mholtz@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Mark A. Holtz) (04/16/91)
I was in a local software store last week, and was looking around,
and noticed that some software packages, (most notable "PageMaker
4" and (I think) "Corel Draw") said on the box "NOT FOR EXPORT -
For US and Canada Only". I realize why PC Tools Deluxe and PKZip
are not allowed to be exported - It's due to encryption by DES
standards. But, why Pagemaker?
--
Wish list of items: /\ UUCP: ames att!pacbell! \
* Unix Box with Hard Drive \/ pyramid sun!pacbell! -=> sactoh0!mholtz
* 9600 Baud V.32/V.42 Modem /\ ucbvax!csusac! /
* A much-needed vacation \/ INTERNET: mholtz@sactoh0.SAC.CA.USgettys@yacht.enet.dec.com (Bob Gettys) (04/17/91)
I'm not totally sure, but I suspect that it would be the compression programs that many of these packages use for distribution. Mnay of them use things like (or actually) PKzip/PKunzip to save on floppies. /s/ Bob Gettys
cctr132@csc.canterbury.ac.nz (Nick FitzGerald, CSC, Uni. of Canterbury, NZ) (04/17/91)
In article <1991Apr17.211013.5@lincoln.ac.nz>, english@lincoln.ac.nz writes: > In article <1991Apr16.042431.10997@sactoh0.sac.ca.us>, mholtz@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Mark A. Holtz) writes: >> I was in a local software store last week, and was looking around, >> and noticed that some software packages, (most notable "PageMaker >> 4" and (I think) "Corel Draw") said on the box "NOT FOR EXPORT - >> For US and Canada Only". I realize why PC Tools Deluxe and PKZip >> are not allowed to be exported - It's due to encryption by DES >> standards. But, why Pagemaker? >> -- > > is simply commercial reasons, pagemaker will have a reseller/distributor > in other parts of the world, who have been given the entire market and > protected from people buying directly from the states. miscrsoft do this > also, as a result we pay twice the price for our microsoft products in > this part of the world. > > can assure you it's not because of the compression routines, have > bought packages locally which use these compression routines. As I understand it the "full" version of PKZIP is not for export from the US because of the _encryption_ but I'm not sure that it's DES. If it is DES this is a lousy reason to prevent us from legally obtaining this software. If you bought, borrowed or stole the Nov 90 DDJ you got source code for DES en/de-cryption, and I certainly didn't hear of any attempt by US authorities to to prevent that from going off-shore. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Nick FitzGerald, PC Applications Consultant, CSC, Uni of Canterbury, N.Z. Internet: n.fitzgerald@csc.canterbury.ac.nz Phone: (64)(3) 642-337
kaleb@thyme.jpl.nasa.gov (Kaleb Keithley) (04/17/91)
In article cctr132@csc.canterbury.ac.nz (Nick FitzGerald) writes: >In article english@lincoln.ac.nz writes: >> In article mholtz@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Mark A. Holtz) writes: >>> I was in a local software store last week, and was looking around, >>> and noticed that some software packages, (most notable "PageMaker >>> 4" and (I think) "Corel Draw") said on the box "NOT FOR EXPORT - >>> For US and Canada Only". I realize why PC Tools Deluxe and PKZip >>> are not allowed to be exported - It's due to encryption by DES >>> standards. But, why Pagemaker? >> >> is simply commercial reasons, pagemaker will have a reseller/distributor >> in other parts of the world, who have been given the entire market and >> protected from people buying directly from the states. miscrsoft do this >> also, as a result we pay twice the price for our microsoft products in >> this part of the world. >> >> can assure you it's not because of the compression routines, have >> bought packages locally which use these compression routines. > >As I understand it the "full" version of PKZIP is not for export from the >US because of the _encryption_ but I'm not sure that it's DES. If it is >DES this is a lousy reason to prevent us from legally obtaining this >software. It's not DES encryption. english@lincoln.ac.nz was closest. When you buy a product like CorelDraw, part of what you are paying for is some amount of customer support. When you buy it in the U.S. you are paying for that customer support in the U.S. When you buy it in NZ, you are paying for that support in NZ. Try calling the U.S. support number and telling them you're calling from NZ. You may pay more for a M'soft product in NZ because there is a much smaller customer base than in the U.S. to pay for customer support. Economies of scale comes to mind. I don't know of a single vendor who, with a valid VISA or Mastercard number, wouldn't happily ship to Oz, NZ, or even Europe, (hell, I'd do it if I were in that business) just don't expect your local customer support to be very friendly about helping you if you run into problems. As for a "full" version of PKZIP versus any other version, I don't doubt the existance of one or the other, but, what stops anyone, anywhere in the world, from ftp'ing into a U.S. archive and getting this alleged "full" version? There's no filters on the phone lines that can tell the difference between PKZIP and any other file. :-) -- Kaleb Keithley kaleb@thyme.jpl.nasa.gov Meep Meep Roadrunner Veep veep Quayle
english@lincoln.ac.nz (04/18/91)
In article <1991Apr16.042431.10997@sactoh0.sac.ca.us>, mholtz@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Mark A. Holtz) writes: > I was in a local software store last week, and was looking around, > and noticed that some software packages, (most notable "PageMaker > 4" and (I think) "Corel Draw") said on the box "NOT FOR EXPORT - > For US and Canada Only". I realize why PC Tools Deluxe and PKZip > are not allowed to be exported - It's due to encryption by DES > standards. But, why Pagemaker? > -- is simply commercial reasons, pagemaker will have a reseller/distributor in other parts of the world, who have been given the entire market and protected from people buying directly from the states. miscrsoft do this also, as a result we pay twice the price for our microsoft products in this part of the world. can assure you it's not because of the compression routines, have bought packages locally which use these compression routines. grant english english@lincoln.ac.nz would you confirm or deny?
david@kessner.denver.co.us (David Kessner) (04/18/91)
In article <1991Apr17.211013.5@lincoln.ac.nz> english@lincoln.ac.nz writes: >is simply commercial reasons, pagemaker will have a reseller/distributor >in other parts of the world, who have been given the entire market and >protected from people buying directly from the states. miscrsoft do this >also, as a result we pay twice the price for our microsoft products in >this part of the world. > >can assure you it's not because of the compression routines, have >bought packages locally which use these compression routines. > >grant english >english@lincoln.ac.nz > >would you confirm or deny? For the most part, your right. However, there are some programs that use algorithms that are not for export. For instance, PKZIP uses an ENCRYPTION algorithm that cannot be exported, the 'non-USA' version does not have this feature. While there is no doubt that 'commercial reasons' do play a major role, there is really no way to know what the 'real' reasons are. For instance, Flight Simulator has the 'not for export' label (at least I think it did). It could be because of distrtibution (it is, after all, a game), but it also contains 'technology' that could easily be put into 'military' purposes. So, who's to say? There are obviously two (or more) reasons why a product may not be exported... -- David Kessner - david@kessner.denver.co.us | do { 1135 Fairfax, Denver CO 80220 (303) 377-1801 (p.m.) | . . . If you cant flame MS-DOS, who can you flame? | } while( jones);
jm9t+@andrew.cmu.edu (Josh Brian Mastronarde) (04/18/91)
Excerpts From Captions of netnews.comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc: 17-Apr-91 Re: Not for Export? Kaleb Keithley@thyme.jpl (2599) >As for a "full" version of PKZIP versus any other version, I don't doubt >the existance of one or the other, but, what stops anyone, anywhere in >the world, from ftp'ing into a U.S. archive and getting this alleged >"full" version? There's no filters on the phone lines that can tell >the difference between PKZIP and any other file. :-) Actually, I believe that many archives, at least SIMTEL, only have the non-encryption version for the very reason that they are accessible from outside the US. I remember reading this in some official documentation--either PKZIP or SIMTEL, I don't remember. Of course, the whole idea is stupid--it's not like foreign intelligence is going to find out anything new from analyzing PKZIP, but that's the law. -Josh Mastronarde -jm9t+@andrew.cmu.edu