esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) (05/08/91)
I have to admit a cock-up, I have lost the email address and name of the trial judge. I have accordingly sent a message to the new groups mob to obtain info on the status of the group. Mea culpa and assorted breast beatings. Denis
Steve Hayman <sahayman@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu> (05/09/91)
I have to admit a cock-up, I have lost the email address
and name of the trial judge.
That was me, I'm one of the half-dozen trial "judges", and
the trial.soc.culture.italian proposal is the one that I
am supposedly overseeing.
I have no doubt that trial.s.c.i would make a fine
soc.culture.italian group - BUT - it's apparent that the trial procedure
is not working. As others have noticed, trial groups never show
up in the arbitron reports, and, to my knowledge, no trial group
has ever been promoted to a "real" group since the trial concept began.
I think the other trial groups have generally been left alone
since their creation. trial.rec.metalworking has been around for
at least a year, and as far as I know nobody has done anything about
either promoting it to a full-fledged rec group, or deleting it
due to lack of interest.
I don't know what to suggest, but, obviously, the trial idea
just isn't working out as originally designed. Perhaps the best thing
is to leave trial.soc.culture.italian around while someone
conducts a vote on a regular soc.culture.italian; I have no doubt
that such a vote would pass easily.
Steve
--
Steve Hayman Workstation Manager Computer Science Department Indiana U.
sahayman@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu (812) 855-6984marino@maui.cs.ucla.edu (Fabio Marino) (05/09/91)
A quanto pare il trial procedure non funziona (se lo dice uno dei giudici...) e pertanto credo che sia giunta ora di passare alla votazione per soc.culture.italian. Dato, pero' che esiste il rischio teorico che cio' provochi la soppressione di t.s.c.i. durante il periodo della votazione, propongo una votazione preliminare tra i lettori di t.s.c.i. I voti saranno raccolti per i prossimi 7 giorni. Per votare per la votazione mandate un e-mail a marino@cs.ucla.edu con il subject : SI, per votare contro usate il subject : NO. Tra una settimana pubblichero' i risultati e la relativa decisione. Ciao a tutti, Fabio marino@cs.ucla.edu
esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) (05/10/91)
In article <1991May9.041346.208@news.cs.indiana.edu> sahayman@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu (Steve Hayman) writes: > > >I don't know what to suggest, but, obviously, the trial idea >just isn't working out as originally designed. Perhaps the best thing >is to leave trial.soc.culture.italian around while someone >conducts a vote on a regular soc.culture.italian; I have no doubt >that such a vote would pass easily. I am proposing such a vote today, please refer to cross-postings I shall make. Pity the trial idea has been a wash-out. Denis
marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) (05/10/91)
In article <*RL_9X+@warwick.ac.uk> esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) writes: >In article <1991May9.041346.208@news.cs.indiana.edu> sahayman@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu (Steve Hayman) writes: >> >> >>I don't know what to suggest, but, obviously, the trial idea >>just isn't working out as originally designed. Perhaps the best thing >>is to leave trial.soc.culture.italian around while someone >>conducts a vote on a regular soc.culture.italian; I have no doubt >>that such a vote would pass easily. > >I am proposing such a vote today, please refer to > cross-postings I shall make. Pity the trial idea has been >a wash-out. > >Denis I suggest that this time you don't get involved, please! See a previous posting by Fabio Marino. Massimo ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Massimo Marchi Lewis-112 marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu University of California at Berkeley marchi@UCBCMSA.bitnet Berkeley, CA 94720
esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) (05/13/91)
In article <1991May10.140252.16863@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: > >I suggest that this time you don't get involved, please! >See a previous posting by Fabio Marino. > If you were the rule rather than the exception, I should not want to be involved. ps. I thank Fabio for initiating the call for discussion.
gennaro@athena.mit.edu (Rosario Gennaro) (05/14/91)
In article <#GN_FK@warwick.ac.uk> esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) writes: >In article <1991May10.140252.16863@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >> >>I suggest that this time you don't get involved, please! >>See a previous posting by Fabio Marino. >> > >If you were the rule rather than the exception, I should not >want to be involved. > >ps. I thank Fabio for initiating the call for discussion. Since it seems that the gratitude is optional, I just want to thank Denis for having given us in the past 5 months a forum of discussions (even if reduced by the trial status). It's not his fault if the trial system doesn't work, and in any case without tsci we won't be here talking about sci since in many years none made a call for discussion to create an Italian group. Finally a personal opinion: I think that any group should pass through a trial period of maybe less than 5 months. In this way it would be easier to understand what are the real important groups and what are the groups that in a few months will become "bogus" ---Rosario
marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) (05/14/91)
In article <#GN_FK@warwick.ac.uk> esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) writes: >In article <1991May10.140252.16863@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >> >>I suggest that this time you don't get involved, please! >>See a previous posting by Fabio Marino. >> > >If you were the rule rather than the exception, I should not >want to be involved. > >ps. I thank Fabio for initiating the call for discussion. I meant, don't get involved in an active role. If a vote will come I would not mind if you vote. I grant you that right.... just playing at patronizing you:-)) I would hope that you were smart enough to expect reactions such as mine in initiating a newsgroup to discuss opera and pasta dishes (those were the first two items in your list of reasons). Would you be upset if I started a neswgroup called soc.culture.british_black-pudding or soc.culture.british-royal or soc.culture.british-hygiene? How would you like to be patronized by somebody who uses a lot of stereotypical views of your country? I am very tired of people like you who think they have the right to put their mouth where it doesn't belong. In addition to all of this you even forgot the name of the judge... I agree with Rosario, gratitude is optional. You will not have mine. Massimo ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Massimo Marchi Lewis-112 marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu University of California at Berkeley marchi@UCBCMSA.bitnet Berkeley, CA 94720
marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) (05/14/91)
In article <#GN_FK@warwick.ac.uk> esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) writes: >In article <1991May10.140252.16863@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >> >>I suggest that this time you don't get involved, please! >>See a previous posting by Fabio Marino. >> > >If you were the rule rather than the exception, I should not >want to be involved. > >ps. I thank Fabio for initiating the call for discussion. I meant, don't get involved in an active role. If a vote will come I would not mind if you vote. I grant you that right.... just playing at patronizing you:-)) I would hope that you were smart enough to expect reactions such as mine in initiating a newsgroup to discuss opera and pasta dishes (those were the first two items in your list of reasons). Would you be upset if I started a neswgroup called soc.culture.british_black-pudding or soc.culture.british-royal or soc.culture.british-hygiene? How would you like to be patronized by somebody who uses a lot of stereotypical views of your country? I am very tired of people like you who think they have the right to put their mouth where it doesn't belong. In addition to all of this you even forgot the name of the judge... I agree with Rosario, gratitude is optional. You will not have mine. Massimo PS All my gratitude goes to Fabio instead. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Massimo Marchi Lewis-112 marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu University of California at Berkeley marchi@UCBCMSA.bitnet Berkeley, CA 94720
marino@maui.cs.ucla.edu (Fabio Marino) (05/14/91)
In article <1991May13.191113.10112@athena.mit.edu> gennaro@athena.mit.edu (Rosario Gennaro) writes: >In article <#GN_FK@warwick.ac.uk> esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) writes: >>In article <1991May10.140252.16863@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >>> >>>I suggest that this time you don't get involved, please! >>>See a previous posting by Fabio Marino. >>> >> >>If you were the rule rather than the exception, I should not >>want to be involved. >> >>ps. I thank Fabio for initiating the call for discussion. > >Since it seems that the gratitude is optional, I just want to thank Denis >for having given us in the past 5 months a forum of discussions (even if >reduced by the trial status). It's not his fault if the trial system doesn't >work, and in any case without tsci we won't be here talking about sci since >in many years none made a call for discussion to create an Italian group. I am sorry but I think you are mistaken about the last point. I was actually discussing the opportunity of creating soc.culture.italian back in December on rec.sport.soccer, when I received a message from Marco Isopi telling me of the existance of t.s.c.i. so I just subscribed to the new group. My thanks to Denis for creating t.s.c.i., but in a sense this costed us 5 months, even though he didn't know.... > >Finally a personal opinion: I think that any group should pass through >a trial period of maybe less than 5 months. In this way it would be easier >to understand what are the real important groups and what are the groups >that in a few months will become "bogus" > >---Rosario
gennaro@athena.mit.edu (Rosario Gennaro) (05/14/91)
In article <1991May13.203816.6482@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >I would hope that you were smart enough to expect reactions such as >mine in initiating a newsgroup to discuss opera and pasta dishes (those >were the first two items in your list of reasons). Would you be upset >if I started a neswgroup called soc.culture.british_black-pudding or >soc.culture.british-royal or soc.culture.british-hygiene? How would you >like to be patronized by somebody who uses a lot of stereotypical views >of your country? I am very tired of people like you who think they have >the right to put their mouth where it doesn't belong. > >Massimo It's easy to fall in stereotypical views of our country when people like you keep on posting, Massimo. Literally from a previous posting of yours: "In the USA there is no Italian culture, you even forgot how to cook". Right! Gone the pasta what else remains? Rosario p.s. I am tired of people who think they have the right to decide where other people's mouth belongs.
gennaro@athena.mit.edu (Rosario Gennaro) (05/14/91)
In article <1991May13.225918.12545@cs.ucla.edu> marino@maui.cs.ucla.edu (Fabio Marino) writes: >I am sorry but I think you are mistaken about the last point. I was >actually discussing the opportunity of creating soc.culture.italian >back in December on rec.sport.soccer, when I received a message from >Marco Isopi telling me of the existance of t.s.c.i. so I just >subscribed to the new group. I remember, that was the way i knew about the existence of tsci (btw this is another bug of the trial system: they don't show up at the usual checking that the newsreader does when one starts running it). I wanted just to notice that it wasn't Denis fault and that in any case we are going to have our group hopefully very shortly (thanks especially to you) Rosario
esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) (05/14/91)
In article <1991May13.203532.5975@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >Would you be upset >if I started a neswgroup called soc.culture.british_black-pudding or >soc.culture.british-royal or soc.culture.british-hygiene? Don't care. Start one if you like. >I am very tired of people like you who think they have >the right to put their mouth where it doesn't belong. In this we have complete accord > >In addition to all of this you even forgot the name of the judge... :-) > >I agree with Rosario, gratitude is optional. You will not have mine. I will cry myself to sleep. Can we now stop this childish bickering.
brad@looking.on.ca (Brad Templeton) (05/15/91)
I am sorry to report that the readership stats we got back from this group were quite poor. It ranked only in the 5th percentile of USENET sites, ranked by readers per site. (Readers per site does not prejudice against groups that only make it to a small set of sites, such as this one, which goes to around 25% of the arbitron sites) This means the trial failed. I suspect some of you will go ahead with the vote being considered at this time, which will pretty much kill the trial hierarchy. Oh well. -- Brad Templeton, ClariNet Communications Corp. -- Waterloo, Ontario 519/884-7473
marino@maui.cs.ucla.edu (Fabio Marino) (05/18/91)
In article <?^P_L*@warwick.ac.uk> esrmm@warwick.ac.uk (Denis Anthony) writes: >In article <1991May13.203532.5975@agate.berkeley.edu> marchi@gold.cchem.berkeley.edu (Massimo Marchi) writes: >>Would you be upset >>if I started a neswgroup called soc.culture.british_black-pudding or >>soc.culture.british-royal or soc.culture.british-hygiene? > >Don't care. Start one if you like. [other stuff deleted] > >I will cry myself to sleep. Can we now stop this childish bickering. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ PLEASE DO IT !!!! :-) :-) :-) :-)
brad@looking.on.ca (Brad Templeton) (05/19/91)
Discussion of the future of the trial hierarchy is going on now in the news.admin group. One suggestion that is gaining some acceptance is a switch from "trial.soc" to "soc.trial" to avoid the problem of propagation. If this is done, it is possible that soc.trial.culture.italian would be created forthwith, assuming the vote is abandoned. Or the vote could continue and you could have nothing further to do with trials. -- Brad Templeton, ClariNet Communications Corp. -- Waterloo, Ontario 519/884-7473
marino@maui.cs.ucla.edu (Fabio Marino) (05/19/91)
In article <1991May18.212351.24338@looking.on.ca> brad@looking.on.ca (Brad Templeton) writes: >Discussion of the future of the trial hierarchy is going on now in >the news.admin group. > >One suggestion that is gaining some acceptance is a switch from "trial.soc" >to "soc.trial" to avoid the problem of propagation. > >If this is done, it is possible that soc.trial.culture.italian would be >created forthwith, assuming the vote is abandoned. Or the vote could >continue and you could have nothing further to do with trials. >-- >Brad Templeton, ClariNet Communications Corp. -- Waterloo, Ontario 519/884-7473 Well, as far as I am concerned the idea of a trial group is good in theory but doesn't work in reality : no trial group has been promoted to regular status so far. Maybe, the switch to soc.trial will change things, but for now I think we have wasted way too much time with t.s.c.i. : had we gone for the vote in January, as I intended to, now we would have soc.culture.italian. Let's forget t.s.c.i. and in a few weeks we'll have a regular newsgroup. Fabio Marino -- Fabio Marino Graduate Student marino@cs.ucla.edu UCLA marino@cognet.ucla.edu Computer Science Department fabio@seas.ucla.edu Brain Research Institute