grh@cbnewsl.att.com (george.r.heuer) (11/08/90)
Greetings:
I recently purchased Harpoon for the Amiga and although I'm
very impressed with the capabilities, I'm having a terrible time
surviving for very long playing the NATO side in the second
scenario, the one where you try to escort the convoy. I never
detect the sub that blasts all my ships to pieces.
The tactics guide that came with the game is not terribly
helpful for getting beginners going. I've tried rearranging
the escorts and choppers throughout the formation, auto-aircover,
etc., but all have the same result (blub blub blub...). Anyone
out there had any success and can give some suggestions. I'm
starting to get frustrated and although Harpoon seems like a
great game, it may get put back in the box forever if things
like this keep happening to me.
Let's start a Harpoon-tactics thread in this newsgroup
so that we can all learn from each other's experiences with
this simulation.
Randy Heuer
att!cbnewsl!grhfelixh@sandstorm.Berkeley.EDU (Felix Hack) (11/09/90)
Here are some tactics that have helped me win at Harpoon. First, never use the formation editor to fly fixed-wing aircraft. Launch such aircraft as separate groups, loitering in the vicinity of where you think subs might be. Keep helos on their ships ready to take off as a separate group to prosecute any contacts detected by other units. I've found that ASW aircraft flying within the formation, no matter how you change the ranges and assign sectors, are pretty useless. I wouldn't even fly AEW aircraft in formation, better to fly them 100 miles or so ahead to detect the enemy sooner. When you make a sub contact, turn ship groups away from the contact and vector aircraft after it. If the sub is really far away (30+ miles) evasion probably isn't necessary, unless the sub carries type 65 torps, with a range of 54 (!!) miles. If you detect torpedoes, turn the formation away and go to maximum speed. Use the unit display window to get an exact idea of where the torps and ships are; the group display only shows you the theoretical center of the formation, and ships not in that center won't maneuver the way you think the should; they'll maneuver to keep station relative to the center. If you can pick out what ship is the target, go ahead and split it off from the main group, use the formation editor to place it in the center of its new formation (that really should be done automatically by the game, what a hassle), and order it to its max speed, away from the torps. It is important to increase the speed again because the main group's max speed is probably very slow due to merchants and the like. Soviet torps fired at long range are relatively slow (around 30 knots) so a warship can just outrun them. In the meantime keep the main group away from the torps, they might decide to attack a juicy merchant instead. In the second scenario (the one in the example) it is difficult to detect the sub before it shoots; it has type 65 torps and you dont' have multi-convergence zone towed arrays. In practice I dogleg the group to the northwest right at scenario start and don't get subjected to torpedo attack; this is by far the best way (after killing the sub outright) of defending against torpedoes. Some ideas with submarines: split them into separate groups, one per sub, and make sure they are at the center of their formations; that's the only way you can be sure that what you see on the group display corresponds to the real position of the subs. You can get really confused if you don't do this, as the starting groupings often have two subs in the ASW zone of a formation, with no sub in the center.
felixh@sandstorm.Berkeley.EDU (Felix Hack) (11/09/90)
I mentioned in a previous post that flying aircraft in patrols within
formations was a bad idea. Here are my reasons:
It's better to keep the ASW choppers in reserve for a contact
obtained by other means, I've never had them actually make
a contact first.
Fixed wing aircraft of all types should not be flown within formations
because you can't tell where they are, and can't tell them what to do.
They have to be in their own groups to do that. You don't know where
they are because as part of the formation the only thing displayed
on the group map is its center. An AEW aircraft flying 200 miles away
will not show up. Enemy fighters might be closing on it, and you couldn't
tell that it was threatened. Also bad is that you wouldn't
get a correct idea of your detection radius because the range circle
(corresponding to your best radar, say an AWACS) is again drawn about
the formation's center, not the real position of the aircraft.
This implies you should not use the auto-formation option to have the
'staff' fly aircraft over formations for you. If you've ever used this
you may have noticed 'phantom' aircraft flying around in the unit display
that you couldn't spot in the group window. This also applies to land
bases; you could fly aircraft within a formation around them, but don't
do it. Launch separate groups of aircraft and fly them around, or just
tell them to loiter over the base. You'll know what you have available
and where it is, and can immediately do things with them like ordering
them on an intercept or strike.manes@vger.nsu.edu (11/10/90)
In article <1990Nov8.144713.2547@cbnewsl.att.com>, grh@cbnewsl.att.com (george.r.heuer) writes: > Greetings: > > I recently purchased Harpoon for the Amiga and although I'm > very impressed with the capabilities, I'm having a terrible time > surviving for very long playing the NATO side in the second > scenario, the one where you try to escort the convoy. I never > detect the sub that blasts all my ships to pieces. > I actually killed the sub, but I did not follow the method that the manual describes. I outfitted a helicopter for LR Anti-sub, and placed it to the far left of the convoy group (using the Launch Aircraft, not the Formation Editor). Unfortunately it launched three fish and killed my remaining ships before I could get it killed. I played the same scenerio as the Russian. I absolutely wasted the NATO surface group with the fighters and the sub. I then took my gunboats and destroyed 83% of the port that the convey was going too! > Randy Heuer > att!cbnewsl!grh -mark= +--------+ ================================================== | \/ | Mark D. Manes "Mr. AmigaVision" | /\ \/ | manes@vger.nsu.edu | / | (804) 683-2532 "Make up your own mind! - AMIGA" +--------+ ==================================================
sysop@tlvx.UUCP (SysOp) (11/14/90)
In article <1990Nov8.144713.2547@cbnewsl.att.com>, grh@cbnewsl.att.com (george.r.heuer) writes: > Greetings: > > I recently purchased Harpoon for the Amiga and although I'm > very impressed with the capabilities, I'm having a terrible time > surviving for very long playing the NATO side in the second > scenario, the one where you try to escort the convoy. I never > detect the sub that blasts all my ships to pieces. It always seems to be a plane that does me in, or so it would appear. .... > out there had any success and can give some suggestions. I'm > starting to get frustrated and although Harpoon seems like a > great game, it may get put back in the box forever if things > like this keep happening to me. Well, don't do that! I died 4 times or so on that scenario before I finally beat it. And when I did, I beat it soundly. Note that the manual gives you a slight hint, saying that the way they were showing you was not necessarily the best way. So, do something different! *** SPOILER! *** playing hints below.... What I did was to edit my course, and go many miles out to sea, then north, and cut over only when very near the port. I nearly went around the whole enemy convoy. Another thing I do is when attacked by torpedo, I have my convoy move away from the general direction. One time I even split a ship from the convoy, so it could move out faster, since it was closest (I'm not sure how much that helped). Anyway, it does seem to help with the torpedos. In one scenario, I lost 3 helecopters, but the ships survived. One thing the helecopters did was to distract the enemy plane. The plane has a habit of launching missles which sink my ships. :-( Part of the fun has been in figuring out things, or merely discovering things. At first I was totally defeated over and over, but with a bit of work, I was able to win. And just to think, those were simple scenarios. :-| > > Let's start a Harpoon-tactics thread in this newsgroup > so that we can all learn from each other's experiences with > this simulation. > > Randy Heuer > att!cbnewsl!grh