cjones@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (06/07/90)
STRATEGIC CONQUEST I've recently started to play Strategic Conquest. I can win when playing up to level 8 and anything above level 10 blows me away. I've just recently started building a fighter for my first object in order to scout out the surrounding territory to make my army moves more efficient. My first ship build is a destroyer to do the same for overseas scouting. Then I finally start building transports. In the middle game (if there is such a thing) I start building battleships and bombers. I just quit out of a level 10 scenario that seemed to be pretty well stale- mated (why did I quit, frustration and the need to experiment with different initial builds). The bugger had three or four battleships, two carriers and lots of destroyers and a few misc subs. I started infringing on one of his islands and he kept using bombers to destroy the city I just overtook. Quite frustrating. So anyway. What strategies do others use when/if playing SC at higher levels? Thanks in Advance Tony -
ac08@vaxb.acs.unt.edu (06/07/90)
In article <1054300002@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>, cjones@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu writes: > STRATEGIC CONQUEST > > > I've recently started to play Strategic Conquest. I can win when playing > up to level 8 and anything above level 10 blows me away. > > I've just recently started building a fighter for my first object in order to > scout out the surrounding territory to make my army moves more efficient. My > first ship build is a destroyer to do the same for overseas scouting. Then > I finally start building transports. My standard opening: Army first and keep on building. When I get three cities, I make a coast city into a transport producer. Put four or five armies on the transport, then sail towards the "big" side of the map. Colonize, don't fight (if you can help it). Second transport goes the other way. Fifth city makes planes. Build battleships after turn 50 or so (but keep making armies and transports) > > In the middle game (if there is such a thing) I start building battleships > and bombers. I don't build bombers until after turn 100... a 1x1 nuke is a waste. > > I just quit out of a level 10 scenario that seemed to be pretty well stale- > mated (why did I quit, frustration and the need to experiment with different > initial builds). The bugger had three or four battleships, two carriers and > lots of destroyers and a few misc subs. I started infringing on one of his > islands and he kept using bombers to destroy the city I just overtook. > Quite frustrating. > The secret (or at least MY secret) to beating the SOB at high levels is to just flat outproduce him. BTW- don't stack armies. When he starts nuking you, if you have them in long parallel lines, he can't kill many at once. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXOXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX If he drops a 3x3 nuke at "O", the most he could kill would be 3 armies... not very cost-efficient. I NEVER leave armies in cities. The robot loves to nuke cities. Waste a turn or two, and retake the city with a reserve. > So anyway. What strategies do others use when/if playing SC at higher levels? > > Thanks in Advance > > Tony - This strategy generally lets me win 2/3 at level 15... C Irby ac08@vaxb.acs.unt.edu ac08@untvax
jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) (06/08/90)
In article <1054300002@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> cjones@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu writes: > >I've recently started to play Strategic Conquest. I can win when playing >up to level 8 and anything above level 10 blows me away. This isn't bragging (there are obviously SC players much better than me), I just want to establish my ability level: I always win at 12, have roughly 50-50 success at 13, a little worse at 14, and usually (although not always) lose at 15. >I've just recently started building a fighter for my first object in order to I do the same, all the way to 15 (but it sometimes works to gamble by building an army first, especially if you luck onto a small island where the other cities are _real_ close and quick to find. Like I said, though, that's all a matter of luck). >first ship build is a destroyer to do the same for overseas scouting. Then >I finally start building transports. I don't. If I have more than 4 cities on my first island, I may dedicate one to making destroyers and fighters. But the first thing I _always_ build (other than armies, armies and armies) is a transport. More about why in a sec. >In the middle game (if there is such a thing) I start building battleships >and bombers. Once I have 6 or more cities (this number varies depending on where I start on the board, whether I've made contact with the enemy, how many islands I'm spread out over, and how many islands I can see), I start building the "big country" items: bombers, battleships, and s**tloads of destroyers. >initial builds). The bugger had three or four battleships, two carriers and >lots of destroyers and a few misc subs. I started infringing on one of his >islands and he kept using bombers to destroy the city I just overtook. >Quite frustrating. I know what you mean. I once sat down and simply tracked what he had, as soon as I saw it (I think this was a level 15 game). By day 35 or 36, he had 2 or more bombers, 1 or more battleship, 2 or more carriers, more than 5 destroyers, a few transports, and a _lot_ of fighters and armies. Bottom line: it would be almost impossible for him to have started off in the same situation as me (one city, one army or fighter). I'd love to find out how this program works... I suspect I'd find that the enemy is not run the same way as the human player, at least not at the higher levels. He either starts off with a plus-up in forces, or he starts with more than one city, or he begins the game established on a number of islands, or something like that. But the "odds aren't even" in the higher levels, I am sure. >So anyway. What strategies do others use when/if playing SC at higher levels? The one thing I _keep_ in mind while playing is that this game isn't about tactics or strategy: it's about production rates. The key is to get as many cities as you can as fast as you can, and to build the right things with those cities. So I always build a transport early, and get troops to as many islands (and in as many cities) as I can find before I run into him (that also helps against his bombers, because I have too many cities for him to seriously affect my production rates, in percentage terms). The fighters stay important so you can keep finding new islands (keeping your intel. ahead of your transports, but not too far ahead, is one of the finer points of managing the production schedule in the non-contact part of the game). Second point: you have a better chance of beating him at sea if you can cordon off all his ports (this is later in the game, after you've figured out what most or all of the board looks like: that's what all those destroyers are for, in addition to shutting down his transports). So I try to put a battleship and a destroyer in front of every one of his port cities to keep the ships from coming out. The destroyer is there to find subs that come out to sink the battleship. This is always frustrating (he is always bombing your battleship, or sending another battleship out after it, or sneaking a sub up to it), but I think it helps speed up your conquest _and_ it keeps your own shores and transport route free of enemy ships. Third point: as long as the islands are fairly close together throughout the board, you'll never need a carrier (except as a "cheap battleship"). Subs are up to you, I don't use them. It's almost like the computer can see where your subs are whether or not he should be able to. So I stick to armies, fighters and bombers, battleships, destroyers and transports. My ultimate production plan (mid-game, I own about half the board, he owns the other half, we each have about 25 cities) is: 5-10 armies 3- 6 fighters 3- 6 bombers 2- 4 battleships 2- 3 destroyers 1- 2 transports And as I start overwhelming him, I start shifting cities to making bombers and fighters. Once you have his sea ports cordoned off, there's no need for a lot of ships: you only need to produce enough to continue replacing those you lose. And as you take his islands, his number of sea ports decreases, so you stop needing ships at all. But you can _always_ use planes 8-) >Thanks in Advance You're welcome, hope this helps! JP
abennett@athena.mit.edu (Andrew Bennett) (06/08/90)
I win just about every time up to level 11, and lose just about every time at level 12. I start with a fighter, then switch to armies. The first ship I build is a transport, unless my fighter is having trouble seeing other continents (then it's a destroyer first). To keep the enemy off balance, I attack on two fronts - the first is a feint, because he will always throw everyting at you. After a few turns, I attack in force on another front. By that time, he has over commited himself to the wrong front. Variations on this work pretty well up to level 11. Whenever he's after one of my cities, or I'm way outnumbered, I put my armies on the defensive (leaving one or two in a city and others just outside). My kill ratio seems higher when I'm defending in general, and the game is set to favor city defenders in particular (except for ships). On level 12, it appears that the enemy is pretty mellow until we first meet, then production switches into high gear. I'm experimenting with keeping a low profile until the last possible second. Any further advice on that level would be greatly appreciated. -Drew b.t.w. Wouldn't it be nice if we had paratroops/transport aircraft? After all, many WWII operations depended on the success of the airborne divisions (market garden, D-Day, etc). Also useful to evacuate armies from a hopeless positon...
jak9213@helios.TAMU.EDU (John Kane) (06/08/90)
In article <1054300002@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> cjones@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu writes: > >I've recently started to play Strategic Conquest. I can win when playing >up to level 8 and anything above level 10 blows me away. > >I've just recently started building a fighter for my first object in order to >scout out the surrounding territory to make my army moves more efficient. My >first ship build is a destroyer to do the same for overseas scouting. Then >I finally start building transports. > >In the middle game (if there is such a thing) I start building battleships >and bombers. > >I just quit out of a level 10 scenario that seemed to be pretty well stale- >mated (why did I quit, frustration and the need to experiment with different >initial builds). The bugger had three or four battleships, two carriers and >lots of destroyers and a few misc subs. I started infringing on one of his >islands and he kept using bombers to destroy the city I just overtook. >Quite frustrating. > >So anyway. What strategies do others use when/if playing SC at higher levels? > >Thanks in Advance > >Tony - Well, I can play (and usually win) up to level 12. Level 13 is a toss-up. Anything above that, ... I build a fighter first. Then, as soon as the fighter is built, I build armies. With my fighter exploring the area, I can usually quickly pinpoint the rest of the cities on my island. Usually there is an island within my fighter's range, so I build 2 transports from my first port city. I then start using my port cities to build destroyers, battleships, and subs (in that order, I don't like carriers much). I use some of my isolated cities to build fighters and bombers. I start all of these more expensive units fairly early in the game, the computer does, so I need to fight on an equal footing with it. Sometimes I think that the game still cheats like it did in earlier versions. When it thought that you were running on a copy of the game, it would throw lots of bombers at you. It still seems to sometimes have an unusually large squadron of bombers, but I can too now, so I guess that it is not really cheating. Strategic Conquest is fun, but it is very time consuming. The price we pay for fun. -- John Arthur Kane, Systems Analyst, Microcomputer Support and Training Texas A&M University, College Station, TX 77843 (409) 845-9999 jak9213@helios.tamu.edu profs: x043jk@tamvm1.tamu.edu
ins_apw@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU (Philip Wong) (06/08/90)
Your early moves are most crucial...you make a mistake building a fighter right off. I think you should build an army and hope it finds another city immediately (or you will lose). The next most important thing is to build a transport soon. You need to start building one by the 3rd or 4th city you get...definitely by the 5th city. At first, this will feel like you are stretching your resources too far, but it is definitely the winning tactic. You need to expand much faster than the computer. A good judge of how you are doing is your city/turn ratio. If you have 1 city for every 3 turns, you will win. If you yave 1 city for every 4 turns, you are doing ok and will probably win...anything else is difficult to say. Well, i've given away the secret to the game...hope it helps... ins_apw@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU <--use this address, not the UUCP one
awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) (06/08/90)
You want to build transports early on. You have get keep up with the computer's production level, or at least not fall too far behind. To do this you have to conquer new cities faster because the computer builds faster than you do. Don't worry about his battleships and carriers. Use destroyers to find those and subs. Lure the big ships away from your supply lanes. Build a few bombers early because you never know when the computer will get lucky and colonize a strategic city. In the middle game, you can probably use your bombers to take out groups of his ships. (It is really fun to suck in several batlleships and carriers with one of yours ships and then nuke the whole group. You can usually even save your ship.)
ls1i+@andrew.cmu.edu (Leonard John Schultz) (06/08/90)
How is the blast radius of a bommer determined? I can't find the pattern
jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) (06/08/90)
In article <gaPj4ZO00UhB02fHJE@andrew.cmu.edu> ls1i+@andrew.cmu.edu (Leonard John Schultz) writes: >How is the blast radius of a bommer determined? I can't find the pattern Read your documentation (even if it is kind of scanty, IMHO): if the bomber rolls of the production line in the first 100 game days, its blast radius is zero. From day 101 to 200, it's 1. etc. And this is the reason I'm posting instead of e-mailing. Just out of curiosity, has anyone seen a bomber with blast radius _3_? I've never had a game go that long, and I'm just wondering if it's really awesome or what... 8-)
ted@cs.utexas.edu (Ted Woodward) (06/08/90)
In article <47040@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu> jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) writes: >And this is the reason I'm posting instead of e-mailing. Just out of >curiosity, has anyone seen a bomber with blast radius _3_? I've never >had a game go that long, and I'm just wondering if it's really awesome >or what... 8-) I have! It's GREAT! Take out 2 cities at once, and half his army on the island...a waste to use them for ship hunting, because his ships are usually much closer together. What I want to do is be able to select the radius of the bomb, once you have the technology. So after day 100, you could build rad 1 or rad 2 nukes... That 5 days means something if you only want to nuke a pesky battleship. -- Ted Woodward (ted@cs.utexas.edu) Death now has Extra Speed!
ins_apw@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU (Philip Wong) (06/08/90)
The game only cheated in the old version if you had a pirated copy. I think that the way the computer advantages itself in 2.0 is by reducing the number of days it takes to produce items. That is why it always seems to have more stuff than you initally do. After a while (if you are going to win), you have more cities that it outweighs his advantage. ins_apw@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu
ins_apw@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU (Philip Wong) (06/08/90)
I've noticed that fighters can't kill anything in the higher levels. I use mainly fighters as my attack force once I build up, but in the upper levels (15) they don't seem to be able to kill anything. I usually use them to attack armies and transports (supposedly mostly weaponless). But I end up losing more than 3:1 margin. ins_apw@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu
west@turing.toronto.edu (Tom West) (06/09/90)
Another variation on Stategic Conquest that I played a few times was the "how long can I live" version. You make a copy (of the old game) in finder and then play it. The computer then thought you were playing a pirate copy and put the difficulty rating up to about 40. Obviously you couldn't hope to win, but you could make it a contest to see how long you could survive! I tried it a number of times. Faster than the real game and still gives something you could compare games with. By the way, anybody have the address to upgrade one's copy of the Game to SC 2.055 (or whatever it is now?) Thanks Tom
liberte@yoyodyne.ncsa.uiuc.edu (06/09/90)
I won twice at level 15, and that's enough for me - it takes soo long! I would usually quit after the opening if things were not working out, like I got put on a sparse island, or too far from neighboring islands. The opening does seem to be very important to continued success. I always start with one fighter to make the best use of the first armies. No sense walking off in the wrong direction. Subs have a big impact on battleships, but you do have to sneak them close enough to strike by luring them with a destroyer. Repairing ships by docking in a city for several days is a pretty good deal. It takes almost as many days to build a new ship, but the city can be producing another ship simultaneously. At higher levels, the enemy gets the advantage by producing faster - I dont know if there is any other advantage. It dont think it knows where you are other than by the same tricks you would use. It has a better memory though. It is interesting to watch it play for you. You learn the tactics it uses against you. dan
zg03+@andrew.cmu.edu (Zafrir E. Gan) (06/09/90)
To add one more tidbit to the great array of comments already posted: During the later stages of the game when your cities are pretty well spread out, a good strategy is to build armies in the cities that are close to the enemy, while building fighters,bombers, and battleships in the ones farther away.
dank@skat.usc.edu (Dan King) (06/09/90)
In article <47040@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu> jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) writes: [... Misc stuff deleted ...] >And this is the reason I'm posting instead of e-mailing. Just out of >curiosity, has anyone seen a bomber with blast radius _3_? I've never >had a game go that long, and I'm just wondering if it's really awesome >or what... 8-) I've never gotten to three, but my room-mate used to play the computer at level five (or so, never above seven) and quite often got bombers with blast radii of FOUR (yep, that's 4!)! You could take out entire islands with one good (hell, even a poor shot could take out an island) bomber. I watched him play several times and it seemed he was fine in the early game, but would quickly switch ALL his cities into bomber plants. He could hold the computer back (swinging a club with a blast radius of four can hold most things back), but couldn't seem to win (go figure)... dank
news@udenva.cair.du.edu (netnews) (06/09/90)
In article <47040@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu> jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) writes: >In article <gaPj4ZO00UhB02fHJE@andrew.cmu.edu> ls1i+@andrew.cmu.edu (Leonard John Schultz) writes: >>How is the blast radius of a bommer determined? I can't find the pattern > >Read your documentation (even if it is kind of scanty, IMHO): if the >bomber rolls of the production line in the first 100 game days, its >blast radius is zero. From day 101 to 200, it's 1. etc. > >And this is the reason I'm posting instead of e-mailing. Just out of >curiosity, has anyone seen a bomber with blast radius _3_? I've never >had a game go that long, and I'm just wondering if it's really awesome >or what... 8-) I must really be out of date. 100 days to get a blast of 1. Last I checked it was 50 days for each increment. But then again I am running version 1.1 so that might explain it. Needless to say, with that kind of incrementation, I have seen a blast radius of 3 and even a blast radius of 4. It is definitely a nice sight. Especially since I dropped it in the middle and took out 4 cities and a whole battalion of armies. (Won the game too. :) ) So, since I am running an old version and someone did mention that they had an address where I could upgrade. Would that person please post or email. Much appreciated. Thanx. Banshee ekoffler@zephyr.cair.du.edu
finesse@eleazar.dartmouth.edu (Amit Malhotra) (06/11/90)
One strategy which I use which hasn't been mentioned yet is to set up patrol
planes all around my islands. If you keep your screen tight enough, he can't
sneak ANYTHING past you. You can also keep submarines behind these screen so
if you see a battleship or transport approaching, you can sink his ship almost
immediately. A good way to set up your patrol planes is to pass on your
plane's first 10 turns and then drag it to where you want it to patrol (in
a 10 space radius). This makes it so when it's the computer's turn, your planes
will be floating 10 spaces away from your island (as opposed to resting in your
city), making it even harder for it to sneak things past you. This tactic
also has the advantage of making it so that if you have slept armies or planes
in your city, you don't screw up your planes' patrol patterns when you wake
them. Good luck,
-finesse
.ins_apw@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU (Philip Wong) (06/12/90)
With the pirated version 1.0, the level wasn't jacked up to 40. The computer simply cheated. It is virtually impossible to win it at that level. My friend actually did win once though. Using many save and restores, he was able to play a near perfect game and beat the computer even while cheating!
stay@ohs.UUCP (Steve Taylor) (06/12/90)
I win at least 50% of my level 15 games, and I agree with the comments on production being important (build transports!) and building bombers on far islands, and of course you won't automatically lose if you start with a fighter. Also: Since no one else has mentioned this, I'm not sure if it's a valid comment any more, but there's a bug that goes like this: Take a fighter out and attack someone once. If you live, press B, and wait for that fighter's turn to come up again. At this point, you can attack, belay, attack, belay, as many times as you want, until you die or run out of fuel. This is GREAT for taking out a fleet of bombers. If you fly a fighter into an empty enemy city and leave it there, the computer on it's turn, will fly all available fighters into that city in an attempt to kill you. Ha ha, it doesn't work. He just lands. This makes a great target for a bomber. (If you're interested in bothering with fighters) By flying fighters past cities for several turn, we've figured that at level 15, the computer produces things exactly twice as quickly as you do. The computer appears to have a one-dimensional attack plan. If you attack in two places at once, it just can't handle it. Has anyone else seen this happen? And, what about the screwy transport bug? I take a transport up to an enemy island and make sure all the armies are awake, and belay the transport (for a bomber or whatever) When I get back to the transport's turn, the armies have all lost their turns. Sometimes this happens (when I'm moving a transport three spaces to an island) between the second and third moves! (I check after each square.) In case it's not obvious, this can destroy an entire attack wave. Ouch. I wish we could have a tournament for the level 15-ers. -- - Steve Taylor, trACE Development, Alpine School District, Orem, Utah
yossie@marque.mu.edu (06/12/90)
In article <5507@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU> ins_apw@jhunix.UUCP (Philip Wong) writes:
.With the pirated version 1.0, the level wasn't jacked up to 40. The computer
.simply cheated. It is virtually impossible to win it at that level. My
.friend actually did win once though. Using many save and restores, he was
.able to play a near perfect game and beat the computer even while cheating!
Yah, I had a friend like that too (hee hee, maybe he was the same!). He
could win at SC 1.0 consistantly, even though the computer was cheating all
along. I believe he did shell out money for SC+ 2.0 just to see if they made
the algorythms better - they didn't. He still wins, consistantly, at all
levels of the game.
- Yossiebrendan@batserver.cs.uq.oz.au (Brendan Mahony) (06/12/90)
finesse@eleazar.dartmouth.edu (Amit Malhotra) writes: >One strategy which I use which hasn't been mentioned yet is to set up patrol >planes all around my islands. If you keep your screen tight enough, he can't >sneak ANYTHING past you. You can also keep submarines behind these screen so >if you see a battleship or transport approaching, you can sink his ship almost >immediately. A good way to set up your patrol planes is to pass on your >plane's first 10 turns and then drag it to where you want it to patrol (in >a 10 space radius). This makes it so when it's the computer's turn, your planes >will be floating 10 spaces away from your island (as opposed to resting in your >city), making it even harder for it to sneak things past you. This tactic >also has the advantage of making it so that if you have slept armies or planes >in your city, you don't screw up your planes' patrol patterns when you wake >them. Good luck, It is very important to have the fighters at the 10 limit as this ensure that no bombers get through to your precious cities. You also need to have some big ships out there to distract any opposition fighters from shooting down your fighter screen. Big ships can also be used to distract the enmies fighter screen, protecting your incoming bombers. On land use your advancing armies. Aircaft carriers are the best way of mapping out the world teritory, using about 5 planes you can lay down a mapping pattern 20 squares wide! I'm a bit suprised at the fellow who had trouble winning once the bombers reached blast radius 3. With a good fighter screen no enemy bombers should get through, and your bombers should quickly make a mess of the computer's industrial complex. At that stage you should be building nothing but bombers and armies. I've never lost once the bombers got up to radius 3, even with the computer in super-cheat mode. Now the tactics needed to live that long... -- Brendan Mahony | brendan@batserver.cs.uq.oz | Department of Computer Science | University of Queensland | Australia |
greg@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Gregory James) (06/13/90)
In article <47040@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu>, jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) writes: > In article <gaPj4ZO00UhB02fHJE@andrew.cmu.edu> ls1i+@andrew.cmu.edu (Leonard John Schultz) writes: > And this is the reason I'm posting instead of e-mailing. Just out of > curiosity, has anyone seen a bomber with blast radius _3_? I've never > had a game go that long, and I'm just wondering if it's really awesome > or what... 8-) I have had a game on Level 14 go on long enough to get 3 radius bombers. They're pretty annoying, since the computer gets them twenty turns before you do. They nearly gave me a heart attack when I saw a island invasion go down the tubes in one shot. About three months ago someone told me about a SC+ 2.0 editor, where you could edit the map and pieces. He told me that he used to build a radius 29 bomber which could trash most of the world. He sent me the file, but it arrived correpted. If anyone has this nifty thing, perhaps they could post it here. Greg James greg@cpsc.ucalgary.ca
jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam) (06/13/90)
In article <542@ohs.UUCP> stay@ohs.UUCP (Steve Taylor) writes: > >And, what about the screwy transport bug? I take a transport up to >an enemy island and make sure all the armies are awake, and belay the >transport (for a bomber or whatever) When I get back to the transport's >turn, the armies have all lost their turns. Sometimes this happens That isn't actually a bug, although I agree it can be really annoying. Although the armies are on the transport, the computer doesn't consider them a _part_ of the transport; so when their turn comes up to move, they do... it's just that in this case, their chosen move is "sleep". By the time the transport's turn comes up again, the armies have all been moved for the turn. To get around this inconvenience, "W-ake" the armies (i.e., press W then click on the transport) _before_ you "B-elay" the transport. After you've belayed the transport, the armies' turns will come up (and you'll have to belay them individually, which is a different form of annoyance 8-). > >I wish we could have a tournament for the level 15-ers. > Me too! Although I am not yet a "level 15-er", I'm sure I will be after trying these "cheat" hints you and another person have posted 8-).
rwanner@bcarh415.bnr.ca (Rick Wanner) (06/13/90)
In article <542@ohs.UUCP> stay@ohs.UUCP (Steve Taylor) writes: >Since no one else has mentioned this, I'm not sure if it's a valid >comment any more, but there's a bug that goes like this: >Take a fighter out and attack someone once. If you live, press B, >and wait for that fighter's turn to come up again. At this point, you >can attack, belay, attack, belay, as many times as you want, until >you die or run out of fuel. This is GREAT for taking out a fleet of >bombers. This trick works with any piece that gets more than one attack. Richard Wanner UUCP ..!uunet!bnrgate!bcarh415!rwanner (613) 763-4159 BNR claims no responsibility for my opinions. As a matter of a fact I don't think they know I have opinions.
tja105@csc.anu.oz (06/14/90)
In article <3183@bnr-rsc.UUCP>, rwanner@bcarh415.bnr.ca (Rick Wanner) writes: > In article <542@ohs.UUCP> stay@ohs.UUCP (Steve Taylor) writes: >>Take a fighter out and attack someone once. If you live, press B, >>and wait for that fighter's turn to come up again. At this point, you >>can attack, belay, attack, belay, as many times as you want, until > This trick works with any piece that gets more than one attack. A similar trick works for repairing ships, no doubt due to a similar bug. You can repair any ship to pristine condition by repeated pressing of B while the ship is in one of your ports. I tend to find that the computer's battleships have the odds so much in their favour that you need this trick to be able to take them on with anything less than four-to-one odds. One of his battleships can regularly keep three of mine busy for ages, even when I'm continually repairing mine this way. You need bombers and/or multiple submarinees to take out his battleships. -- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim Allen ACSNET: tja105@phys.anu.oz.au OR tja105@csc.anu.oz.au Snailmail: Dept of Theoretical Physics, RSPhysS,ANU My way of life is simple, For I just do what I please. Supertramp ________________________________________________________________________________
stay@ohs.UUCP (Steve Taylor) (06/14/90)
From article <47426@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu>, by jpulliam@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Jacqueline Pulliam): >>And, what about the screwy transport bug? > > That isn't actually a bug, although I agree it can be really annoying. > > To get around this inconvenience, "W-ake" the armies (i.e., press W > then click on the transport) _before_ you "B-elay" the transport. > After you've belayed the transport, the armies' turns will come up > (and you'll have to belay them individually, which is a different form > of annoyance 8-). Unfortunately, this isn't true. It IS a bug, as several people I know will violently declare. I have tried all possible combinations of waking and belaying including the following: 1. I wake up the armies (and when I look at the pieces, they say "Movement manual, NOT moved today") 2. I belay the transport and take care of other business. 3. The armies' turns come up, and I belay them all, which is just fine with me. 4. The transport turn comes back, and all of the armies STILL say "movement manual, NOT moved today". 5. I move the transport two squares, one at a time, and after each, the armies are still not moved today. I swear! 6. I move the transport its final move, and lo and behold, the armies are suddenly at "Movement manual, piece MOVED today." It happened after the last transport move, but before any other piece got to move. Tell me I can get around this! Honestly, it's not just me being stupid, it's a bug. I've also tried Waking the armies after EACH of the above 6 steps. Before anyone tells me I'm not waking them at the right time, please re-read this entire message and be sure I'm not doing it right. The reason I'm so defensive is that I have welts on my neck from where my supervisor tried to strangle me after he experienced this bug for the 30th time. Thanks. By the way, I forgot to mention that on human-human games we usually agree on cheating or non-cheating before we start. And, here's an interesting variation for those of you bored with pathetic level 15: Play a two-player "Hundred Day War" where you and the other person can only build things for 100 days. Absolutely NO exploring. Then, on day 100, you explode in all directions with what you've accumulated. Naturally, you have to restart until you each have a port city. --Steven H. Taylor, just me.
lim@iris.ucdavis.edu (Lloyd Lim) (10/09/90)
I've finally won a Strategic Conquest game at level 15. (I've played 1 game
each at level 1 and 10 and 4 previous games at level 15.) I benefited a lot
from a lucky setup where I started in the middle of the board and there was
a natural defensive arrangement based on geography that made it easy to
destroy invading ships, bombers, and transports.
I've figured out how to near optimally move and position my pieces and I have
some strong tactics for certain situations but the computer is still very
hard to beat. What I'm wondering is whether any of you have progressed to
the point where you can consistently beat the computer on level 15. I also
heard rumors that the computer builds faster than you do on level 15. Is this
true?
At this point my games run anywhere from 10-30 hours long. (After about 10
hours, I can see enough of the computer's resources to decide if I have a
chance. The game I won took about 30 hours.) If I know people can
consistently beat the computer, I'll try to refine my tactics but otherwise
this is just taking too long.
+++
Lloyd Lim Internet: lim@iris.ucdavis.edu (128.120.57.20)
Compuserve: 72647,660
US Mail: 215 Lysle Leach Hall, U.C. Davis, Davis, CA 95616reagle@cs.nps.navy.mil (William Reagle) (10/09/90)
The version I have is 2.055, and the game is published by Premier Technology, Inc. PO Box 11138 San Francisco, CA 94101 Their phone number is (415)882-7766.
wscott@ecn.purdue.edu (Wayne H Scott) (10/09/90)
In article <7776@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> lim@iris.ucdavis.edu (Lloyd Lim) writes: >the point where you can consistently beat the computer on level 15. I also >heard rumors that the computer builds faster than you do on level 15. Is this >true? > As I understand it, the only difference between level it the speed in which the computer get pieces. In any event, at level 15 the computer gets 1 army a turn! -- _______________________________________________________________________________ Wayne Scott | INTERNET: wscott@ecn.purdue.edu Electrical Engineering | BITNET: wscott%ecn.purdue.edu@purccvm Purdue University | UUCP: {purdue, pur-ee}!ecn.purdue.edu!wscott
gdm@cs.columbia.edu (George Michaels) (10/10/90)
I have not yet been able to beat the computer at any level better than 13. I can win 50% of the time at level 12, and I have one once (out of ~20 games) ate level 13. I do know that the computer can produce at about double your rate for level 12. One army/2 turns instead of one army/4. I am curious about other people's strategies and tactics for winning at levels 13, 14 and 15. I have found that winning at any level higher than 11 is much to dependant on initial position. Perhaps I should just abort for games which do not put me in the center, or those which put me on a continent with less than 4 cities. gdm
ted@cs.utexas.edu (Ted Woodward) (10/10/90)
In article <1990Oct9.175329.7765@cs.columbia.edu> gdm@cedar.columbia.edu (George Michaels) writes: >I have not yet been able to beat the computer at any level better than 13. >I can win 50% of the time at level 12, and I have one once (out of ~20 games) >ate level 13. I do know that the computer can produce at about double your >rate for level 12. One army/2 turns instead of one army/4. I am curious >about other people's strategies and tactics for winning at levels 13, 14 >and 15. >I have found that winning at any level higher than 11 is much to dependant >on initial position. Perhaps I should just abort for games which do not put >me in the center, or those which put me on a continent with less than 4 >cities. >gdm Expand, expand, expand. As quickly as possible. Build a navy. Build bombers, but not too quickly. DON'T put all your efforts into fighting him; explore the other way and take cities. This is NOT a 'beat the computer with better tactics' game, contrary to what it looks like. It is, pure and simple, and economic game. To win you must outproduce him. And, at level 15, that means haveing twice the cities he does. Or a bit less, if you are a good tactician. You MUST have air and naval superiority; 20 bombers does you no good if he has 30 fighters that can pounce on your bombers. And, of course, take advantage of some quirks in the game. Attack his navy in ports with fighters, if you can. Park a fighter in one of his cities. Most of his air force and some navy will enter the city trying to attack you. Then is a good time to hit the city with a bomber...or, if you keep hitting 'b' with that fighter the turn after he moves in, it will keep attacking without using moves or fuel. Build battleships; they are the most effective bang for the buck naval wise. build a carrier to carry fighters too; and subs, if you like. And, of course, LOTS of transports. You will lose them...and destroyers early to just get out there. EXPAND! -- Ted Woodward (ted@cs.utexas.edu) Greetings, Royal Ugly Dudes!
Patrick.Hayes@cediag.bull.fr (Patrick Hayes) (10/10/90)
In article <1990Oct9.013534.2434@ecn.purdue.edu> wscott@ecn.purdue.edu (Wayne H Scott) writes: >In article <7776@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> lim@iris.ucdavis.edu (Lloyd Lim) writes: >>the point where you can consistently beat the computer on level 15. I also >>heard rumors that the computer builds faster than you do on level 15. Is >>this true? >As I understand it, the only difference between level it the speed in which >the computer get pieces. It looks that way to me too. >In any event, at level 15 the computer gets 1 army a turn! 1 army each turn? Take another look, I only count 1 every 2 turns. I'd bet even money that at level 15 the computer builds units exactly twice as fast as we do. Re: consistantly beating the machine @ level 15 Not me, unless I restart a game. I rarely beat the computer at force 15, unless he starts off at a disadvantage like being almost landlocked with only one port at the beginning... Pat -- +-------------------------------+-----------------------------------------+ | Patrick Hayes | EMail : Patrick.Hayes@cediag.bull.fr | | BULL CEDIAG | or hayes@bull.fr | | 68, Route de Versailles | or ...!mcvax!inria!bullfr!hayes | | F-78430 Louveciennes FRANCE | Tel : (33 1) 39 02 49 55 | +-------------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
jepullia@copper.ucs.indiana.edu (John Pulliam) (10/11/90)
In article <PATRICK.HAYES.90Oct10120217@troy.cediag.bull.fr> Patrick.Hayes@cediag.bull.fr (Patrick Hayes) writes: >In article <1990Oct9.013534.2434@ecn.purdue.edu> wscott@ecn.purdue.edu (Wayne H Scott) writes: This newsgroup had a big discussion of SC 2.0 about a month ago; a lot of this and more was discussed then. You may want to check the old stuff, esp. for great advice on how to win more consistently at the higher levels (I picked up some of the tips, and can now beat the machine at level 13 about three quarters of the time, over 50% at level 14, and still dicey but around one time in three at 15). >>As I understand it, the only difference between level it the speed in which >>the computer get pieces. >It looks that way to me too. No, there's a difference in its aggressiveness as well. At least at the very lowest levels (5 and below), aggressiveness (ie, the computer's determination to move to new islands and colonize them) seems to be low. I played a level 4 game a few months ago (just to remember what it was like), and found the guy with _all_kinds_ of armies, sitting on one island. He had ships out, but hadn't bothered to use a transport to move to a new island. >>In any event, at level 15 the computer gets 1 army a turn! >1 army each turn? Take another look, I only count 1 every 2 turns. I'd bet It is one army/two turns at 15th level. I'm fairly sure the computer's production rates are all doubled at that level. At least I know he can produce a battleship in roughly half the normal time.
gergely@cs.dal.ca (Peter J Gergely) (10/11/90)
The last time I phoned their number, a recording said that it was disconnected.
Anyone have any clues as to their new location or number.
--
Peter J. Gergely (MC/ORD, MCHQ, FMO Halifax, Halifax, NS)
INTERNET: gergely@XX.DREA.DND.CA
UUCP: gergely@cs.dal.ca
GENIE: GERGELYGE.JHD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Jon Dick) (10/12/90)
>> >In any event, at level 15 the computer gets 1 army a turn! 1 >> army each turn? Take another look, I only count 1 every 2 turns. >> I'd bet even money that at level 15 the computer builds units >> exactly twice as fast as we do. I sat on top of an enemy island once after conquering the rest of the world in a level 15 game and counted how long it took the computer to make things. Unfortunately, it only made armies and battleships at that time. Army's came out once every two days (which I'm pretty sure starts at level 13, definitely at level 14), and battleships were created every eight days. Less than half the time. Jon
mneerach@iiic.ethz.ch (Matthias Ulrich Neeracher) (10/12/90)
In article <949@dimebox.cs.utexas.edu> ted@cs.utexas.edu (Ted Woodward) writes: >And, of course, LOTS of transports. You will >lose them...and destroyers early to just get out there. I have had good results from building FEW transports and surrounding them with LOTS of fighters. I try to loose as few transports as possible. >EXPAND! True. Matthias ----- Matthias Neeracher mneerach@iiic.ethz.ch "These days, though, you have to be pretty technical before you can even aspire to crudeness." -- William Gibson, _Johnny Mnemonic_
Patrick.Hayes@cediag.bull.fr (Patrick Hayes) (10/13/90)
In article <11217@neptune.inf.ethz.ch> mneerach@iiic.ethz.ch (Matthias Ulrich Neeracher) writes: >I have had good results from building FEW transports and surrounding them with >LOTS of fighters. I try to loose as few transports as possible. I concur. I only build 2-3 transports in the early stages, and just build replacements if neccesary. I find that building LOTS of fighters is useful in many ways: 1) to water down resistance before a landing 2) on a carrier, I can scout out the positions of his ships before he locates mine to take proper measures (bring up subs, retreat, etc). Using this strategy, I've rarely been bothered by his subs for ex. 3) eleminate pesky bombers before he uses them(I find this satisfying). 4) destroy his shipping while it's in port Pat -- +-------------------------------+-----------------------------------------+ | Patrick Hayes | EMail : Patrick.Hayes@cediag.bull.fr | | BULL CEDIAG | or hayes@bull.fr | | 68, Route de Versailles | or ...!mcvax!inria!bullfr!hayes | | F-78430 Louveciennes FRANCE | Tel : (33 1) 39 02 49 55 | +-------------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
logic@wet.UUCP (Henry Kwan) (10/13/90)
In article <1990Oct11.000626.25492@cs.dal.ca> gergely@cs.dal.ca (Peter J Gergely) writes: > >The last time I phoned their number, a recording said that it was disconnected. >Anyone have any clues as to their new location or number. >-- >Peter J. Gergely (MC/ORD, MCHQ, FMO Halifax, Halifax, NS) > INTERNET: gergely@XX.DREA.DND.CA > UUCP: gergely@cs.dal.ca > GENIE: GERGELY FYI, Premier Technology is no longer in business. -- Henry Kwan | AppleLink: D0690 FWB, Inc. | CompuServe: 71320,1034 2040 Polk St. Ste 215 | Internet: claris!wet!logic@ames.arc.nasa.gov San Francisco, CA 94109 | UUCP: {claris,hoptoad,lamc,ucsfcca}!wet!logic
zg03+@andrew.cmu.edu (Zafrir E. Gan) (10/15/90)
>From: Patrick.Hayes@cediag.bull.fr (Patrick Hayes) >Subject: Re: Strategic Conquest >Date: 12 Oct 90 17:40:49 GMT > >I concur. I only build 2-3 transports in the early stages, and just build >replacements if neccesary. I find that building LOTS of fighters is useful in >many ways: > 1) to water down resistance before a landing > 2) on a carrier, I can scout out the positions of his ships before he > locates mine to take proper measures (bring up subs, retreat, >etc). > Using this strategy, I've rarely been bothered by his subs for ex. > 3) eleminate pesky bombers before he uses them(I find this satisfying). > 4) destroy his shipping while it's in port Here's one more use for fighters: When attempting to take over an island from the enemy, pit fighters against his advancing armies. Fighters can be brought over from other islands so there's no need to count on transports bringing reinforcements. Fighters generally have about the same kill ratio as armies, but at the same time can attack up to 20 times a turn (if one (b)lays after every attack). And considering how long it takes to move troops and ships up to your front line, fighters are the quickest offense available. P.S. fighters can also be used in defence. I once took out an enemy's transport and the eight armies it unloaded on my island using 3 fighters.
willson@seas.gwu.edu (Stephen R. Willson) (03/31/91)
Does anyone know where I can get a copy of the latest version of Strategic Conquest. I don't know which version I saw, but I was hoping that someone might have made some improvements to it.
johnsone@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Erik A. Johnson) (03/31/91)
willson@seas.gwu.edu (Stephen R. Willson) writes: > Does anyone know where I can get a copy of the latest version of >Strategic Conquest. I don't know which version I saw, but I was hoping that >someone might have made some improvements to it. Strat.Con. v3.0 is available through the company that owns it: Delta Tao Software, Inc. 760 Harvard Ave. Sunnyvale, CA 94087 (I don't have a phone # handy) I just talked to them last week and ordered StratCon3.0 and their new game, Spaceward Ho! They have a backlog because of a large number of orders, so they said it will be a couple of weeks before I get it. Erik A. Johnson, Graduate Student \ Internet: johnsone@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu Aeronautical & Astronautical Engineering \ University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign \ AmericaOnline: ErikAJ
gergely@cs.dal.ca (Peter J Gergely) (04/01/91)
In article <2963@sparko.gwu.edu> willson@seas.gwu.edu (Stephen R. Willson) writes: > > Does anyone know where I can get a copy of the latest version of >Strategic Conquest. I don't know which version I saw, but I was hoping that >someone might have made some improvements to it. The people to contact are: Delta Tao Software 760 Harvard Avenue Sunnyvale, CA USA 94087 Attention: Joe Williams Phone: 408-730-9336 Internet EMAIL: deltatao@applelink.apple.com (Read weekly only) Hope this helps. - Peter -- Peter J. Gergely (MC/ORD, MCHQ, FMO Halifax, Halifax, NS) INTERNET or UUCP: gergely@cs.dal.ca GENIE: GERGELY