doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edu (Dave Doerschuk) (07/31/90)
I am looking to buy a Hewlett Packard Laserjet printer, either the
II/D or the III. I am concerned about the compatibility of these
two printers with the Laserjet II. Since both the II/D and the
III are new, they don't appear on the setup menus of most of my
software. I'd like to know:
1. Are the II/D and the III totally software compatible with the II?
2. Is the output of the III (as enhanced by some special hardware
that HP installed before the rasterizer) noticably better than
the output of the II, and does the II/D have this feature?
3. Could someone define the difference between the II and the III?
I'm really having a hard time cutting thru the hype and getting
the real story on this one.
4. Why is the II/D so much more expensive than the III? There must
be some benefit here that I'm missing; it was described to me
as an 8ppm laserjet laser printer.
5. As I understand it, the cartridge connector on the III is different
from that of the II, but the II/D is the same as the II. Is this
correct? Does anyone know of a benefit to the new cartridge
connector in the III? It cannot accept cartridges made for the II,
right?
6. I'd sure like to have opinions here. I'm going to buy one of them,
and remarks from people who have used them would be much appreciated.
Also, comments about where you purchased yours and whether you were
happy with the dealer would be great.
Thank you very much for your time! I will be summarizing to the net, so
feel free to email if you like. BTW, least I besmirch their name, I'd
like to mention that I am a big fan of HP and have used their products
happily for years. I'm just a bit confused as to what to buy!
Thank you again.
Dave Doerschuk
doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edupetrilli@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Chris Petrilli) (07/31/90)
I didn't want to include the entire message, so here is my experiences with
the HP LaserJet II and III.
First, teh differences between each:
LaserJet II - 512K RAM, with 68000 based imaging system. Limited to
bitmapped fonts, and bitmapped images, and what could be described
using HP PCL4, which is limited. A nice replacement for a daisywheel
but nothing compared to PostScript.
LaserJet IIP - 512K version with 4PPM capability, not really in my mind
worth the cost, especially when you can get IIs for $1690...
LaserJey IID - DOUBLE SIDED LaserJet II, with 640K of RAM as I recall. It
requires software support for double sided in reality, but as I recall
can do it by itself also.
LaserJet III - (this is what I have now) 1Mb RAM and a 68000 (at 10MHz
as I recall). It uses PCL5 which can interpret font outlines (and
includes 4) and basically handle text with the best of the PostScirpt
printers. THe image enhancement is comparable to what LaserMaster does
in that it varies the dot size and gets an effective resolution of
600x300 (a little higher I think). This is well worth the cost in
my opinion, and is one of the best buys on the market, I think.
+ Chris Petrilli "Opinons represented here
| University of Texas at Austin do not necessarily
| INTERNET: petrilli@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu represent those of a sane
| SNAILMAIL: 429 Brady Lane, Austin, Texas, 78746 person. Take them as
+ PHONE: +1 512 327 0986 simply that."cncst@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Christophe N. Christoff) (08/01/90)
From what I understood, PCL4 and PCL5 is not compatible, especially in bitmapped graphics mode. (My information might be wrong, since I cannot test HP III's, I do not have access to it) Here is an interesting phenonema for HP fans: I wrote a program to print document with HP II's. The document basically contains a mixture of ASCII letter and bitmapped graphics inoformation. for example, you dynamically define ASCII "A" stands for a flag, "B" for a dog, .... and then a paragram of such combination for reader to reserve overyone. In other word, the document is really messed up with ASCII and graphics information. The phenomena: Using standard line spacing (6 lines/inch), after printing about 20 lines, HP II's give memory problem and halt, so I have to reset. Using 4 lines/inch, I can print very lengthy document (say 20 pages) without any trouble. That is 40 lines per page! Even I have a document which is only 30 lines long, the above phenomena still exists. What goes wrong? I do not think it is a memory problem even though it indicates so. The above number might not be exact, but the problem is well illustrated. Does HP II's has something to limit number of graphics per unit area? Any hint/help/advice is appreciated.
marshall@wind55.seri.gov (Marshall L. Buhl) (08/01/90)
doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edu (Dave Doerschuk) writes: >I am looking to buy a Hewlett Packard Laserjet printer, either the >II/D or the III. I am concerned about the compatibility of these >two printers with the Laserjet II. Since both the II/D and the >III are new, they don't appear on the setup menus of most of my >software. I'd like to know: >1. Are the II/D and the III totally software compatible with the II? We have both LJ II's and a new LJ III. Some of my users have been using the LJ III with their LJ II drivers. The only problem I've seen was in using Golden Software's "Grapher". One user had an old version and it wouldn't print vertical bars "|". My newer version of Grapher worked fine. We have used it for word processing too and no one has complained. The LJ II/D is essentially a LJ II that prints on both sides of the paper. >2. Is the output of the III (as enhanced by some special hardware > that HP installed before the rasterizer) noticably better than > the output of the II, and does the II/D have this feature? I only did one quick test of a graphics image (2-D plot) and couldn't tell the difference. The II/D does not have the Resolution Enhancement feature. >3. Could someone define the difference between the II and the III? > I'm really having a hard time cutting thru the hype and getting > the real story on this one. Resolution Enhancement and more built-in fonts. The III has Times and Helvetica Clones built-in, so I don't have to download fonts anymore. 8-) I've only used it with WinWord and it appears that the fonts sizes available in it are 6,8,10,11,12,14,18,24,30,36,48, which ain't too shabby. I don't know if one gets different sizes with other software. It can also rotate and scale fonts. If you have a portrait font cartridge, you can print landscape at the cost of slightly reduced speed. >4. Why is the II/D so much more expensive than the III? There must > be some benefit here that I'm missing; it was described to me > as an 8ppm laserjet laser printer. It prints on both sides of the page. >5. As I understand it, the cartridge connector on the III is different > from that of the II, but the II/D is the same as the II. Is this > correct? Does anyone know of a benefit to the new cartridge > connector in the III? It cannot accept cartridges made for the II, > right? Being uncertain which cartridge you mean, I'll say that I believe both the toner cartridge and fonts cartridges are the same. >6. I'd sure like to have opinions here. I'm going to buy one of them, > and remarks from people who have used them would be much appreciated. > Also, comments about where you purchased yours and whether you were > happy with the dealer would be great. I think the built-in Times and Helvetica clones make it worth it. It's cheaper that the LJ II too. I've only been using it for a week though. I got mine from Random Access. I've been working with them for several years now. They're one of my regular PC vendors. I paid $1602 for it. >Thank you very much for your time! I will be summarizing to the net, so >feel free to email if you like. BTW, least I besmirch their name, I'd >like to mention that I am a big fan of HP and have used their products >happily for years. I'm just a bit confused as to what to buy! Get the LJ III. Fer sure man. >Thank you again. You're welcome. -- Marshall L. Buhl, Jr. EMAIL: marshall@seri.gov Senior Computer Missionary VOICE: (303)231-1014 Wind Research Branch 1617 Cole Blvd., Golden, CO 80401-3393 Solar Energy Research Institute Solar - safe energy for a healthy future
price@glacier.unl.edu (Chad Price) (08/01/90)
In <3964@rex.cs.tulane.edu> doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edu (Dave Doerschuk) writes: >I am looking to buy a Hewlett Packard Laserjet printer, either the >II/D or the III. I am concerned about the compatibility of these >two printers with the Laserjet II. Since both the II/D and the >III are new, they don't appear on the setup menus of most of my >software. I'd like to know: PLease note that most of your questions are answered in the HP advertising literature. The IID is not a new release - it has been out at least a couple of years. >1. Are the II/D and the III totally software compatible with the II? The soft fonts are compatable. THere are other differences such as the number of fonts which can be loaded at once, the number allowable per page, etc. >2. Is the output of the III (as enhanced by some special hardware > that HP installed before the rasterizer) noticably better than > the output of the II, and does the II/D have this feature? My wife has a III in her lab. I have a IIP. I can't see a whole lot of difference in the text we use. There are more likely to be visible differences in graphics output. >3. Could someone define the difference between the II and the III? > I'm really having a hard time cutting thru the hype and getting > the real story on this one. THe III is newer, has more convenience features & cheaper. The III has scalable fonts built in so that for most normal purposes, soft fonts are not needed. >4. Why is the II/D so much more expensive than the III? There must > be some benefit here that I'm missing; it was described to me > as an 8ppm laserjet laser printer. The IID is "heavy duty" - it has a higher MTBF rating, it has larger paper trays, it prints on both sides of the page if you tell it to. THere are other differences also. >5. As I understand it, the cartridge connector on the III is different > from that of the II, but the II/D is the same as the II. Is this > correct? Does anyone know of a benefit to the new cartridge > connector in the III? It cannot accept cartridges made for the II, > right? A partial answer is that font cartridges (to the best of my knowlege) are interchangable amoung all of the series II printers and with the III. >6. I'd sure like to have opinions here. I'm going to buy one of them, > and remarks from people who have used them would be much appreciated. > Also, comments about where you purchased yours and whether you were > happy with the dealer would be great. We all have opinions, some are more or less valid. The validity of mine are limited by the fact that I have used lots of the original LaserJet, a few Plusses, no LJ500s, 2 IIPs, 1 III, and 1 IID (once). I would buy a III except for a situation where exceptionally heavy use will occur. It has more features, it is cheaper, and extra memory is available 3rd party cheaply. I would purchase mail order from the cheapest place that looks like it will actually deliver the goods. HP stands behind their products >100%. Most HP dealers locally will be able to fix whatever goes wrong. I have never seen an HP LJ printer die during the warrenty period (Yes, I know about the power supplies on the IIP, but HP Fed-X'd a new one to me at no cost to me & mine did not fail). IMO, steer clear of Businessland. The local shop was very uncooperative about the IIP power supply replacement, and from what I gathered, HP had lots of complaints about Businessland with regards to the IIP power supply replacement program. I had a problem with my IIP (I thought), and the HP engineer who designed the I/O for the IIP got involved and helped me solve the problem (which was reversely polarized, ungrounded outlets) . I will post more on this in the Laser Printers group in a day or so. Final conclusion - you can't go wrong with HP Laser Printers. IMHO the III is the best of the lot for general use. Chad Price price@fergvax.unl.edu >Thank you very much for your time! I will be summarizing to the net, so >feel free to email if you like. BTW, least I besmirch their name, I'd >like to mention that I am a big fan of HP and have used their products >happily for years. I'm just a bit confused as to what to buy! >Thank you again. >Dave Doerschuk >doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edu
ttw@lambda.UUCP (Tony Warnock) (08/02/90)
The Laserjet III has Courier at 10cps and 12 cps built in
as bit-mapped fonts. It also has a line-printer bit-mapped
font. It also has two built-in scalable fonts from Compugraphics:
CG Times and Univers. CG Times is similar to Times Roman and
Univers is a family of its own (the French think Unives is
great, many magazines are printed in Univers; it is NOT
a clone of Helvetica.)
The scalable fonts work from 1 point to 999.75 points in .25 point
increments. I do not know what programs support this printer.
Wordperfect 5.0 (and 5.1, I presume) give you the full range
of scaling of both CG Times and Univers. MS Word 5.0 gives
1 point to 125 point in 1 point increments. (A 777 point I
is real big, I found out. )
The Laserjet III will rotate images, not just its own fonts, to
portrait or landscape. It has no limitations on the number of
fonts downloaded except memory. The image enhancement seems to
be done after other processing. I can see real differences in
large (18+ Point) printing.
I don't know much else. I would like to know if there are any
PD or shareware scalable fonts for the Laserjet III.rick@wet.UUCP (Rick Rutledge) (08/04/90)
In article <3964@rex.cs.tulane.edu> doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edu (Dave Doerschuk) writes: >I am looking to buy a Hewlett Packard Laserjet printer, either the >II/D or the III. I am concerned about the compatibility of these >two printers with the Laserjet II. Since both the II/D and the >III are new, they don't appear on the setup menus of most of my >software. I'd like to know: > >1. Are the II/D and the III totally software compatible with the II? No. However, the only problem I've encountered to date was with Lotus 1-2-3. (Printgraph, actually.) Given Lotus' history of compatibility (problems) in early versions, I'm not surprised. Lotus printgraph will not print on a HP LJIII, neither in medium nor in high-density modes. If you have 2.2, you can paste the graph (.PIC) into an ALLWAYS spreadsheet, and that will work fine. The IID is not that new. It's been out a couple of years. Marvelous printer. Not any problems that I know of, but I've not tried this PrintGraph problem there, as we don't have a IID at my current location. >2. Is the output of the III (as enhanced by some special hardware > that HP installed before the rasterizer) noticably better than > the output of the II, and does the II/D have this feature? I've never taken a loupe to it, but it's very nice. Not PostScript, but very nice. (Of course, you can get PS for it now, for only a few hundred bucks. You can get Appletalk, too, so with RAM expansion, you can put together a "LaserWriter Clone" for about 3-4,000 less than an Apple.) >3. Could someone define the difference between the II and the III? > I'm really having a hard time cutting thru the hype and getting > the real story on this one. The II has two built in type faces (3 fonts in two orientations). Courier and Courier Bold, and Line Printer, in both portrait and landscape. The III has these, and CG Times (like Times Roman) and Univers (like Helvetica), and they are scalable. It also has 2 sizes of courier (10 cpi like the II, and 12 cpi). These, of course, are relatively useless if you don't yet have software to exploit the scalability. Only two apps I've seen/used which support the III at this time are WordPerfect 5.x and Windows. (If you have WP5.0,5.1, or WIN286, WIN386 already, contact WP or Miscrosoft for new drivers. Both offer them free, I believe.) The III also has 1M RAM standard, as opposed to the 512K on the II. >4. Why is the II/D so much more expensive than the III? There must > be some benefit here that I'm missing; it was described to me > as an 8ppm laserjet laser printer. Yes, but it has two paper trays, and can print on both sides of the page. It also has more built-in typefaces, and I believe 1M of RAM, rather than the standard 512K on the II. This ability to print on both sides of the page is known as duplexing. You can force it manually for programs which don't inherently support it, and, again, the only two apps I've seen which support it explicity are Windows (and its subjugate apps) and WP. >5. As I understand it, the cartridge connector on the III is different > from that of the II, but the II/D is the same as the II. Is this > correct? Does anyone know of a benefit to the new cartridge > connector in the III? It cannot accept cartridges made for the II, > right? Righto. I think HP has just decided to make more use of what the printer can do, and has demonstrated this with their PS cartridge for the III. (Other vendors do have PS for the II and IID, by the way, Pacific Data, for instance.) >6. I'd sure like to have opinions here. I'm going to buy one of them, > and remarks from people who have used them would be much appreciated. > Also, comments about where you purchased yours and whether you were > happy with the dealer would be great. HP is great stuff. Reliable, rugged, good support. I've no complaints. I think you'll find most everybody is charging the same thing for the II and III models, the IID will vary. (III is currentlly $1595 everywhere I've called or seen.) Since HP is so solid, where you buy it doesn't really matter; HP stands behind it, so you can buy it wherever it's cheapest. -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Rick Rutledge {hoptoad|ucsfcca|claris}!wet!rick rick@wet.UUCP "Voici le secret." dit le renard. "On ne voit bien qu'avec le coeur. L'essentiel est invisible aux yeux." -Antoine de St. Exupery, _le Petit Prince_