[comp.unix.msdos] Info wanted about Unix based PC's

defaria@hpclapd.HP.COM (Andy DeFaria) (09/06/90)

Excuse me for the dumb question but:

	What Unix based PC's are available.

I have no PC at present and am thinking of buying one.  I tried a couple of
local PC dealers and they showed me their best DOS  setups.  After sticking
my finger down my thought and puking  on the salesmans shoes  :-) I decided
that I would probably like a Unix based system.  They  said that they don't
sell Unix based systems.

So  I would like  some info  on what's available  in the way of  Unix based
PC's.  How/Where would I get them?  What software comes as part of the base
Unix OS?  What hardware is required?  Prices?  etc, etc, /etc! :-)

What I'm looking for is somewhat of a  scaled down  model of what I have at
work (an HP 9000 series 350 using X) for as cheap as possible.   I  want to
have a color monitor, multiprocessing, C, Pascal and what not (can  I get a
Turbo Pascal for a Unix based system?) and,  of course, editors  like Emacs
and/or vi.

Although it's tempting to just go for the DOS system and  use stuff like MS
Windows 3.0, I would really like to be able to work on more than  one thing
at a  time like at   work.   From what  I've seen of   MS Windows  and  DOS
(probably the real  culprit)  you can't  do this on the "standard"  PC.  Is
this possible with a Unix based PC?

Also, Unix is just a better  environment than DOS anyway.   One of my goals
is to help my girlfriend  learn more  about computers and programming.  DOS
seems  woefully inadequate and   totally  non-standard to   be able  to  do
anything "right".  Also there is more market appeal  for  someone who knows
Unix. 

Any info would be much appreceiated.

defaria@hpclapd.HP.COM (Andy DeFaria) (09/06/90)

Excuse me for the dumb question but:

	What Unix based PC's are available.

I have no PC at present and am thinking of buying one.  I tried a couple of
local PC dealers and they showed me their best DOS  setups.  After sticking
my finger down my thought and puking  on the salesmans shoes  :-) I decided
that I would probably like a Unix based system.  They  said that they don't
sell Unix based systems.

So  I would like  some info  on what's available  in the way of  Unix based
PC's.  How/Where would I get them?  What software comes as part of the base
Unix OS?  What hardware is required?  Prices?  etc, etc, /etc! :-)

What I'm looking for is somewhat of a  scaled down  model of what I have at
work (an HP 9000 series 350 using X) for as cheap as possible.   I  want to
have a color monitor, multiprocessing, C, Pascal and what not (can  I get a
Turbo Pascal for a Unix based system?) and,  of course, editors  like Emacs
and/or vi.

Although it's tempting to just go for the DOS system and  use stuff like MS
Windows 3.0, I would really like to be able to work on more than  one thing
at a  time like at   work.   From what  I've seen of   MS Windows  and  DOS
(probably the real  culprit)  you can't  do this on the "standard"  PC.  Is
this possible with a Unix based PC?

Also, Unix is just a better  environment than DOS anyway.   One of my goals
is to help my girlfriend  learn more  about computers and programming.  DOS
seems  woefully inadequate and   totally  non-standard to   be able  to  do
anything "right".  Also there is more market appeal  for  someone who knows
Unix. 

Any info would be much appreciated

zeke@shamash.cdc.com (Robert Scott) (09/07/90)

In article <102570001@hpclapd.HP.COM>, defaria@hpclapd.HP.COM (Andy DeFaria) writes:
> Excuse me for the dumb question but:
> 
> 	What Unix based PC's are available.
> 
> I have no PC at present and am thinking of buying one.  I tried a couple of
> local PC dealers and they showed me their best DOS  setups.  After sticking
> my finger down my thought and puking  on the salesmans shoes  :-) I decided
> that I would probably like a Unix based system.  They  said that they don't
> sell Unix based systems.
> 
> So  I would like  some info  on what's available  in the way of  Unix based
> PC's.  How/Where would I get them?  What software comes as part of the base
> Unix OS?  What hardware is required?  Prices?  etc, etc, /etc! :-)
> 
> What I'm looking for is somewhat of a  scaled down  model of what I have at
> work (an HP 9000 series 350 using X) for as cheap as possible.   I  want to
> have a color monitor, multiprocessing, C, Pascal and what not (can  I get a
> Turbo Pascal for a Unix based system?) and,  of course, editors  like Emacs
> and/or vi.
> 

It sounds as if you are somewhat confusing the issue of hardware and operating
system software here.  What a PC dealer is showing you doesn't necessarily
have to be DOS.  If you have an 80386 based PC, you can run any one of 
several flavors of "real" unix, complete with all the goodies the
"real computers" have.
 
> Although it's tempting to just go for the DOS system and  use stuff like MS
> Windows 3.0, I would really like to be able to work on more than  one thing
> at a  time like at   work.   From what  I've seen of   MS Windows  and  DOS
> (probably the real  culprit)  you can't  do this on the "standard"  PC.  Is
> this possible with a Unix based PC?
> 
With a 386, Windows 3.0 can do multitasking just fine.  If you buy a 386 and
put real UNIX on it, you can also call up DOS in a UNIX window (if you have
the optional DOS under UNIX software).

> Also, Unix is just a better  environment than DOS anyway.   One of my goals
> is to help my girlfriend  learn more  about computers and programming.  DOS
> seems  woefully inadequate and   totally  non-standard to   be able  to  do
> anything "right".  Also there is more market appeal  for  someone who knows
> Unix. 

DOS non-standard?  Although being stuck with a 640K address space isn't
exactly the nicest thought, remember that there are literally millions of
copies of DOS running every day throughout the world.  Gonna be a long
time before UNIX gets to that stage.  Besides, with a compiler like
Turbo-C you can write code that is relatively if not completely
transportable from DOS to UNIX and vice-versa.  There are even UNIX tools
and UNIX environments, including one with a full-blown Korn Shell, for
DOS (the MKS Toolkit in particular).

I like UNIX better than DOS myself, but there is a lot of software and
challenge left in the DOS world.  Many more really useful "tools" for
everyday use are available, too.  That's why I run Interactive UNIX and
VP/IX on my machine (sometime just native DOS, too).



Zeke

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~ From the Shrine of the "Last Gasp of ETA Systems" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Extra zesty disclaimer:  MINE! MINE! ALL MINE! <chortle snort froth drool>
Robert K. "Zeke" Scott        internet: zeke@eta.cdc.com
Control Data Corp, Supercomputer Support Group

defaria@hpclapd.HP.COM (Andy DeFaria) (09/07/90)

I have been receiving email  about this pretty  regularly.  Thanks, and I'm
collecting and saving  all useful  info.  My  objective was  to put out  my
feelers about this.  I'm not rushing out and getting a PC tommorrow.  Also,
I'm not planning on summarizing on the net here  although I might  (so post
here instead of emailing me).

What I have basically learned so far  is that  there are several flavors of
Unix for PC's  ranging  from inexpensive  (Coherant) ones that  do next  to
nothing (no networking, etc)  to the more full blown  Unixs like  SCO Xenix
and Interactive.   The more expensive the  OS  the more capability  and the
more hardware  you need (who  said  that  hardware doesn't  matter?).  Also
there are a number of DOS emulators for the Unix environment (and Unix-like
shells and emulators for the DOS environment).

I don't know  exactly what I  should do now  'cept that I'll follow up with
some of these companies and see just how much of my right arm I need to cut
off (if it's too much I'll need a mouse! :-) and then  make a determination
as to whether I would like to  enter the Unix PC  market now or wait for it
to mature alittle  and  for prices to  come down (or  my paycheck to go up!
:-). 

vtcqa@shamash.cdc.com (Jeff Comstock) (09/14/90)

How much money do you want to blow ?  If its around
$10000, get a Sparcstation, or else look for a used
HP ( 320 or 310 ), or a used Apollo, or maybe a
Sparc1.  You can get one of these machines used
for between 3000 and 6000 dollars, and you even
end up with a real computer.  The only thing a PC
is good for is a boat anchor.

Jeff

martin@hq.af.mil (Gregory.J.Martin) (09/14/90)

In article <25817@shamash.cdc.com> jrc%brainiac.uucp@shamash.cdc.com writes:
>You can get one of these machines used
>for between 3000 and 6000 dollars, and you even
>end up with a real computer.  The only thing a PC
>is good for is a boat anchor.
>
>Jeff

Jeff, why is it I can get work done with my Boat anchor?  Blanket statements
such as yours only reflect a small (or closed) mind.  Give us a break, huh?

...Greg Martin

rlim@hpspcoi.HP.COM (Ruth Lim) (09/25/90)

Uhmm, this may sound like a pitch for HP Vectra's (it is), but
HP makes PCs that run unix.  I'm not sure what model would be
best for you, but HP does sell quite a few UNIX based PC's
(or PC-based unix?).

Just FYI. :-)