philip@hubcap.clemson.edu (Philip L Harshman) (04/27/91)
We have a Mac IIci here that is tied into the campus Ethernet with an Ethertalk card. We are using one of the local Vax systems as a file server to provide extra storage. However, since you have to decide between Ethertalk and localtalk with the "Network" control panel, this precludes us from using our local LaserWriter. We tried hanging it off of our Vax and getting to it from the network. This has its problems: It can be unstable, the people that know how to fix the Vax side when it breaks are not always available, and it depends on the Vax being up before we can print from our Mac to the printer right beside it. We are looking for another solution. I have heard of a product called "Liaison" that will do the trick, but another user at our site is having great difficulty with it and doesn't recommend it. There is a box called "EtherPrint" (or something like that) that will allow us to hang the LaserWriter directly off of the Ethernet. I don't know anything about this other than what I read in a catalog. What is the consensus of the net? Are either of these products any good? Is there a third, better (hopefully cheaper) alternative? If I get any good replies, I'll post a summary. Thanks. -- Philip Harshman uucp: ... !gatech!hubcap!philip Employed by Clemson University inet: philip@hubcap.clemson.edu although they have no idea that bitnet: philip@clemson I'm doing this. (So don't tell!) phone: (803) 656-3697
weiss@watson.seas.ucla.edu (Michael Weiss) (04/27/91)
In article <1991Apr26.204034.27688@hubcap.clemson.edu> philip@hubcap.clemson.edu (Philip L Harshman) writes: >I have heard of a product called "Liaison" that will do the trick, but another >user at our site is having great difficulty with it and doesn't recommend it. >There is a box called "EtherPrint" (or something like that) that will allow >us to hang the LaserWriter directly off of the Ethernet. I don't know anything >about this other than what I read in a catalog. Both will work. Liaison is probably the cheapest way to do it, but it's not all that user friendly (as your site user has found out). Some claim that it slows down the computer, but I have never noticed any significant change in speed (but I also haven't run benchmarks on it under both...it's just my eyeballing). EtherPrint is a new device that uses an ingenious method to hook up an AppleTalk printer to Ethernet. You have to turn on the EtherPrint before the printer for this reason. See, when you turn on the printer, you need to be able to know what node number to assign. The printer randomly checks numbers until it finds one that nobody is using. Unfortunately, the EtherPrint has to do the same thing, and the two devices need to have the same number. So, how does this happen? EtherPrint finds a free number, and then on its connection to the LW it blacks out all numbers except that one that is assigned to the EtherPrint. That way, the LW gets the right number, and everything's happy. There's a problem, though. Let's say you've got these two devices hooked up and happily humming along. Suddenly, the power goes out. Five minutes later, it comes back on. Now the number-finding is going to happen on both devices simultaneously, with a great liklihood that they are not going to be the same. Suddenly, communications break down between the devices. I just figured you should know this for assessing the benifits of each approach. -- --- Michael Weiss | School of Engineering \ / weiss@watson.seas.ucla.edu | and Applied Science ----O---- izzydp5@oac.ucla.edu | UCLA YF " 22
gerry@eecs.cs.pdx.edu (Gerry Recktenwald) (04/27/91)
In article <1991Apr26.204034.27688@hubcap.clemson.edu> philip@hubcap.clemson.edu (Philip L Harshman) writes: >We have a Mac IIci here that is tied into the campus Ethernet with an Ethertalk >card. ... stuff deleted ... > However, since you have to decide between Ethertalk and >localtalk with the "Network" control panel, this precludes us from using our >local LaserWriter. ... rest of post deleted I have a Mac II with a 3Com Etherlink NB card connected to our building Ethernet. I also have an PhoneNet connector tying me and four other Mac II?'s to a Laserwriter NT. It's been months since I've opened the Control Panel to select a network and I can use both. This also works with a newly installed Mac IIsi (same Ethernet card; NuBus adapter; system 6.0.7) Our solution: Try printing to the Laserwriter anyway. Read manuals and follow instructions later. If the system can't find the Laserwriter use the Control Panel to select the Appletalk network, but *don't* switch back to the Ethernet. All our Ethernet communication is with NCSA Telnet, I have no idea how this works with other TCP/IP communication packages. gerry +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-... Gerry Recktenwald (503) 725-4296 Internet: gerry@me.pdx.edu UUCP:{ucbvax, uunet}!tektronix!pdxgate!cs.pdx.edu!gerry PSU Mechanical Engineering, P.O. Box 751, Portland, OR 97207
wishart@bnl.gov (Jim Wishart) (04/29/91)
In article <2491@pdxgate.UUCP> gerry@eecs.cs.pdx.edu (Gerry Recktenwald) writes: > In article <1991Apr26.204034.27688@hubcap.clemson.edu> philip@hubcap.clemson.edu (Philip L Harshman) writes: > >We have a Mac IIci here that is tied into the campus Ethernet with an Ethertalk > >card. ... stuff deleted ... > > However, since you have to decide between Ethertalk and > >localtalk with the "Network" control panel, this precludes us from using our > >local LaserWriter. ... rest of post deleted > > I have a Mac II with a 3Com Etherlink NB card connected to our building > Ethernet. I also have an PhoneNet connector tying me and four other Mac II?'s > to a Laserwriter NT. It's been months since I've opened the Control Panel > to select a network and I can use both. > > This also works with a newly installed Mac IIsi (same Ethernet card; NuBus > adapter; system 6.0.7) > > Our solution: Try printing to the Laserwriter anyway. Read manuals and > follow instructions later. If the system can't find the Laserwriter use > the Control Panel to select the Appletalk network, but *don't* switch back > to the Ethernet. All our Ethernet communication is with NCSA Telnet, I > have no idea how this works with other TCP/IP communication packages. > > gerry > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-... > Gerry Recktenwald (503) 725-4296 Internet: gerry@me.pdx.edu > UUCP:{ucbvax, uunet}!tektronix!pdxgate!cs.pdx.edu!gerry > PSU Mechanical Engineering, P.O. Box 751, Portland, OR 97207 This solution does not provide simultaneous access to Ethertalk and LocalTalk services, which I believe is Philip's question. I have used Liason (now v3.0) for this purpose for two years now without any problem. Jim Wishart wishart@bnl.gov Chemistry Department Brookhaven National Laboratory,Upton, NY 11973
klefstad@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Sue Klefstad) (04/30/91)
gerry@eecs.cs.pdx.edu (Gerry Recktenwald) writes: >In article <1991Apr26.204034.27688@hubcap.clemson.edu> philip@hubcap.clemson.edu (Philip L Harshman) writes: >>We have a Mac IIci here that is tied into the campus Ethernet with an Ethertalk >>card. ... stuff deleted ... >> However, since you have to decide between Ethertalk and >>localtalk with the "Network" control panel, this precludes us from using our >>local LaserWriter. ... rest of post deleted >.... All our Ethernet communication is with NCSA Telnet, I >have no idea how this works with other TCP/IP communication packages. MacTCP is a wonderfully independent beast. But if you have to work with EtherTalk (or one of its variants) and Localtalk, then you'll have to flip flop the network cdevs between one and the other. The EtherTalk network cdev has to be selected on startup, but after that the Built-in (localtalk) cdev can be selected. (Just remember to reselect the EtherTalk cdev before shutdown so that it is selected on the next startup.) -- - Sue Klefstad Ill. Natural History Survey klefstad@uiuc.edu
conrad@popvax.uucp (M20400@c.nobili) (04/30/91)
In article <2581@lee.SEAS.UCLA.EDU> weiss@watson.seas.ucla.edu (Michael Weiss) writes: >In article <1991Apr26.204034.27688@hubcap.clemson.edu> philip@hubcap.clemson.edu (Philip L Harshman) writes: >>I have heard of a product called "Liaison" that will do the trick, but another >>user at our site is having great difficulty with it and doesn't recommend it. > >Both will work. Liaison is probably the cheapest way to do it, but it's not >all that user friendly (as your site user has found out). Some claim that it >slows down the computer, but I have never noticed any significant change in >speed (but I also haven't run benchmarks on it under both...it's just my >eyeballing). Liaison is a really neat product. It is however one of those things that you have to RTFM for.... It has all sorts of neat capabilities, including dial-in access and some extra security. And it is really cheap for what it does. Have a look at any of the recent Ethernet/LocalTalk router comparisons too. Liaison regularly holds its own against a whole variety of $expensive$ hardware routers, including GatorBoxen. (I know that GBs do a whole bunch of other things, but Liaison's performance is very impressive....) I have a Liaison router set up on my SE/30 at work to provide me with dial-in access to all of the services of our AppleTalk network from home. I like the flexibility of being able to print to LocalTalk printers, access AppleShare volumes, network modems, and still be able to telnet, tn3270, HyperFTP, and read news directly from my Mac at home, all with one phone call. I have found that performance is reasonable on the machine at work even if there is a dial-in connection going through it. I can't vouch for performance under different circumstances. I only use it as a dial-up AppleTalk network bridge. I don't know if Ethernet/LocalTalk routing is less or more work.... Well, I hope this is of some help. Don't despair about someone not being able to set Liaison up. You may have better luck, especially after reading the man- ual. I have seen other people at our site with problems with Liaison, but upon examination it became clear that the people who had set things up didn't have the _faintest_ idea what they were doing! It is a neat but complex product. (I guess Retrospect is another good example of such a product -- you don't stand a chance of really understanding what it does or how to take advantage of it fully until you read the manual.) At any rate, Farallon's technical support people are really good in my experience, and should be able to help you out if you get into difficulty. I recommend Liaison. Check it out against your needs and bud- get.... +---- C o n r a d C . N o b i l i ----+ | | | Harvard University | Internet: conrad@harvarda.harvard.edu | | Office for Info. Tech. | conrad@popvax.harvard.edu | | Information Services | BITNET: CONRAD AT HARVARDA | | Technical & User Services | CONRAD AT HARVSPHB | | 1730 Cambridge Street | voice: (617) 495-8554 | +---- Cambridge, MA 02138 | fax: (617) 495-0715 ----+
joseph@elbereth.rutgers.edu (Seymour Joseph) (05/04/91)
Mike, My understanding of the nodeID search process is that when a device powers on, its first guess is always the node number it used the last time it was powered on. Only if that nodeID turns out to be already busy does it continue guessing others. So, unless the Etherprint box breaks the standard, once it and the Laserwriter are working together, they should continue to do so even if the power goes out and they power back on together. Seymour