[comp.sys.mac.system] System 7 re-verify

jp48+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan Pace) (04/10/91)

   I just erased a disk that was giving me problems and I watched the usually
boring description of what was happening.  Thing is, system 7 (b4) said it
was re-verifying the disk at one point.  It took about as much time as the
normal verify, which it also did.

   Is this a feature that it does all the time, or is it just used on disks
that are giving screwy verification results?  I didn't have time to format
other disks to check.  Anyone seen/tried the same thing?

Jon

amanda@visix.com (Amanda Walker) (04/11/91)

In article <kc0kcZm00WB7I2BUwF@andrew.cmu.edu> jp48+@andrew.cmu.edu
(Jonathan Pace) writes:

      Is this a feature that it does all the time, or is it just used on disks
   that are giving screwy verification results?  I didn't have time to format
   other disks to check.  Anyone seen/tried the same thing?

This is a new feature: if the Mac discovers bad blocks, it will mark them
as used and re-verify the disk.  This will let you use disks with media
defects on them, at the cost of a block or two ffor each defect.  The
"re-verifying format" message signifies that it's doing this second scan.

--
Amanda Walker						      amanda@visix.com
Visix Software Inc.					...!uunet!visix!amanda
-- 
X Windows: Live The Nightmare.

rsfinn@CONCERTO.LCS.MIT.EDU (Russell S. Finn) (04/11/91)

In article <kc0kcZm00WB7I2BUwF@andrew.cmu.edu>, jp48+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan Pace) writes:
|> 
|>    I just erased a disk that was giving me problems and I watched the usually
|> boring description of what was happening.  Thing is, system 7 (b4) said it
|> was re-verifying the disk at one point.  It took about as much time as the
|> normal verify, which it also did.
|> 
|>    Is this a feature that it does all the time, or is it just used on disks
|> that are giving screwy verification results?

Congratulations, you've just discovered the new "block-sparing" feature
of System 7, described in one of the most recent batch of Tech Notes.
Under System 7, the Disk Initialization Package can detect certain
errors when formatting disks and mark those sectors so that they are
not used.  (I believe it only attempts this on floppy-sized disks,
under the assumption that good hard disk drivers already do something
like this anyway.)  When this happens, the Finder displays the
"Re-verifying" message.  

Disclaimer:  This is based on a cursory reading of the Tech Note in
question, which I no longer have a copy of.  Perhaps someone would
like to expand on this.

-- Russell Finn
rsfinn@lcs.mit.edu

torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie) (04/11/91)

rsfinn@CONCERTO.LCS.MIT.EDU (Russell S. Finn) writes:

>In article <kc0kcZm00WB7I2BUwF@andrew.cmu.edu>, jp48+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan Pace) writes:
>|> 
>|>    I just erased a disk that was giving me problems and I watched the usually
>|> boring description of what was happening.  Thing is, system 7 (b4) said it
>|> was re-verifying the disk at one point.  It took about as much time as the
>|> normal verify, which it also did.
>|> 
>|>    Is this a feature that it does all the time, or is it just used on disks
>|> that are giving screwy verification results?

>Congratulations, you've just discovered the new "block-sparing" feature
>of System 7, described in one of the most recent batch of Tech Notes.

  This is documented in TN #287: Hey Buddy, Can You Spare A Block?
Essentially, it rescans the disk after a verification failure, reading
and writing a track at a time to find which one has an error.  It
removes these sectors from the volume bitmap of available storage.



-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Evan Torrie.  Stanford University, Class of 199?       torrie@cs.stanford.edu   
Fame, fame, fame...  What's it good for?  Ab-so-lute-ly nothing

REEKES@applelink.Apple.COM (Jim Reekes) (04/11/91)

In article <kc0kcZm00WB7I2BUwF@andrew.cmu.edu>, jp48+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan Pace) writes:

>    I just erased a disk that was giving me problems and I watched the usually
> boring description of what was happening.  Thing is, system 7 (b4) said it
> was re-verifying the disk at one point.  It took about as much time as the
> normal verify, which it also did.
> 
>    Is this a feature that it does all the time, or is it just used on disks
> that are giving screwy verification results?  I didn't have time to format
> other disks to check.  Anyone seen/tried the same thing?

This is answered in Tech Note #287:	Hey Buddy, Can You Spare A Block?

What's happening is that your disk is bad, but System 7 is attempting to
map out the bad sectors.  This disk is now usable by HFS.

Jim Reekes E.O., Macintosh Toolbox Engineering

ldo@waikato.ac.nz (Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Waikato University) (04/12/91)

After all these years, you wonder why Apple bothered...

What will this mean for existing versions of disk fixers like
Disk First Aid and the Nortilities? Will they see those blocks
as in use, but not belonging to any file, and simply put them
back on the free chain?

Lawrence D'Oliveiro                       fone: +64-71-562-889
Computer Services Dept                     fax: +64-71-384-066
University of Waikato            electric mail: ldo@waikato.ac.nz
Hamilton, New Zealand    37^ 47' 26" S, 175^ 19' 7" E, GMT+12:00
Social success in modern time is much the same as always:
mix with people in your own wage-group.       -- P K Shaw

REEKES@applelink.apple.com (Jim Reekes) (04/12/91)

In article <1991Apr12.120202.3411@waikato.ac.nz>, ldo@waikato.ac.nz (Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Waikato University) writes:
>  
> What will this mean for existing versions of disk fixers like
> Disk First Aid and the Nortilities? Will they see those blocks
> as in use, but not belonging to any file, and simply put them
> back on the free chain?

This is why I wrote the Tech Note, and exactly why it was released months
before System 7 shipped to users.  Some low level utilities may have to
be updated.  The information in the Tech Note makes is clear to
developers what they can expect from the new Disk Init Package.

Jim, Mac Toolbox Engineer