graham@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael Graham) (01/19/91)
I've had a Mac Plus for almost 5 yrs now and Iove it. I have 4 megs of RAM and 65 megs of HD space. Anyway - some of my friends have Amigas - one has an Amiga 3000. They keep extolling the virtues of their machines and the inadiquacies of mine - all the way up to the IIfx. I am getting VERY sick of this and want to put them in their place. What are the loopholes in the so called Amiga advantages - like: true multitasking faster operation?? more bang for the buck video stuff - like the video toaster and dedicated graphics chips cheap software good, cheap emulation software etc etc etc etc... I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!!!! HELP!!!!!! RSVP ASAP mike ps - memory management....ARGGGGGGGGG......
kdarling@hobbes.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling) (01/19/91)
graham@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael Graham) writes: >I've had a Mac Plus for almost 5 yrs now and Iove it. I have 4 megs... >Anyway - some of my friends have Amigas - one has an Amiga >3000. They keep extolling the virtues of their machines and the ... >I am getting VERY sick of this and want to put them in their place. If you love and find useful what you own, then just ignore anyone else's jibes. That goes for any machine owner. Turn the subject to how ugly their girlfriends are instead ;-). In truth, the Amiga is a nice machine. Lacks a lot of productivity software. Toaster? I'd be surprised if they owned one themselves: null argument there. Faster? Doubtful. Better value? Anything is better value than Apple's prices, IMO.
melling@cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger) (01/19/91)
In article <1991Jan19.040432.21738@cs.dal.ca> graham@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael Graham) writes:
I've had a Mac Plus for almost 5 yrs now and Iove it. I have 4 megs
of RAM and 65 megs of HD space.
Anyway - some of my friends have Amigas - one has an Amiga
3000. They keep extolling the virtues of their machines and the
inadiquacies of mine - all the way up to the IIfx.
I am getting VERY sick of this and want to put them in their place.
What are the loopholes in the so called Amiga advantages - like:
true multitasking
faster operation??
more bang for the buck
video stuff - like the video toaster and dedicated graphics chips
cheap software
good, cheap emulation software
etc etc etc etc...
Actually the Amiga is a pretty good computer. Its main problem is(or
has been -- I don't follow Commodore) the lack of good business
software. Last I heard, Word Perfect was still only shipping version
4.2 on the Amiga. If the machine had a Lotus 123, PageMaker, etc, it
would be a lot better machine. That's probably why NeXT has a better
chance of penetrating the business market than Commodore; they have
some serious software for the machine with more on the way. Also,
with the Amiga and the NeXT, you do need more support. At least on
the NeXT you do(I haven't played with an Amiga for a couple of years).
For the hobbiest, though, the Amiga is probably ideal.
-Mikechapman@ug.cs.dal.ca (Paul Chapman) (01/20/91)
In article <1991Jan19.040432.21738@cs.dal.ca> graham@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael Graham) writes: >I've had a Mac Plus for almost 5 yrs now and Iove it. I have 4 megs >of RAM and 65 megs of HD space. >Anyway - some of my friends have Amigas - one has an Amiga >3000. They keep extolling the virtues of their machines and the >inadiquacies of mine - all the way up to the IIfx. >I am getting VERY sick of this and want to put them in their place. There is very little in the computer world that gets up my nose like computer chauvanism; I understand your frustration. In the end, it almost invariably boils down to which computer you _like_, and technical specifications can go to hell. The flame wars that crop up every few weeks usually get more and more ridiculous until everyone gets sick of it and the thread dies. For some reason, the Amiga people seem to be particularly fond of computer chauvanism (who else puts their computer's logo in their .sig file?) and I wish they would stop it; it damages their credibility. After all, if the machine does what you want it to do, and you like it, then that's good enough. When you stand back and look at different computers from the perspective of a means to an end, they actually all seem pretty similar. Right now, I use a Mac because my programming job requires it. With minimal pain, I could switch to an Amiga, a PClone or a Unix box. They all have their individual advantages and disadvantages, none of which are really fatal to the use of the machine. >What are the loopholes in the so called Amiga advantages - like: I'll try to give an unbiased comparison here. >true multitasking Works well, the only disadvantage I can see is that it seems to crash a bit too easily. This flaw is found in the Multifinder too, though. >faster operation?? Beware of people telling you that computer A is 1.5% faster than computer B. Minor speed differences really don't matter. Amiga graphics are faster than 68000 Mac graphics, but the SE/30 seems to be just as good. >more bang for the buck I can't argue with this. Even with the new Macs, they're still overpriced. >video stuff - like the video toaster and dedicated graphics chips As I mentioned above, the graphics chips allow cheap Amigas to outstrip cheap Macs in graphic speed, but as you throw money at the machines the differences blur. I have no clear idea what the video toaster is, so I can't comment on it. So far as I can tell, the Amiga doesn't support very high resolution or 24 bit colour. This may have changed by now, though. If you really have to do enormously flashy graphics and the depth of your pocket approaches infinity, I'd recommend a workstation of some sort, say a NeXT cube with that 80860 accelerator board, or a Personal IRIS for 3d work. >cheap software Depends what you buy. You can still get cheap software for the Mac for most applications, just don't expect them to do everything the expensive programs do. If you don't need expensive programs, don't buy them; you'll just be wasting your money. >good, cheap emulation software To emulate a Mac? The primary disadvantage of the A-Max board as far as I can gather is that it uses the 128k ROMs, and so you're locked out of colour QuickDraw and flexible monitor support. You also have to find the things, and I understand Apple is trying to make it as hard as possible to do this. What Apple might succeed in doing is forcing people to pirate them instead. >etc etc etc etc... > >I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!!!! HELP!!!!!! My advice though is not to take the bait. Don't get into a features war with these people because reason is in short supply when this sort of thing comes up. Just tell them that your computer does what you want it to do, that that's good enough for you, and why are they so insecure that they have to go around being obnoxious to everyone in sight who isn't one of them? >RSVP ASAP > >mike > >ps - memory management....ARGGGGGGGGG...... - Paul -- -= Paul Chapman -=- chapman@ug.cs.dal.ca -=- pc@ac.dal.ca (BitNet) =- -=-=-=-=-=-=-= Put Humourous Quote of Your Choice Here =-=-=-=-=-=-=-
ddyer@hubcap.clemson.edu (Doug Dyer) (01/20/91)
chapman@ug.cs.dal.ca (Paul Chapman) writes: >In article <1991Jan19.040432.21738@cs.dal.ca> graham@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael Graham) writes: >>I've had a Mac Plus for almost 5 yrs now and Iove it. I have 4 megs >>of RAM and 65 megs of HD space. >>Anyway - some of my friends have Amigas - one has an Amiga >>3000. They keep extolling the virtues of their machines and the >>inadiquacies of mine - all the way up to the IIfx. >>I am getting VERY sick of this and want to put them in their place. Hi, Im an Amiga owner (no, don't worry, no flames here). Ill just try to help clarify some things. As for why they are teasing you, who knows. Amiga is the underdog? >>true multitasking > Works well, the only disadvantage I can see is that it seems to >crash a bit too easily. This flaw is found in the Multifinder too, though. The Amiga multitasking is great in how you interface with it. An application can grab a screen if it wants, and you can slide screens down and manage the applications in an easy straighforward manner. The multitasking hasnt yet caused a crash (Im using 2.02, not 1.3) >>faster operation?? > Beware of people telling you that computer A is 1.5% faster than >computer B. Minor speed differences really don't matter. Amiga graphics >are faster than 68000 Mac graphics, but the SE/30 seems to be just as good. Amiga graphics provide up to 60fps. You really need $$ for that. an SE/30 would never approach 12-bit color overscan animation. That is why Disney and other big names make exclusive animation packages for the Amiga line (and use them). On top of that, these actions leave the CPU free. >>video stuff - like the video toaster and dedicated graphics chips > As I mentioned above, the graphics chips allow cheap Amigas to >outstrip cheap Macs in graphic speed, but as you throw money at the machines >the differences blur. I have no clear idea what the video toaster is, so I >can't comment on it. So far as I can tell, the Amiga doesn't support very >high resolution or 24 bit colour. This may have changed by now, though. If The toaster is a 24-bit real-time video board w/other stuff. There are about 8 24-bit boards ranging from $300 - $2000 some for video, some for high resolution work. The one by C= is 1024*1024 w/24-bit (but a 256 look up table) There are coming boards that do up to 32-bit double buffered, xxx polygons/sec and blah blah... But for my $$$, Ill go for colourburst or DCTV. I don't think expensive macs can outperform graphics chips (as far as performance, not color & resolution). >>good, cheap emulation software > To emulate a Mac? The primary disadvantage of the A-Max board as >far as I can gather is that it uses the 128k ROMs, and so you're locked out >of colour QuickDraw and flexible monitor support. You also have to find the >things, and I understand Apple is trying to make it as hard as possible to >do this. What Apple might succeed in doing is forcing people to pirate them >instead. Well, what does the flexible monitor support mean? The resolution is programmable (using the chips) you can have 640*480, 1008*800, ... all lightning fast, and rock solid (these windows MOVE). You may also have a virtual screen and slide the screen around real time with the other mouse button. AMAX did a good job. The problem is it is too fast (on a 3000, its ridiculous). You can easily get a package deal (AMAX-II with roms) for ~ $350, but only get it if you need compatibility with work. There are other emmulations such as IBM, Atari ST, C-64, and lots of 8-bit machines I can't remember. Well, just mentioning some things. Don't let them get to ya! Macs are ok, anything but DOS, right? :) Amiga has its problems like any other machine, the owners (like mac and ibm owners) just grow immune! If I came on too harsh, I appologise. Im just trying to shed some light on the machine. Bye, Doug -- "I/O's revenge is at hand." - Hennessy & Patterson
macman@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Dennis H Lippert) (01/24/91)
In article <1991Jan20.014343.13242@cs.dal.ca> chapman@ug.cs.dal.ca (Paul Chapman) writes: >of computer chauvanism (who else puts their computer's logo in their .sig >file?) and I wish they would stop it; it damages their credibility. After Well, at least they *can* use their computer's logo in their .sig... try it with a Mac and one of Apple's lawyers will be in touch with you very shortly! :-) DEnnis Lippert - macman@unix.cis.pitt.edu