[comp.os.msdos.programmer] Timo Salmi's obnoxious postings

ts@uwasa.fi (Timo Salmi) (04/15/91)

> From: davidjl@eecs.ee.pdx.edu (David J Leitko)
> Subject: RE:  Distribution of BGI files...
> To: ts@uwasa.fi
> Date: Sun, 14 Apr 91 14:41:06 PDT
> 
> I've gotten used to your rude, obnoxious responses to novice questions in
> comp.binaries.ibm.pc.d, etc.  As matter of fact, I am surprised when I don't
> see you respond to a novice question with some condescending remark.  Why
> don't you try to give these guys a little respect?  Remember, you were a
> novice once.  And to distribute mis-information simply adds injury to insult.
> 
> I've also seen you put more effort into finding one of your programs that 
> demonstrates how to do something so they can "ftp it from garbo" than it
> would have taken to type in the whole three line program.  What a waste! 
> Especially when you are continuously trying to discourage people from abusing
> the trans-Atlantic links to Europe.
> 
> Now don't get me wrong, I'm not urging you to _stop_ responding to these
> people, because you have been known to provide useful information.  And
> I know how it feels to post an intelligent question and get _no_ reply.
> What I am suggesting is that you re-evaluate the attitude you portray in
> your responses to FAQs and novice questions.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> David Leitko
> 
> -- 
>   David J Leitko                 "Bleah!..."         davidjl@eecs.cs.pdx.edu
>   Computer Science Department             ..!uunet!tektronix!pdxgate!davidjl
>   Portland State University
>   Portland, Oregon                      This space intentionally left blank.

I'll answer these accusations also publicly since according to your
message I keep insulting users of comp.binaries.ibm.pc.d (etc) with
rude, obnoxious messages.  Be this as may, all feedback is naturally
very welcome, also critical, and I appreciate the effort you have
put into writing your feedback.  I am also pleased to hear that you
yet consider some of my work to have been known to be useful. 

As we recall from comp.binaries.ibm.pc.d moderator's (Bill Davidsen)
comments, one of the problems of c.b.i.p.d. (and the other groups) is
the drifting of the subjects of the messages.  One of the
problematic growing categories has been the "whereis" postings. 
There is a difficult borderline here.  In many cases the user would
easily find the answer, if s/he cared to look at the readily
available file lists.  On the other hand there are also many cases
where the need of help is genuine, and then of course we should try
to help.  But it is often difficult to know with the scant
background information given. 

Perhaps it is no real excuse, but I have also put in an innumerable
number of hours to try to gather and anticipate questions whose
answers would be of use to users, and help them (and me) to better
find our way around in the net and ftp sites, and get best value out
of them.  I take that you find annoying my frequent references to
this readily available material. 

I take the liberty of inferring that you especially object to my
method of answering questions with pointers to where the answers are
rather than giving the direct answers.  There are reasons for this
method.  It is more generic.  It means that the same answers
probably do not have to be repeated so often.  Whether this method
takes more or less text than giving the actual, full answer is not
the real issue.  This is only my opinion, and many users may
disagree, but I think that it is more productive in the long run to
help people to know how to easily find answers to their questions
rather than simply feed all the answers.  Of course, there must be a
balance in this.  And one further obvious point.  Giving pointers to
answers is much easier than writing the whole answer.  A pointer to
answers, and the prerecorded answers are much less prone to errors
than an answer written on the fly.  The same naturally goes for
pointing to file lists instead of trying to recall all the names of
the utilities by heart, or go searching for them at this end of
things. 

Moderating an ftp site is sometimes a thankless task, where one
occasionally just gets abuse from people who expect something for
nothing.  I've always been amazed by people's inclination to
complain about free services.  There is no monetary compensation for
me (nor am I looking for it) from file maintenance and distributing
the files, and if I often mention my own programming work (yes, I
do, I readily admit to that sin), that's the "price tag" that comes
with my imposed free services.  - There are, of course, also good
moments in moderating, usually thanks to a rather limited, and a
very dedicated brand of people who help in maitenance giving
information, write and/or upload programs that the rest of the
net have the opportunity to enjoy, in most cases for quite free. 

I recall when I started posting the download statistics from our
site to comp.binaries.ibm.pc.d (which I still think had a lot of
generic information value whether one uses our site or not) there
was an upproar, and I decided to limit to the distribution to the
users on my garbo-infolist mailing list only.  Also I shifted much
of my postings to be by email only, and at the same time to gather
the carbon copies of these emailed "posting" for general download
for those who might be interested.  I'll reconsider utilizing these
options still more heavily, and refrain more from public posting,
if my postings are considered this offensive. 

As a detail, might this debacle be yet another case for splitting
comp.binaries.ibm.pc.d just as Bill Davidsen has suggested.  Where
did that discussion vanish, anyway?

In any case, my collective apologies if I have been offending the
users of comp.binaries.ibm.pc.d, comp.os.msdos,programmer, and
comp.lang.pascal etc with my activities and postings.  That has
certainly not been my intention. 

...................................................................
Prof. Timo Salmi        
Moderating at garbo.uwasa.fi anonymous ftp archives 128.214.12.37
School of Business Studies, University of Vaasa, SF-65101, Finland
Internet: ts@chyde.uwasa.fi Funet: gado::salmi Bitnet: salmi@finfun