ldstern@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Larry Stern) (05/24/91)
To: quimby@madoka.its.rpi.edu In article <rfgh47.@rpi.edu> you write: >>> Does anyone have a definitive answer to the question of whether it's >>> best to turn your computer off when not using, or leave it on ... in >>> terms of equipment longevity? > >> ...text deleted... > >There's nothing wrong with leaving computers running all the time. It's >standard procedure at many installations. There's also nothing wrong >with turning the things off at night, unless you happen to have a Seagate >drive in it. Please turn the monitors off overnight, though. Sometimes >they catch fire. > >Quimby > >-- >quimby@mts.rpi.edu, quimby@rpitsmts.bitnet > I also apologize for bringing back this somewhat tired thread, but I do have a question for the above poster. What is the problem with Seagate drives that warrants keeping them, in particular, on all night? -- Larry Stern LDSTERN@RODAN.ACS.SYR.EDU
ins845b@monu4.cc.monash.edu.au (mr k.l. lentin) (05/25/91)
In article <1991May24.160414.3552@rodan.acs.syr.edu> ldstern@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Larry Stern) writes: >I also apologize for bringing back this somewhat tired thread, but I do have a >question for the above poster. What is the problem with Seagate drives that >warrants keeping them, in particular, on all night? I am not the poster you refer to but I am the one who started this seagate stuff. The problem turns up in the ST251 and ST250R and 2 others. Its apparently called STICTION (like friction but worse :-) and its simply that when you turn the drive oiff and leave it for more than a few minutes, it won't start up again. The solution is to shake the drive in a flat circular motion - thus causing the platters to rotate to jar them loose. Bumbing them around sometimes fixes them The solution: leave it on (it takes me 20 minutes to disassemble my machine to get the driveout, get it going and rebuild the computer. I sent it to get repaird and $280 later its the same! The repairers never detect the poblem 'cos they move the drive around too much and try it too often! So far the only suggestion to fix this involved opening the drive and oiling the surfaces of the p[latters. (I shall say no more :-) |/ |\evin
deg@hq.demos.su (Vladimir U. Degtyarev) (06/10/91)
In <1991May25.150948.542@monu0.cc.monash.edu.au> ins845b@monu4.cc.monash.edu.au (mr k.l. lentin) writes: >In article <1991May24.160414.3552@rodan.acs.syr.edu> ldstern@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Larry Stern) writes: >>I also apologize for bringing back this somewhat tired thread, but I do have a >>question for the above poster. What is the problem with Seagate drives that >>warrants keeping them, in particular, on all night? >I am not the poster you refer to but I am the one who started this seagate >stuff. The problem turns up in the ST251 and ST250R and 2 others. Its >apparently called STICTION (like friction but worse :-) and its simply that >when you turn the drive oiff and leave it for more than a few minutes, it >won't start up again. The solution is to shake the drive in a flat circular >motion - thus causing the platters to rotate to jar them loose. Bumbing them >around sometimes fixes them The solution: leave it on (it takes me 20 minutes >to disassemble my machine to get the driveout, get it going and rebuild the >computer. I sent it to get repaird and $280 later its the same! The repairers >never detect the poblem 'cos they move the drive around too much and try it >too often! So far the only suggestion to fix this involved opening the drive >and oiling the surfaces of the p[latters. (I shall say no more :-) Kelvin (mr. k.l. lentin) you (and others) will owe next $280 to me, for I'm familiar with the ST25X problem a.r.. The STICTION problem has (excuse me, Kelvin) nothing to do with FRICTION. In fact, driver's heads STICK for some unknown to me reason. One can clearly observe the phenomenon during the POST - normaly, when BIOS initializes the drive, the drive's LED flashes and sound like Tuk-tuk-tuk can be heard. When the STICTION occured, the LED flashes OK, but that's all - heads STUCK. Later on, a pleasant message goes up on the screen: 'Error initialize Drive 0(1) ' - depends on BIOS manufacturer. The solution is as simple as that: get the drive out so, that you can reach heads axle (it's in the nearest right corner of the drive - face to you, belly down). Use a screwdriver to turn the axle 1 or 2' clock and conterclockwise. Be careful not to turn it more- you can spoil the track nearest to the parkin' one. It's 100% fixup for ST25X - I fixed tens of them. ST25X are very popular here in the Soviet U. And one more thing. Maybe I'm late, but Larry, for God sake DON'T YOU EVER OPEN THE COVER. To say nothing about oiling the main axle. Sorry guys for being late - was out. Vladimir
caf@omen.COM (Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX) (06/10/91)
In article <1991Jun9.195502.18858@hq.demos.su> deg@hq.demos.su (Vladimir U. Degtyarev) writes:
-manufacturer. The solution is as simple as that: get the drive out so, that
-you can reach heads axle (it's in the nearest right corner of the drive -
-face to you, belly down). Use a screwdriver to turn the axle 1 or 2' clock
-and conterclockwise. Be careful not to turn it more- you can spoil the
-track nearest to the parkin' one. It's 100% fixup for ST25X - I fixed tens of
-them. ST25X are very popular here in the Soviet U.
It's also a not so subtle warning to get another drive (not
Seagate!!) and transfer your data to it. On my 4051 the
stiction got worse and worse until one fine day...
P.S.: If Seagate doesn't like to read this sort of thing, they
can send me an drive to replace the dead 4051. Frankly I don't
expect Seagate to stand behind 4051's any more than IBM stood
behind that infernal 20 MB disk drive on the PC/AT.
--
Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX ...!tektronix!reed!omen!caf
Author of YMODEM, ZMODEM, Professional-YAM, ZCOMM, and DSZ
Omen Technology Inc "The High Reliability Software"
17505-V NW Sauvie IS RD Portland OR 97231 503-621-3406larryd@milton.u.washington.edu (Larry Desoto) (06/11/91)
We had a number of Seagate ST-25X drives in our lab at U of Washington. Most of them eventually wound up hanging on the end of their cables because they would not spin up after being shutdown. I tried to call Seagate technical help on several occasions but the calls were never returned. I don't know if they fixed the problem as I have not purchased a Seagate drive since. I don't plan to purchase one in the future and I try to dissuade anyone from purchasing the ST-25X series. I agree if Seagate doesn't like to read this that's just too bad. I wasn`t really mad about it until they refused to call back... ----------- Larry DeSoto Standard disclamers
quimby@madoka.its.rpi.edu (Quimby Pipple) (06/11/91)
caf@omen.COM (Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX) writes: >It's also a not so subtle warning to get another drive (not >Seagate!!) and transfer your data to it. On my 4051 the >stiction got worse and worse until one fine day... Replacing the drive is only required in a situation where the users aren't flexible enough to just leave the machines on. Typical ST-251's last about three years with daily cycling, then they begin to stick. They seem to last for a very long time afterword when used in near continous operation -- a total life of ten years certainly wouldn't surprise me. (One plus for the Seagates is that the autopark versions very rarely crash, unlike some other drives.) >P.S.: If Seagate doesn't like to read this sort of thing, they >can send me an drive to replace the dead 4051. Frankly I don't >expect Seagate to stand behind 4051's any more than IBM stood >behind that infernal 20 MB disk drive on the PC/AT. At least from what I understand, IBM replaced some of those drives when the users started screaming. They also probably didn't order too many more drives from that manufacturer (can't remember the name). Seagate, on the other hand, hasn't even admitted the possibility that there was/is a tremendous reliability problem with their drives. Why should anyone believe that their newer drives are any better, even if they are? Quimby -- quimby@mts.rpi.edu, quimby@rpitsmts.bitnet