[comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc] HD in blue PC?

battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) (03/16/91)

I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  

Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

nef@mace.cc.purdue.edu (paulhicks) (03/16/91)

In article <5417@umbc3.UMBC.EDU> battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>
>Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

I can certainly try to shed some light on this.  About 8 years ago
this type of drive, well an Everex 20Meg drive, was installed in my
father's IBM PC at a local computer store (I took great delight in
watching it being installed, for I was an utter novice at the time).
It too had 2 360k full height drives and 256k memory.  Anyway, the point
is is that yes the PC should take the drive, providing you have a
hard drive contoller for it.  I would also recommend you buy a 1/2 height
blank face plate, costs about $2, to cover the hole left by the 
full height drive(assuming it is full height) for both aesthic and 
dust-free reasons.

Paul Hicks

_________________________________________________________________
|                                                                |
|"...and on the eigth day god created the Sauter Mean Diameter." |
|                                   - D.W.Senser                 |
|________________________________________________________________|

berger@iboga (Mike Berger) (03/17/91)

nef@mace.cc.purdue.edu (paulhicks) writes:

>In article <5417@umbc3.UMBC.EDU> battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>>I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>>remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>>such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>>
>>Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

*----
The early BIOS did not support booting from a hard disk.  I believe
this was only on the 64K motherboards.  You can confirm whether you
have the BIOS with hard disk support by looking at the back of the
computer.  If you see a B with a circle around it stamped in light
colored ink, then a hard disk (with appropriate controller) will
work.

The earlier models could use a hard disk for data, but would not
boot from it.
--
	Mike Berger
	Department of Statistics, University of Illinois
	AT&TNET     217-244-6067
	Internet    berger@atropa.stat.uiuc.edu

stevek@hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Steve Kauder) (03/21/91)

>In comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc, battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>
>    I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>    remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>    such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>
>    Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

My best thoughts?  Get an ST251-1 if you can.  It's 40mb (vs. 20 on
the ST225).  It's 28ms (vs. 65 on the ST225).  Finally, you can get
it mail order for as low as $229 (vs. $179(?) for the ST225).  

You would probably have to partition the ST251 into two logical drives
(unless you get DOS 4.01).

Steve K.

P.S. The ST251-1 has self-parking heads vs. the "you better park
     them manually" heads on the ST225.

6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) (03/22/91)

In article <13520003@hpfcmgw.HP.COM> stevek@hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Steve Kauder) writes:

>>In comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc, battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>>
>>    I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>>    remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>>    such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>>
>>    Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

No way.  You need a BIOS upgrade.  How do I know?  I did it, too.
Where can you get an IBM BIOS upgrade?  You can't.  You have to buy
a third party BIOS chip (ie Phoenix).  They work fine, though.

Good luck!


+-------------------+---------------------------+------------------+
|    Mark Dadgar    | 6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu | Bill & Opus -'92 |
+-------------------+---------------------------+------------------+
|   Do you remember chalk hearts melting on a playground wall?     |
|   Do you remember dawn escapes from moon-washed college halls?   |
|   Do you remember cherry blossoms in the market square?          | 
|   Do you remember I thought it was confetti in our hair?         |
|   By the way, didn't I break your heart?                         |
|                                   - Marillion, 1985              |
+----------Would UCSB write anything this intelligent?-------------+
 

sigma@jec302.its.rpi.edu (Kevin J Martin) (03/23/91)

6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) writes:
>>>In comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc, battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>>>
>>>    I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>>>    remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>>>    such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>>>
>>>    Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

>No way.  You need a BIOS upgrade.  How do I know?  I did it, too.
>Where can you get an IBM BIOS upgrade?  You can't.  You have to buy
>a third party BIOS chip (ie Phoenix).  They work fine, though.

Don't be so hasty.  If the ROMs are dated October 27, 1982, they're the
upgrade which allowed 640K ram in the original PC.  I have run RLL drives
with NO problems on such a machine, using the Western Digital 27X 8-bit
controller.  ROMs of that date or later DO allow for hard drives, and the
controller's BIOS takes care of the rest of the work.

You don't have to worry about drive types or anything, of course, since
it's a less-than-AT machine.  So don't spend sixty bucks or so on a new
BIOS until you're sure it won't work.  And I believe it can work.

-- 
Kevin Martin
sigma@rpi.edu

<AVP100@psuvm.psu.edu> (03/23/91)

I have a IBM portable and have been able to install a MiniScribe 20Mb drive dri
ven by a WD1002 w/o ANY hassles whatsoever.  No bios, drivers, TSR's, etc....
I even have a HD 1.44Mb drive running w/o changing the bios.(using the WD-FOX4)

                                                   A.P.

6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) (03/23/91)

In article <+L{=52B@rpi.edu> sigma@jec302.its.rpi.edu (Kevin J Martin) writes:

>6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) writes:
>>>>In comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc, battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>>>>
>>>>    I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>>>>    remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>>>>    such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>>>>
>>>>    Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

>>No way.  You need a BIOS upgrade.  How do I know?  I did it, too.
>>Where can you get an IBM BIOS upgrade?  You can't.  You have to buy
>>a third party BIOS chip (ie Phoenix).  They work fine, though.

>Don't be so hasty.  If the ROMs are dated October 27, 1982, they're the
>upgrade which allowed 640K ram in the original PC.  I have run RLL drives
>with NO problems on such a machine, using the Western Digital 27X 8-bit
>controller.  ROMs of that date or later DO allow for hard drives, and the
>controller's BIOS takes care of the rest of the work.

You may be right.  Except my PC *did* have 640K, and *didn't* work
with the Western Digital controller until I replaced the ROM.  Your
mileage may vary...


+-------------------+---------------------------+------------------+
|    Mark Dadgar    | 6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu | Bill & Opus -'92 |
+-------------------+---------------------------+------------------+
|   Do you remember chalk hearts melting on a playground wall?     |
|   Do you remember dawn escapes from moon-washed college halls?   |
|   Do you remember cherry blossoms in the market square?          | 
|   Do you remember I thought it was confetti in our hair?         |
|   By the way, didn't I break your heart?                         |
|                                   - Marillion, 1985              |
+----------Would UCSB write anything this intelligent?-------------+
 

mstr@vipunen.hut.fi (Markus Strand) (03/24/91)

In article <10166@hub.ucsb.edu> 6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) writes:
>In article <+L{=52B@rpi.edu> sigma@jec302.its.rpi.edu (Kevin J Martin) writes:
>
>>6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) writes:
>>>>>In comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc, battle@umbc4.umbc.edu (Rick) writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>    I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>>>>>    remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>>>>>    such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>
>You may be right.  Except my PC *did* have 640K, and *didn't* work
>with the Western Digital controller until I replaced the ROM.  Your
>mileage may vary...

It's not the amount of memory but the BIOS date that counts.
If you BIOS is older than October 1982 (I think) you must
uppgrade the BIOS to boot from HD. The controller must have its
own ROM enabled on PCs.

Markus Strand
mstr@vipunen.hut.fi

chrielli@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Chris Ellington) (03/25/91)

In article <10137@hub.ucsb.edu>, 6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) writes:
> No way.  You need a BIOS upgrade.  How do I know?  I did it, too.
> Where can you get an IBM BIOS upgrade?  You can't.  You have to buy
> a third party BIOS chip (ie Phoenix).  They work fine, though.
> Good luck!
I have an orig PC (actually 5150) with BIOS dated 10/27/82 with a Seagate
10 meg installed with no problems.  I think the controller is WD and the
drive is for sure a Seagate, but I can't remember the numbers.  Send email
for the numbers (if you want I can open up the machine and tell you)


 
-Chris
 

cur022%cluster@ukc.ac.uk (Bob Eager) (03/25/91)

In article <10137@hub.ucsb.edu>, 6600dadg@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (King of Sunset Town) writes:
>>>
>>>    I hava an original blue PC with 2 360k floppys.  I want to
>>>    remove one floppy and add a HD, ie. ST225.  will the bios support
>>>    such a drive?  The date on the bios is 1982.  
>>>
>>>    Can anybody shed some light on this?   Thanks.....

Two problems. First, you need BIOS support for the disk. That will usually come
on the controller card. Second, you need to initialise that BIOS on startup.
Older BIOS chips won't do that. However, I have a small utility that will
provide the facility that the BIOS lacks without getting new chips. Let
me know if you are interested in using this route.

Basically, my utility generates a special floppy with nothing on it except
a custom boot block. When you boot from this floppy, it initialises the BIOS
on the HD controller, then reboots from the hard disk. The floppy is then
removed. All the DOS stuff lives on the hard disk; nothing on the boot floppy.

-------------------------+-------------------------------------------------
Bob Eager                | University of Kent at Canterbury
                         | +44 227 764000 ext 7589
-------------------------+-------------------------------------------------