[comp.graphics.visualization] AVS Network Abstraction

peda@modesty.Stanford.EDU (Bill Codding) (11/15/90)

In article <4023@media-lab.MEDIA.MIT.EDU> wave@media-lab.MEDIA.MIT.EDU
(Michael B. Johnson) writes:

>  First of all, the coarseness of the networks being built
> hides an obvious lack - functional abstraction.  Visual programming is a
> wonderful prototyping environment, but when it comes time to use it to
> build a large system, you really want the ability to "black-box" networks.
> What begins to happen is that you want to functionally abstract certain
> subnetworks into modules in a larger network.

About a year ago, when we began looking at doing serious AVS work,
I approached one of the AVS development heads about network abstraction
in almost the same words as above.

I was told that this was already being looked at for future AVS releases.
I believe that 2 releases have gone by since, so I don't know what
their timetable was (or is) for this.

-Bill Codding

------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Bill Codding                                       (415)493-3554 (w)
  Research Engineer                                  (415)751-5484 (h)
  P.E.D.A.                                peda@simplicity.Stanford.EDU
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jim@baroque.Stanford.EDU (James Helman) (11/15/90)

  I was told that this was already being looked at for future AVS releases.
  I believe that 2 releases have gone by since, so I don't know what
  their timetable was (or is) for this.

How many AVS ports are available?  Are the ports close to the same
version as Stardent's current AVS or is there a substantial lag?  It's
a shame that Stardent apparently isn't in too much of a hurry to see
AVS spread, at least not to SGIs.  It would be their most important
compatible platform.  Alas, yet another software schism.

Similarly, I've heard that Portable Dore is currently at version 2.2,
while Stardents are running 4.0.  That's a pretty big version delta.

I hope that Stardent isn't trying to compete by becoming software
proprietary.  They're not big enough to survive using that strategy.
Even when you are that big, it doesn't work forever, as two of the
largest Massachusetts-based computer companies have found out.

Besides, they've got some great software, and I want it.

Jim Helman
Department of Applied Physics			Durand 012
Stanford University				FAX: (415) 725-3377
(jim@KAOS.stanford.edu) 			Work: (415) 723-9127

slamont@network.ucsd.edu (Steve Lamont) (11/22/90)

In article <JIM.90Nov14115241@baroque.Stanford.EDU> jim@baroque.Stanford.EDU (James Helman) writes:
>How many AVS ports are available?  Are the ports close to the same
>version as Stardent's current AVS or is there a substantial lag?  It's
>a shame that Stardent apparently isn't in too much of a hurry to see
>AVS spread, at least not to SGIs.  It would be their most important
>compatible platform.  Alas, yet another software schism.

It (AVS) is available on an SGI platform (sort of).

Convex supports it in a distributed mode, with a client running on a Convex
box (or, I'd guess a Stardent, as well), and a server running on the SGI.  The
distributed version is (allegedly) supposed to use the SillyG graphics
pipeline for rendering.  I saw a demo a couple of days ago at Supercomputing
`90 and it looked pretty good.

							spl (the p stands for
							pushing pixels for 0.5
							decades)
-- 
Steve Lamont, SciViGuy -- 1882p@cc.nps.navy.mil -- a guest on network.ucsd.edu
NPS Confuser Center / Code 51 / Naval Postgraduate School / Monterey, CA 93943
What is truth and what is fable, where is Ruth and where is Mabel?
                       - Director/producer John Amiel, heard on NPR

fsfacca@ZoSo.lerc.nasa.gov (Tony Facca) (11/24/90)

In article <4054@network.ucsd.edu> slamont@network.ucsd.edu (Steve Lamont) writes:
>
>It (AVS) is available on an SGI platform (sort of).
>
>Convex supports it in a distributed mode, with a client running on a Convex
>box (or, I'd guess a Stardent, as well), and a server running on the SGI.  The
                      ^^^^^^^^

Maybe not.  Convex actually diddled the AVS code to take advantage of DGL.  I 
had heard that Stardent was reluctant to license AVS to SGI but Convex was 
able to get a license for both DGL and AVS, so they ended up doing the port to
SGI.  I saw it at AUTOFACT and it looked good.  Convex also had an 8 bit X
version running on the Iris.  The rendering was done by the 220 and the bitmaps
sent to the Iris.  Not too-too shabby either.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tony Facca   |   fsfacca@avelon.lerc.nasa.gov      |     phone: 216-433-8318
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      You are at Witt's end.  Passages lead off in *all* directions.

tttron@escher.lerc.nasa.gov (William Krauss) (11/29/90)

In article <1990Nov23.174301.24230@eagle.lerc.nasa.gov> fsfacca@ZoSo.UUCP (Tony Facca) writes:
>In article <4054@network.ucsd.edu> slamont@network.ucsd.edu (Steve Lamont) writes:
>>
>>It (AVS) is available on an SGI platform (sort of).
>>
>>Convex supports it in a distributed mode, with a client running on a Convex
>>box (or, I'd guess a Stardent, as well), and a server running on the SGI.  The
>                      ^^^^^^^^
>
>Maybe not.  Convex actually diddled the AVS code to take advantage of DGL.  I 
>had heard that Stardent was reluctant to license AVS to SGI but Convex was 
>able to get a license for both DGL and AVS, so they ended up doing the port to
>SGI.  I saw it at AUTOFACT and it looked good.  Convex also had an 8 bit X
>version running on the Iris.  The rendering was done by the 220 and the bitmaps
>sent to the Iris.  Not too-too shabby either.
>
>--
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Tony Facca   |   fsfacca@avelon.lerc.nasa.gov      |     phone: 216-433-8318
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>      You are at Witt's end.  Passages lead off in *all* directions.
>


--
>>>>> William D. Krauss			NASA Lewis Research Center	<<<<<
>>>>> tttron@escher.lerc.nasa.gov	Cleveland, OH  44135 		<<<<< 
>>>>> (216) 433-8720 (or -8798)		U.S.A.	Earth			<<<<< 

tttron@escher.lerc.nasa.gov (William Krauss) (11/29/90)

Newsgroups: comp.graphics.visualization
Subject: Re: AVS Network Abstraction
Summary: 
Expires: 
References: <PEDA.90Nov14110337@modesty.Stanford.EDU> <JIM.90Nov14115241@baroque.Stanford.EDU> <4054@network.ucsd.edu> <1990Nov23.174301.24230@eagle.lerc.nasa.gov>
Sender: 
Reply-To: tttron@escher.UUCP (William Krauss)
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: NASA/Lewis Research Center, Cleveland
Keywords: 

Sorry about that last post, folks!

Take two: 

In article <1990Nov23.174301.24230@eagle.lerc.nasa.gov> fsfacca@ZoSo.UUCP (Tony Facca) writes:
>Maybe not.  Convex actually diddled the AVS code to take advantage of DGL.  I 
>had heard that Stardent was reluctant to license AVS to SGI but Convex was 
>able to get a license for both DGL and AVS, so they ended up doing the port to
>SGI.  I saw it at AUTOFACT and it looked good.  Convex also had an 8 bit X
>version running on the Iris.  The rendering was done by the 220 and the bitmaps
>sent to the Iris.  Not too-too shabby either.

It caught my eye (ouch!) at SIGGRAPH this year.  We have DGL here running from
a Convex 220 to an Iris that also has an UltraNet path, which allows us VERY
high speed graphics data transfer (there is no distinction between a GL 
application running resident on an Iris versus a DGL application from the 
Convex to a server Iris - this of course also depends upon the application 
itself).  The possibility of running AVS from the Convex to a server Iris via
the UltraNet is very intriguing to us.

Stay tuned...






--
>>>>> William D. Krauss			NASA Lewis Research Center	<<<<<
>>>>> tttron@escher.lerc.nasa.gov	Cleveland, OH  44135 		<<<<< 
>>>>> (216) 433-8720 (or -8798)		U.S.A.	Earth			<<<<<