornell.edu
The above opinions of those of the user, and not of this machine.

chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) (02/04/91)

peter@stca77.stc.oz (Peter Jeremy) writes:
>There has been a lot of smoke and heat generated in the net regarding the
>(lack of) WB2.0 for machines other than the A3000.  One question I haven't
>seen asked (or answered) is why can't the existing WB2.0 be used on the
>A500/A1000/A2000?
>
>The only problems I can think of are:
>Commodore Marketing - this is the most likely.
>
>Contains 68030 specific code - Given that AmigaDOS has always supported
>multiple CPU's (it supported 680[012]0 from day 0), I find it difficult to
>believe that WB2.0 has been written specifically for the 68030.  It is
>(barely) possible that the current version was compiled for a 680[23]0,
>but this is just a matter of re-compiling with a different flag specified.
>
>CATS are waiting for a real 68040 so they can test the 68040 support - this
>is possible, but only explains why it is still `beta' rather than a final
>release.
>
>WB2.0 assumes the A3000 ECS chipset - I understood that the new chips were
>compatible with the existing chips (and I think that the only difference
>between the B2000 and A3000 is Denise anyway).  The code needs to start in
>one of the compatible modes in any case (there may not be an enhanced
>monitor attached).  It is possible that the drivers don't have sanity checking
>code to ensure that programs don't request modes that are not available in
>the hardware, but this would only affect programs that tried to use graphics
>modes that weren't available.
>
>Would one of the keepers of the AmigaDOS like to comment?
>
>Anyone for `raw cold fish' :-)?
Hmm.. I don't know where you get your info from but commodore has always said
that 2.0 would be available for 2000's when it is finally released to ROM.  As
for 500's well, from what i understand it is still up in the air if it will
even be available for 500's.  marketing? i don't know.  possibly since keeping
the 500 1.3 compatible would make it much more compatible for games, which is
what most 500 owners do the most of.  but rest assured the 2.0 will be
available for 2000 owners.

>-- 
>Peter Jeremy (VK2PJ)         peter@stca77.stc.oz.AU
>Alcatel STC Australia        ...!uunet!stca77.stc.oz!peter
>240 Wyndham St               peter%stca77.stc.oz@uunet.UU.NET
>ALEXANDRIA  NSW  2015


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INET: chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org

kelson@ais.org (David Lewis) (02/06/91)

>
>> the 500 1.3 compatible would make it much more compatible for games, which is
>> what most 500 owners do the most of.  but rest assured the 2.0 will be
>> available for 2000 owners.

>Well here's my 2c worth. I have an A500 because I can't afford the extra
>money needed for a 2000/3000. (Big investment for a PC)
>I also have 220MB of hard disk and 2MB of memory. Lattice C and many utilities.
>I only use my _GAMES MACHINE_ for games about 1% or less of the time.

>Peter Kerney. Silicon Graphics, Sydney, Australia. (peterk@syd.sgi.oz.au)
>

  I agree with that 100% I mainly bought the amiga 500 because I
coulldnt afford the extra for the 2000/3000.  I RARELY use my amiga
for a games.. I know a lot of 500 owners that are hopeing to
see the wb2.0 and all those goodies comes to the 500 as well...

-- 

Internet: Kelson@ais.org

jms@vanth.UUCP (Jim Shaffer) (02/06/91)

In article <3987@orbit.cts.com> chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>Hmm.. I don't know where you get your info from but commodore has always said
>that 2.0 would be available for 2000's when it is finally released to ROM.  As
>for 500's well, from what i understand it is still up in the air if it will
>even be available for 500's.  marketing? i don't know.  possibly since keeping
>the 500 1.3 compatible would make it much more compatible for games, which is
>what most 500 owners do the most of.  but rest assured the 2.0 will be
>available for 2000 owners.

So you seem to be saying that ROMs for a 2000 wouldn't work in a 500.  Why
not?

--
~  From the disk of:  | jms@vanth.uucp		     | "Glittering prizes and
Jim Shaffer, Jr.      | amix.commodore.com!vanth!jms | endless compromises
37 Brook Street       | 72750.2335@compuserve.com    | shatter the illusion of
Montgomery, PA 17752  | (CompuServe as a last resort)| integrity!"  (Rush)

nfs1675@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil ( Michael S Figg) (02/06/91)

In article <3987@orbit.cts.com>, chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
> >
> Hmm.. I don't know where you get your info from but commodore has always said
> that 2.0 would be available for 2000's when it is finally released to ROM.

And Commodore also said it would be available in September, 1990. I don't 
know if they are still saying that or not. Personally, I wouldn't believe
them anyway.


---Mike


-- 
 --------       o       A herd of bagels      | Michael Figg  DSAC-FSD
 |      |  --  oo o o   escaping from a deli. | DLA Systems Automation Center
 |      |  -- ooo oo    Looking for Lox in    | Cols, Ohio mfigg@dsac.dla.mil
 --------      o o      all the wrong places  | CIS: 73777,360    

chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) (02/07/91)

kelson@ais.org (David Lewis) writes:
>>
>>> the 500 1.3 compatible would make it much more compatible for games, which is
>>> what most 500 owners do the most of.  but rest assured the 2.0 will be
>>> available for 2000 owners.
>
>>Well here's my 2c worth. I have an A500 because I can't afford the extra
>>money needed for a 2000/3000. (Big investment for a PC)
>>I also have 220MB of hard disk and 2MB of memory. Lattice C and many utilities.
>>I only use my _GAMES MACHINE_ for games about 1% or less of the time.
>
>>Peter Kerney. Silicon Graphics, Sydney, Australia. (peterk@syd.sgi.oz.au)
>>
>
>  I agree with that 100% I mainly bought the amiga 500 because I
>coulldnt afford the extra for the 2000/3000.  I RARELY use my amiga
>for a games.. I know a lot of 500 owners that are hopeing to
>see the wb2.0 and all those goodies comes to the 500 as well...
>
>-- 
>
>Internet: Kelson@ais.org


well, I can't speak for commodore but it sure would be useful to have 2.0
availble for an upgrade on the 500 but not to be sold with it.  like i said
the majority of 500 users use it for games most of the time.  i'm not saying
that a majority on this network, since this is hardly a even sampling.


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dave@cs.arizona.edu (Dave P. Schaumann) (02/07/91)

In article <4033@orbit.cts.com> chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>like i said
>the majority of 500 users use it for games most of the time.  i'm not saying
>that a majority on this network, since this is hardly a even sampling.

So, you've taken a survey?  How big was your sample?  If you're going to make
broad, sweeping generalizations like this, you should really provide some
hard facts to back it up.

Please note the followup-to line!

>UUCP: {amdahl!bungia, crash}!orbit!pnet51!chucks
>ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!chucks@nosc.mil
>INET: chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org

Dave Schaumann		dave@cs.arizona.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Disclaimer:			*** DANGER ***
Access hole may tear easily.  Use of the access holes for lifting or carrying
may result in damage to the carton and subsequent injury to the user.

231b3678@fergvax.unl.edu (Phil Dietz) (02/07/91)

In article <4033@orbit.cts.com> chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>kelson@ais.org (David Lewis) writes:
>>>
>>>> the 500 1.3 compatible would make it much more compatible for games, which is
>>>> what most 500 owners do the most of.  but rest assured the 2.0 will be
>>>> available for 2000 owners.
>>
>>>Well here's my 2c worth. I have an A500 because I can't afford the extra
>>>money needed for a 2000/3000. (Big investment for a PC)
>>>I also have 220MB of hard disk and 2MB of memory. Lattice C and many utilities.
>>>I only use my _GAMES MACHINE_ for games about 1% or less of the time.
>>
>>>Peter Kerney. Silicon Graphics, Sydney, Australia. (peterk@syd.sgi.oz.au)
>>>
>>
>>  I agree with that 100% I mainly bought the amiga 500 because I
>>coulldnt afford the extra for the 2000/3000.  I RARELY use my amiga
>>for a games.. I know a lot of 500 owners that are hopeing to
>>see the wb2.0 and all those goodies comes to the 500 as well...
>>
>>-- 
>>
>>Internet: Kelson@ais.org
>
>
>well, I can't speak for commodore but it sure would be useful to have 2.0
>availble for an upgrade on the 500 but not to be sold with it.  like i said
>the majority of 500 users use it for games most of the time.  i'm not saying
>that a majority on this network, since this is hardly a even sampling.
>
>
>UUCP: {amdahl!bungia, crash}!orbit!pnet51!chucks
>ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!chucks@nosc.mil
>INET: chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org

Actually!!
 
I bet my life that there are more GAMES sold to A2000's then A500s!
The life of an A500 is very frugal.  Anything that the A500 owner buys is
usually something needed (like CED, Lattice, Word Perfect).  The A2000
owner on the other hand has his 60 grand a year job, so he buys everything
his heart desires (a Video toaster, a 5th hard drive, an optical mouse).
An A2000 owner is like the Beverly Hills dude that has EVERYTHING.  If 
it's new, he has to have it.
 
I personally know people like that, that go and buy $200 of games
and stuff every weekend, and not even open all of them up!  Wasted
games, but they don't mind.
 
Now to say that the A500 is a GAMES machine because it's cheaper, is like
comparing two weekend golfers (one with a cheap set and the other with
a 1000 set--yet they both play the same)  It's also like saying people
with BIG heads are smarter than normal people.  I personally feel
that they just have a BIG fat head......
 
Apples are apples and oranges are oranges.  The a500 is an a1000 is an
a2000 is an a3000.  We ALL should have WB2.0 available!  Segragating
their computers would make commodore a lamer company like them MSDOS ones
(you know them...so and so memory card ONLY works on so and so version
of so and so BRAND computer.)

later
Phil Dietz

---
 University of Nebraska          Phil Dietz                  //
 Computer Science          231b3678@fergvax.unl.edu       \\// out the
                           235b4271@fergvax.unl.edu        \/  Amiga!

peterk@cbmger.UUCP (Peter Kittel GERMANY) (02/07/91)

In article <2916@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil> nfs1675@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil ( Michael S Figg) writes:
>In article <3987@orbit.cts.com>, chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>> >
>> Hmm.. I don't know where you get your info from but commodore has always said
>> that 2.0 would be available for 2000's when it is finally released to ROM.
>
>And Commodore also said it would be available in September, 1990. I don't 
                                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>know if they are still saying that or not. Personally, I wouldn't believe
>them anyway.

I don't know who really told you this. But we at Commodore all know
from personal experience over the years that speculating about
final release dates is one of the extremely risky things. So I also
never saw such an announcement here on the net. So, don't blame "them"
(Commodore) for one "Commodore" (really?) person who obviously promised
something he/she shouldn't have.

-- 
Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to  \\  Only my personal opinions... 
Commodore Frankfurt, Germany  \X/ {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmger!peterk

chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) (02/09/91)

jms@vanth.UUCP (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>In article <3987@orbit.cts.com> chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>>Hmm.. I don't know where you get your info from but commodore has always said
>>that 2.0 would be available for 2000's when it is finally released to ROM.  As
>>for 500's well, from what i understand it is still up in the air if it will
>>even be available for 500's.  marketing? i don't know.  possibly since keeping
>>the 500 1.3 compatible would make it much more compatible for games, which is
>>what most 500 owners do the most of.  but rest assured the 2.0 will be
>>available for 2000 owners.
>
>So you seem to be saying that ROMs for a 2000 wouldn't work in a 500.  Why
>not?

Well, i don't know if they will be compatible or not, i just meant that it may
not be supported to have 2.0 in a 500, i don't know for sure or not.

>
>--
>~  From the disk of:  | jms@vanth.uucp		     | "Glittering prizes and
>Jim Shaffer, Jr.      | amix.commodore.com!vanth!jms | endless compromises
>37 Brook Street       | 72750.2335@compuserve.com    | shatter the illusion of
>Montgomery, PA 17752  | (CompuServe as a last resort)| integrity!"  (Rush)


UUCP: {amdahl!bungia, crash}!orbit!pnet51!chucks
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INET: chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org

hastoerm@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Moriland) (02/09/91)

In article <1991Feb07.052626.28665@hoss.unl.edu> 231b3678@fergvax.unl.edu (Phil Dietz) writes:
[....lots of boring stuff deleted....]
}
}Actually!!
} 
}I bet my life that there are more GAMES sold to A2000's then A500s!
}The life of an A500 is very frugal.  Anything that the A500 owner buys is
}usually something needed (like CED, Lattice, Word Perfect).  The A2000
}owner on the other hand has his 60 grand a year job, so he buys everything
}his heart desires (a Video toaster, a 5th hard drive, an optical mouse).
}An A2000 owner is like the Beverly Hills dude that has EVERYTHING.  If 
}it's new, he has to have it.

What total BS. If thats true, then me and a lot of other A2000 owners
are missing out someplace. I don't know a SINGLE A2000 or even A3000
owner who fits the mold you just described. I own an A2000 and I
barely make $12000 a year! Where the hell is my 60 grand a year job?

} 
}I personally know people like that, that go and buy $200 of games
}and stuff every weekend, and not even open all of them up!  Wasted
}games, but they don't mind.

Again, don't know anyone like that.

} 
}Now to say that the A500 is a GAMES machine because it's cheaper, is like
}comparing two weekend golfers (one with a cheap set and the other with
}a 1000 set--yet they both play the same)  It's also like saying people
}with BIG heads are smarter than normal people.  I personally feel
}that they just have a BIG fat head......
} 
}Apples are apples and oranges are oranges.  The a500 is an a1000 is an
}a2000 is an a3000.  We ALL should have WB2.0 available!  Segragating
}their computers would make commodore a lamer company like them MSDOS ones
}(you know them...so and so memory card ONLY works on so and so version
}of so and so BRAND computer.)
}
}later
}Phil Dietz

Chill out man. You need a vacation or something.

						--Moriland

-- 
| hastoerm@vela.acs.oakland.edu |    __                                | 
|                               | __/// Viva Amiga!                    |
| Founder Of: Evil Young        | \XX/                                 |
| Mutants For A Better Tomorrow |       "Single Tasking: JUST SAY NO!" |

greg@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Greg Harp) (02/09/91)

In article <4056@orbit.cts.com> chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>[Re: 2.0 available for the 500]
>Well, i don't know if they will be compatible or not, i just meant that it may
>not be supported to have 2.0 in a 500, i don't know for sure or not.

2.0 _will_ be available on the 500.  It is possible that Commodore would not 
support such an addition, but I wouldn't worry about it.  There are no 
really good reasons to do such a thing.  Besides, they don't support 
more than one external drive, but many people have them.  

Given that the 2000 and 500 are very similar, there _can't_ be any problems 
with simply popping your "A2000 2.0/ECS Expansion Kit" into an A500.

Greg
-- 
-------Greg-Harp-------greg@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu-------s609@cs.utexas.edu-------
"Confutatis maledictus                "When the accursed have been counfounded
 Flammis acribus addictis,          == And given over to the bitter flames,
 Voca me cum benedictis." -- Mozart    Call me with the blessed."

bdb@becker.UUCP (Bruce D. Becker) (02/10/91)

In article <824@cbmger.UUCP> peterk@cbmger.UUCP (Peter Kittel GERMANY) writes:
|In article <1222@stca77.stc.oz> peter@stca77.stc.oz (Peter Jeremy) writes:
|>There has been a lot of smoke and heat generated in the net regarding the
|>(lack of) WB2.0 for machines other than the A3000.  One question I haven't
|>seen asked (or answered) is why can't the existing WB2.0 be used on the
|>A500/A1000/A2000?
|
|It actually DOES run on any Amiga. The only thing currently needed is Fast
|RAM as first autoconfigured device plus a utility program only available
|for registered developers and not for the public. But when it is in ROM,
|then every machine should work with it.

	I had the notion that the Kickstart 2.0
	image needed to load at address 0x200000.
	There was once a version that could load
	at 0xF00000, but that doesn't seem to have
	been continued.

	I'd love to get a version of zkick/Kickstart
	which could load at an arbitrary address.
	Several people I know have added memory at
	0xC00000, which would be handy to use.

	An acquaintance has managed to get Kickstart
	loaded into a non-autoconfig memory board,
	and then rebooting to jump into it.

	Also, ROMs won't be much use for an A1000.
	In addition, they only have 256K of memory
	for Kickstart loading, so there are some
	interesting problems to be solved.


-- 
  ,u,	 Bruce Becker	Toronto, Ontario
a /i/	 Internet: bdb@becker.UUCP, bruce@gpu.utcs.toronto.edu
 `\o\-e	 UUCP: ...!uunet!mnetor!becker!bdb
 _< /_	 "Que es mas macho: moral fiber, o oat bran?" - lala

jesup@cbmvax.commodore.com (Randell Jesup) (02/11/91)

In article <71748@becker.UUCP> bdb@becker.UUCP (Bruce D. Becker) writes:
>|It actually DOES run on any Amiga. The only thing currently needed is Fast
>|RAM as first autoconfigured device plus a utility program only available
>|for registered developers and not for the public. But when it is in ROM,
>|then every machine should work with it.
>
>	I had the notion that the Kickstart 2.0
>	image needed to load at address 0x200000.
>	There was once a version that could load
>	at 0xF00000, but that doesn't seem to have
>	been continued.

	All current non-A3000 versions of 2.0 are beta copies for developers
only.  They are not meant to be final consumer-usable versions (particularily
in how they are loaded - ROMs are needed for consumer versions).  F00000
versions are internal-only, and require a special memory board.

>	I'd love to get a version of zkick/Kickstart
>	which could load at an arbitrary address.
>	Several people I know have added memory at
>	0xC00000, which would be handy to use.

	This will not happen - the code is relocated for a specific address.
Close to all developers have access to at least one machine that can run 
current 2.0 beta releases, and if they don't they can get one easily.

#include <std_2.0_beta_&_non-developers.flame>
-- 
Randell Jesup, Keeper of AmigaDos, Commodore Engineering.
{uunet|rutgers}!cbmvax!jesup, jesup@cbmvax.commodore.com  BIX: rjesup  
The compiler runs
Like a swift-flowing river
I wait in silence.  (From "The Zen of Programming")  ;-)

nfs1675@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil ( Michael S Figg) (02/11/91)

In article <866@cbmger.UUCP>, peterk@cbmger.UUCP (Peter Kittel GERMANY) writes:
> In article <2916@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil> nfs1675@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil ( Michael S Figg) writes:
> >In article <3987@orbit.cts.com>, chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
> >> >
> >> Hmm.. I don't know where you get your info from but commodore has always said
> >> that 2.0 would be available for 2000's when it is finally released to ROM.
> >
> >And Commodore also said it would be available in September, 1990. I don't 
>                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >know if they are still saying that or not. Personally, I wouldn't believe
> >them anyway.
> 
> I don't know who really told you this. But we at Commodore all know
> from personal experience over the years that speculating about
> final release dates is one of the extremely risky things. So I also
> never saw such an announcement here on the net. So, don't blame "them"
> (Commodore) for one "Commodore" (really?) person who obviously promised
> something he/she shouldn't have.
> -- 
> Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to  \\  Only my personal opinions... 
Peter, It wasn't "one person" at Commodore, it was THE A3000 press release
that was posted here (where I remembered it from), CompuServe (where I  
found it Yesterday, file 3000.txt, lib 4 - amigauser forum) and was also
seen in Amazing Computing. Here is an excerpt from that release:

*****************************************************************************
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE         EXPECTED SHIP DATE: JULY 1990


        COMMODORE EXTENDS POPULAR AMIGA PRODUCT LINE;
    INTRODUCES TALENTED AMIGA 3000 AT "MULTIMEDIA LIVE"


NEW YORK, NY -- April 24, 1990 -- Commodore Business Machines President 
Harold Copperman and his aggressive management team today dramatically
defined multimedia as the company introduced the latest in its popular line
of Amiga personal computers at a live multimedia demonstration at the
Palladium.  The powerful and elegant new Amiga (R) 3000 brings enhanced
performance capabilities and a new AmigaDOS (TM) 2.0 operating system to
the company's line of multimedia products.

           .
           .
           .

Commodore further announced an AmigaDOS 2.0 enhancer kit for A2000 series
machines to be available in September. Availability of a 2.0 enhancer kit 
for A500 series machines will be announced at a future date.

*****************************************************************************


Okay, Okay, I know. I said September, 1990, and Commodore only said 1990. ;-)
And I firmly believe that Commodore will have WB2.0 out for the 2000 platform
by some September. Maybe you should catch up on the press releases.

All said and done, I agree with most users in that I don't want to see it 
until it is really ready.

---Mike,

nfs1675@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil ( Michael S Figg) (02/12/91)

In article <2926@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil>, nfs1675@dsacg3.dsac.dla.mil ( Michael S Figg) writes:
> 
> Okay, Okay, I know. I said September, 1990, and Commodore only said 1990. ;-)
                                                                      ^^^^^
                                                   This should have said Sept.
						   not 1990.

> And I firmly believe that Commodore will have WB2.0 out for the 2000 platform
> by some September. Maybe you should catch up on the press releases.
> 
> All said and done, I agree with most users in that I don't want to see it 
> until it is really ready.
> 
> ---Mike,

---Mike, again