dayger@Oswego.EDU (Tim Dayger) (01/24/91)
In article <856@argosy.UUCP> cameron@argosy.UUCP (Cameron Spitzer) writes: > > [Lots of info and opinionated comments deleted.] On November 27, 1990 PBS's acclaimed NOVA series broadcast a piece called; "We Know Where You Live". It dealt with exploring the methods used by junk-mailers and telemarketers in gathering info about you and me. One [far too short] portion of the program talked about what people can do to get junk-mailers and telemarketers off their backs. They briefly talk about the DMA's direct mail and telephone preference services: Stressing that *it is purely voluntary* on the part of direct marketing firms to use these lists. Of more importance, was the mention of an organization run by Bob Bulmash called "Private Citizen, Inc." "Private Citizen" has taken an aggressive legal stand against the tactics employed by junk-mailers & telemarketers in an effort to compel firms to remove people from their lists, who don't want to be bothered with unsolicited mail and phone calls. Unfortunately, no cantact info for the organization was given. If anyone out there has information about "Private Citizen", please share it with the rest of us. -- Tim ============================================================================= = Tim E. Dayger | Internet: dayger@oswego.oswego.edu = = Systems Operator | Bitnet: dayger%oswego@snyoswva.bitnet = = SUNY College at Oswego | UUCP: ...!sunybcs!oswego!dayger = = Oswego, NY USA | DECNet: oswego::dayger = =============================================================================
haynes@ucscc.UCSC.EDU (99700000) (01/24/91)
In article <1991Jan24.003028.18320@oswego.Oswego.EDU> dayger@oswego.Oswego.EDU (Tim Dayger) writes: > >If anyone out there has information about "Private Citizen", please share it >with the rest of us. > Sorry, but I can't share it. It's private :-) haynes@ucscc.ucsc.edu haynes@ucscc.bitnet "Any clod can have the facts, but having opinions is an Art." Charles McCabe, San Francisco Chronicle
cyberoid@milton.u.washington.edu (Robert Jacobson) (01/25/91)
Private Citizen is in a suburb of Chicago, IL, and is listed in the Chicago telephone directory. Bulmash charges a fee for putting your name on a list, which he circulates, and then prosecutes in civil court those who violate the announced intention of privacy of those on the list. He's actually collected some settlements from large retailers. Bob J.
schwartz@latour.colorado.edu (Mike Schwartz) (01/25/91)
In article <1991Jan24.003028.18320@oswego.Oswego.EDU> dayger@oswego.Oswego.EDU (Tim Dayger) writes: >(...) >If anyone out there has information about "Private Citizen", please share it >with the rest of us. The address and phone are: Private Citizen, Inc. Box 233 Naperville, IL 60566 (312) 393-1555 I have no affiliation with them. However, I once sent for some information from them, and found out the following. If you contribute $15 and sign their authorization form, they will list you in a directory that they send to firms that do telemarketing. The directory contains a notice that the people listed do not want junk calls, and that if the calls continue, that will constitute acceptance on the part of the business of an "offer" to allow use of the callee's time and property (phone) for the business. The notice goes on to say that this service costs $100 per call. They then say they will take legal action against firms that continue junk calls without paying the fee. While I appreciate their intent, I doubt they will have an effect on junk mail. For one thing, their organization focuses telephone marketing, not postal mail. But even concerning junk calls, I question the legal footing of this "agreement". Moreover, a legal agreement is only as good as the amount of money you have to spend on defending it. I doubt Private Citizen can afford to take on Hart Hanks or a similarly large company. Besides, junk mail is big business, and therefore has the implicit blessing of our legal system. I believe that is why, for instance, the post office corrects mailing lists at stamp buyers' expense. I once wrote to the Post Master General, pointing out that this use of postal information is a violation of the Privacy Act of 1974 (since it is using information for purposes other than those for which it was originally gathered), and received back a copy of a section of some legal document, stating that the post office has an explicit right to do this. - Mike Schwartz Dept. of Computer Science Univ. of Colorado - Boulder
mayo@wrl.dec.com (Bob Mayo) (01/25/91)
In article <1991Jan24.003028.18320@oswego.Oswego.EDU> dayger@oswego.Oswego.EDU (Tim Dayger) writes: >If anyone out there has information about "Private Citizen", please share it >with the rest of us. Article: 32092 of misc.consumers From: gt8963a@prism.gatech.EDU (MCCARTNEY,JEFFREY ELWOOD) Newsgroups: misc.consumers Subject: address for service to combat junk callers Date: 19 Dec 90 13:48:17 GMT Once again, here's the address of the service that combats junk phone calls in a constructive way. I've used the service against a biggie telephone company and a national newspaper and its excellent. It does send the message in a manner that at least gets them to work on their computer act. Whether they pay me for my time answering the specifically unrequested phone calls is a long drawn out question. It's rather comical how they keep calling to clear up the manner when I ask them to only mail me correspondence on the matter or else I'll bill them again. Why are phones such no-brainers in this world? Private Citizen Box 233 Naperville IL 60566 The above is the class act service that helps deal with junk callers as seen on Nova. Write them and you'll be impressed.
djb@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (David Brightbill) (01/30/91)
I tried the "Private Citizen" method of controlling junk phone calls recently. When the marketing droid started making her pitch, I asked for her visa card number. She got real confused, and started the script over a couple of times. Then she handed me off to her supervisor who listened to my pitch. I told the supervisor that I was offering a service to telemarketers and that for $500/call, I'd listen to his pitch and tell him what I though of it. He verified my phone number and said that his next call was going to be to telelphone security...he threatened to have my phone service disconnected because I was running a business from a residense phone. Anyhow...nobody has called to offer me family portraits since.
scott@blueeyes.kines.uiuc.edu (scott) (01/31/91)
In article <1991Jan30.044552.24573@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> djb@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (David Brightbill) writes: > >I tried the "Private Citizen" method of controlling junk phone calls >recently. When the marketing droid started making her pitch, I asked >for her visa card number. I like it!! >[...] I told the supervisor that I was offering a >service to telemarketers and that for $500/call, I'd listen to his pitch >and tell him what I though of it. He verified my phone number and said >that his next call was going to be to telelphone security...he threatened >to have my phone service disconnected because I was running a business >from a residense phone. My response woud have been "What makes you think this is a RESIDENCE phone?" ;-) >Anyhow...nobody has called to offer me family portraits since. And results are all that really count! -- Scott Coleman tmkk@uiuc.edu "Unisys has demonstrated the power of two. That's their stock price today." - Scott McNealy on the history of mergers in the computer industry.
pjs@euclid.jpl.nasa.gov (Peter Scott) (01/31/91)
In article <1991Jan30.044552.24573@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, djb@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (David Brightbill) writes: > > I tried the "Private Citizen" method of controlling junk phone calls > recently. When the marketing droid started making her pitch, I asked > for her visa card number. She got real confused, and started the > script over a couple of times. Then she handed me off to her supervisor > who listened to my pitch. I told the supervisor that I was offering a > service to telemarketers and that for $500/call, I'd listen to his pitch > and tell him what I though of it. He verified my phone number and said > that his next call was going to be to telelphone security...he threatened > to have my phone service disconnected because I was running a business > from a residense phone. Anyhow...nobody has called to offer me family > portraits since. Oooh, nice try... now you could foil the salesdroidsupervisor's angle by saying that the $500 was the fee for *their commercial* use of *your private* property (which is the "Private Citizen" approach, more or less, from their literature). -- This is news. This is your | Peter Scott, NASA/JPL/Caltech brain on news. Any questions? | (pjs@euclid.jpl.nasa.gov)
richg@locus.com (Rich Greenberg) (01/31/91)
In article <1991Jan30.044552.24573@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> djb@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (David Brightbill) writes: >I tried the "Private Citizen" method of controlling junk phone calls [stuff deleted] >and tell him what I though of it. He verified my phone number and said >that his next call was going to be to telelphone security...he threatened >to have my phone service disconnected because I was running a business >from a residense phone. Anyhow...nobody has called to offer me family If you or anyone else gets a similar threat, remind them that making threats by telephone is a federal crime. Rich
david.kaye@f111.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG (david kaye) (02/15/91)
After following this thread a while I'm wondering why people are so bothered by junkmail. Just throw it away. When response drops low enough the mailer won't use the list you're on. If every list drops low enough, it won't be economical to do bulk mail and the major marketers will switch to magazines, broadcast, or go out of business.
Such a worry about nothing...sheesh!
--
david kaye - via FidoNet node 1:125/777
UUCP: ...!uunet!hoptoad!fidogate!111!david.kaye
INTERNET: david.kaye@f111.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORGdwp@willett.pgh.pa.us (Doug Philips) (02/20/91)
In article <12339.27BC843F@fidogate.FIDONET.ORG>, david.kaye@f111.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG (david kaye) writes: > After following this thread a while I'm wondering why people are so > bothered by junkmail. Just throw it away. When response drops low > enough the mailer won't use the list you're on. If every list drops > low enough, it won't be economical to do bulk mail> and the major > marketers will switch to magazines, broadcast, or go out of business. > Such a worry about nothing...sheesh! Have you any idea how many trees are destroyed to produce that paper, how many toxic chemicals are used to bleach and color the trees and how much of that material is not reusable nor recyclable. How many cubic miles of landfil are being wasted? The simple "Market will take care of it attitude" has failed for long enough. -Doug --- Preferred: dwp@willett.pgh.pa.us Ok: {pitt,sei,uunet}!willett!dwp