picard@milton.u.washington.edu (Mary Stumpel) (04/25/91)
Does anyone out there have any mail order horror stories that they
would like to tell the rest of us? It could be useful in helping the
people on the net avoid the companies that provide "questionable" service.
On the flip side, I'd also like to hear mail order hero stories -
companies that go out of their way for their customers. Just make sure
that you are relating your own experiences, and that you are not relying
on hearsay or second hand information.
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"It would seem that my program to predict human emotional responses needs...
adjusting."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------kyt@cs.columbia.edu (Kok-Yong Tan) (04/25/91)
Yes, here are two horror stories about MacWarehouse: The first time I ordered a SCSI cable from MacWarehouse. They sent me a defective cable. I had mentioned to their order taker that it was urgent and I needed a working cable ASAP. They told me that it was no problem that as soon as they received the defective cable (they got AirBorne Express to pick it up at their expense, as it should be), they would despatch a new one. Total turnaround time: 3 days tops (or so they assured me). Five days later (over a weekend, so it was actually 3 working days), still no cable. I call them up and they claim they'd never received a cable. I call AirBorne who then provides me with the airbill number, the name of the person who received it at MacWarehouse and the time of receipt (all received the very next day after AirBorne had picked it up from my place.) I call MacWarehouse and ask for the same person I had spoken to earlier. Same denials. I told them of the information I had obtained from AirBorne and I hear some tapping of a keyboard in the background. Then they acknowledge that "they had received it and still hadn't processed it." I told them I needed the cable urgently but they were adamant that "until we process the return, we can't send you another cable." They refused to even give me an estimate as when they could send me the new SCSI cable. In fury, I called MacConnection and received a working cable the next day. Three working days after that (for a total of 7 working days in all--approximately 10 days in all since there was a holiday), I got a replacement SCSI cable from MacWarehouse which I no longer needed. I sent them a nasty letter and got a phone call direct from the CEO, who apologized profusely and said that they would credit my VISA account for $25 (the cost of the cable) and the reason they had to process all returns was because some people had been falsely claiming defective merchandise, getting replacements and not sending the original orders back. He also said it wouldn't happen again. All over $25 worth of goods (see below for hero story to understand why I was so peeved.) Like a fool, I believed the CEO and ordered a faxmodem from them since MacConnection was out of stock. This time, instead of the "Next Day Air" promise, after 3 working days, I still hadn't received my shipment. Another delay, especially after I had asked them if they had it in stock and if they could get the order to me the next day since I needed it urgently. I had ordered two items separately but within 15 minutes of each other and charged them to the same credit card. They had some braindead security measure which required them to wait 24 hours to make sure that it was really "me" who made the purchases. (How does this help determine authenticity?) Well, okay but that still leaves one day unaccounted for. I raised Hell with the CEO and only then, did my shipment get expedited and I receive it on the 4th working day. (Note that I DON'T include the day I place the order in my experiences above.) Here's a hero story about MacConnection: I'd ordered 4th Dimension by ACIUS from MacConnection. It arrived the next day, shrink-wrapped and all. On opening the shrink-wrap, I find that Acius had forgotten to include the program with the manuals in the box. I called MacConnection and outlined my problem. They said that they would ship out a complete set immediately and that I could send the defective set back to them at my leisure and at their expense. I told them that since I had a concierge, I could leave the defective set with him and he could do an on-the-spot swap when AirBorne Express arrived: defective set for complete set, thus making the return to MacConnection that much easier. It was done and I was up and running on day 4. Technically, since it was ACIUS that screwed up, MacConnection didn't really have to do this and pay for the cost of retrieving the package. They could have insisted that I rant and rave at ACIUS to get the product. However, they did me the courtesy of retrieving it at their expense and I will never forget it. Now, MacConnection was willing to do this with a $465 program and MacWarehouse was not with a mere $25 cable. Furthermore, since I was using a credit card to pay for my purchases, if I had not returned the defective item, MacWarehouse could have just charged my card again and produced paperwork to justify the charge. It goes without saying I will never deal with MacWarehouse again. All my future purchases shall be through MacConnection. -- Kok-Yong Tan can be reached at: | "Labra lege." InterNet: kyt@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu | - George Bush, if he were Caesar CompuServe: 75046,256 | Everything that can possibly be America Online: lallang | disclaimed is hereby disclaimed.
weiss@watson.seas.ucla.edu (Michael Weiss) (04/25/91)
In article <1991Apr24.193220.19013@milton.u.washington.edu> picard@milton.u.washington.edu (Mary Stumpel) writes: > > Does anyone out there have any mail order horror stories that they > On the flip side, I'd also like to hear mail order hero stories - I've got a mediocre story, I guess. I've dealt with MacConnection and MacWarehouse. Both are excellent in terms of giving the customer what he/she wants, and they send out their products quickly by next-day. They do not have much knowledge about the requirements of their products, however, in the sales department, and unless you have bought something from them (i.e. SIMMs) they don't connect you with tech support. As another plus, their tech support IS excellent. They will stay on as long as you need to solve your problems. In general, if you have a choice, MacConnection is almost always $3 less than MacWarehouse, and now MacConnection has 24hour ordering. MacWarehouse has a slightly larger selection, so I go to MacConnection first, and then to MacWarehouse if MacConnection doesn't have it. Also, both have excellent return policies, and are extremely courteous about returns.
chai@hawk.cs.ukans.edu (Ian Chai) (04/25/91)
I second that. I've had similar positive experiences with MacConnection -- Ian Chai Internet: chai@cs.ukans.edu Bitnet: 2fntnougat@ukanvax I don't believe in flaming. If I appear to be flaming, either (a) it's an illusion due to the lack of nonverbal cues or (b) my sprinkler system has suffered a momentary glitch, so just ignore me until it's fixed.
moorej@cpsin2.uucp (Jeffrey R Moore) (04/25/91)
kyt@cs.columbia.edu (Kok-Yong Tan) writes: >charge. It goes without saying I will never deal with MacWarehouse again. All >my future purchases shall be through MacConnection. Me too. I bought a real dog of a program (Aztec C) from MacConnection to use in a class. I wrote one strait ansi C program, which I ported to a unix box with no problems. Then, I shelved the program until summer, when I brought it out to do some mac programming. I did not like aztec C at all once I actually had to use it. The compiler would crash during compilation. So one day out of frustration, I called macconnection and bitched about how bad the program was. They asked if I wanted to return it. I couldn't beleive it. This was at least six months after I bought it! They took it back, and credited my VISA. As soon as I got the credit, I ordered Think C from them, and have been happy ever since. when I ordered my SIMMS from them, and had problems installing them (I have hardwareiphobia) I called their tech support line. These people are wonderfull. They must have been on the phone with me for at least 30 minutes (I had severe hardwareiphobia, now since conquered after many SIMM installations) macConnection will get all of my future orders. - Jeff >-- >Kok-Yong Tan can be reached at: | "Labra lege." >InterNet: kyt@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu | - George Bush, if he were Caesar >CompuServe: 75046,256 | Everything that can possibly be >America Online: lallang | disclaimed is hereby disclaimed.
tagreen@lothario.ucs.indiana.edu (Todd Green) (04/25/91)
In article <KYT.91Apr24203724@spruce.cs.columbia.edu> kyt@cs.columbia.edu (Kok-Yong Tan) writes: >Yes, here are two horror stories about MacWarehouse: > [MacWarehouse Deleted] > >Here's a hero story about MacConnection: > [edited] >charge. It goes without saying I will never deal with MacWarehouse again. All >my future purchases shall be through MacConnection. I've also recently switched to MacConnection and have to say that they are one of the most pleasant companies I've ever dealt with. Not only do they provide great service, but the employees actually seem to take pride and enjoy their work. I've ordered from them 3 times and each time I was greeted by a warm and friendly voice. I've never had a problem and all of the things I've ordered arrived on time and in working order. They'll get all of my business for the Mac! Todd -- Internet: tagreen@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu NeXTMail: tagreen@lothario.ucs.indiana.edu BitNet: tagreen@iubacs.bitnet
cavalier@alchemy.tcnet.ithaca.ny.us (Scott Mandell) (04/25/91)
I made an order from Dr. Mac about 1 month ago, and called back a week latr to cancel. They said it was on backorder, so no problem. Last week I received it (!) and it was charged to my credit card. (This is a $900 item, no small thing). So I called them and they said they'd get UPS to pick it up etc, which they did. But still, they never had any record of my cancelling the order. MacConnection is still my favorite Mailorder place...although they don't usually have the best prices, sometimes they do (they seem to have one of the lowest on the TelePort modem...). --scott -[ Scott E. Mandell ]------------------------------------------------- -[ (607) 256 - 4217 ]-- Voice 9AM - 11PM 7 Days/Week ----------------- -[ (607) 256 - 0200 ]-- BBS 24 Hrs 300->14.4k V.32/V.32bis/HST ------- -[ Ithaca, New York ]-- COMMsultants, Inc. --------------------------- -[------------------]-------------------------------------------------
long@mcntsh.enet.dec.com (Rich Long) (04/26/91)
I'm glad to see all the postive press for MacConnection. Have you told THEM, though? People are often quick to complain, but slow to praise. Write 'em a letter--maybe you'll end up in an ad! As I told them once, "MacConnection is reason enough to buy a Macintosh!". Needless to say (but I'll say it anyway), I've had nothing but excellent service from them in all regards. My one peeve is with their catalog: I don't feel enough space is devoted to games. MacWarehouse's entertainment section seems bigger. Richard C. Long | long@mcntsh.enet.dec.com | Selfware: If you like --------------- | ...!decwrl!mcntsh.enet.dec.com!long | this program, send A First Edition | long%mcntsh.dec@decwrl.enet.dec.com | yourself five bucks!
dplatt@ntg.com (Dave Platt) (04/26/91)
In article <1991Apr24.193220.19013@milton.u.washington.edu> picard@milton.u.washington.edu (Mary Stumpel) writes:
I've had only good results dealing with MacConnection. My "hero story":
I ordered an Asher Lynx trackball from them. It didn't show up the next
day as it should have. The day after that, I called them to report lack
of delivery. I was told, "No problem... we'll start a trace on the
original shipment, and send another one today... you should have it
tomorrow." I did... it arrived on time.
The original one showed up two days later... it had been mis-delivered
to a company down the street (very similar company names, no business
relationship to us). I called MacConnection; they said "No problem,
we'll call Airborne, and they'll pick it up and return it to us at our
expense."
After using the Asher for a couple of weeks, I concluded that it wasn't
well engineered... the trackball was too small, and much too stiff, for
a person with large hands to manipulate conveniently. I called
MacConnection and said "I'd like to return this under your 30-day
money-back guarantee, and I'd like to purchase a Kensington Turbo Mouse
trackball." I was told "Sure. We'll ship the Kensington today and
charge your credit card for the difference in price. We won't charge
you the $3 shipping. Pack up the Asher; We'll call Airborne and have
them pick it up at our expense." Everything happened as they said it
would.
Amazing service. Simply amazing.
Last summer, MacConnection stopped using "plastic popcorn" to shockproof
their shipments, substituting newsprint instead. They also switched to
using a stock of partially-recycled paper for their catalogs, and
apologized for the fact that the colors weren't as "crisp" as before. I
wrote them a letter thanking them for the changes (I think the new
catalogs are easier to read than the high-gloss ones that MacWarehouse
sends out). A few weeks later, I received a package, which contained a
letter thanking me for my customer feedback, and a very nice little
"window herb garden" with seeds for spearmint, peppermint, and lemon
balm!
In my opinion, the folks at MacConnection (and their sister company PC
Connection) really understand what "customer service" is about!
--
Dave Platt VOICE: (415) 813-8917
Domain: dplatt@ntg.com UUCP: ...apple!ntg!dplatt
USNAIL: New Technologies Group Inc. 2468 Embarcardero Way, Palo Alto CA 94303Ga????e_Drosehn@mts.rpi.edu (04/26/91)
(assorted other stories deleted) I've ordered many times from both MacWarehouse and MacConnection. MacWarehouse goofed up one order (sent something I didn't order instead of what I did order), and immediately corrected the problem once I called them about it. At this point I don't remember what the product was, but they told me to keep whatever it was they sent me by mistake and they sent out the right product right away. Anyone can make a mistake, and given their prompt reaction to the mistake I'm of the opinion that I've never had any real problems with either mail order company. - Garance Drosehn = gad@rpi.edu
costello@UUCP (Michael E. Costello) (04/26/91)
In article <mBuy12w162w@alchemy.tcnet.ithaca.ny.us>, cavalier@alchemy.tcnet.ithaca.ny.us (Scott Mandell) writes: > MacConnection is still my favorite Mailorder place...although they don't > usually have the best prices, sometimes they do (they seem to have one of > the lowest on the TelePort modem...). > Members of The Boston Computer Society receive free standard shipping from Macconnection. No small benefit, especially if you have a serious "habit." || Michael Costello, Meeting Director || costello@world.std.com || BCS*Mac || The Boston Computer Society Macintosh User Group || P.O. Box 2591; Woburn, MA 01888 617-631-8188
dave@PRC.Unisys.COM (David Lee Matuszek) (04/26/91)
In article <2535@lee.SEAS.UCLA.EDU> weiss@watson.seas.ucla.edu (Michael Weiss) writes: >In general, if you have a choice, MacConnection is almost always $3 less than >MacWarehouse, and now MacConnection has 24hour ordering. MacWarehouse has a >slightly larger selection, so I go to MacConnection first, and then to >MacWarehouse if MacConnection doesn't have it. > >Also, both have excellent return policies, and are extremely courteous about >returns. Some additional comments: MacWarehouse is somewhat worse in terms of "truth in advertising." They frequently offer a Power User's Tool Kit, advertised as "FREE!" The fact is, however, that they charge $1.50 shipping and handling for it. This isn't unreasonable, except that they charge $3 s/h for any order, no matter how many things you order at the same time, and this is the ONLY item that you have to pay extra s/h for--if you ask for it with any other order, they drop the disk in the same box and charge $4.50 total s/h. Also, MacWarehouse's $99 modem (I have one--works fine) is advertised as coming with "customized" MacKnowledge communications software ("Everything You Need for $99!"). The "customization" is actually severe brain damage: you can't use it to upload or download files. 'Nuff said. So why do I still use both MacWarehouse and MacConnection? In a word, catalogs. MacConnection (which I otherwise prefer) has worthless catalogs. They're as big as MacWarehouse's, but they have about 1/3 as many things in them, they have less information about each thing, and they are so poorly indexed that you have to work hard to find anything in them. (I have written to them about this, BTW.) MacWarehouse's catalogs are well-organized, more complete, more informative, and--also important--they send them out more often. -- Dave Matuszek (dave@prc.unisys.com) I don't speak for my employer. -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | When I was young, my family bought a color TV. Our neigbors, who | | were poorer, had only a black-and-white set. They bought a piece of | | cellophane, red on top, yellow in the middle, and blue on the bottom, | | and taped it over their screen, so they could claim that they had a | | color TV, too. | | Now there's Windows 3.0. | -------------------------------------------------------------------------
costello@UUCP (Michael E. Costello) (04/26/91)
In article <BRUNER.91Apr26125359@sp15.csrd.uiuc.edu>, bruner@sp15.csrd.uiuc.edu (John Bruner) writes: > On top of the great service, they have a great telephone number: > (800) MAC-LISA. [They don't advertise that number any more, but it > still works.] > I've noticed that myself. I wonder whether it has to do with some consent decree or something... I always use that number and take it as a credit to having been around "in the early days." = Michael Costello, Meeting Director * costello@world.std.com = = BCS*Mac * The Boston Computer Society Macintosh User Group = = P.O. Box 2591; Woburn, MA 01888 617-631-8188 =
bruner@sp15.csrd.uiuc.edu (John Bruner) (04/27/91)
I order things sporadically, and each time I've had nothing but good results with MacConnection. On top of the great service, they have a great telephone number: (800) MAC-LISA. [They don't advertise that number any more, but it still works.] -- John Bruner Center for Supercomputing R&D, University of Illinois bruner@csrd.uiuc.edu (217) 244-4476
long@mcntsh.enet.dec.com (Rich Long) (04/27/91)
In article <0B02FFFF.dnmdmil@stx.UUCP>, costello@UUCP (Michael E. Costello) writes... >Members of The Boston Computer Society receive free standard shipping >from Macconnection. No small benefit, especially if you have a serious >"habit." A pointless one, though, if UPS will not leave the package without a signature, as happened to me. The order was shipped "no signature required". All my orders now go through Airborne, with which I have not had a problem. Richard C. Long | long@mcntsh.enet.dec.com | Selfware: If you like --------------- | ...!decwrl!mcntsh.enet.dec.com!long | this program, send A First Edition | long%mcntsh.dec@decwrl.enet.dec.com | yourself five bucks!
ralph@cbnewsj.att.com (Ralph Brandi) (04/28/91)
In article <4542@ryn.mro4.dec.com> long@mcntsh.enet.dec.com (Rich Long) writes: > I'm glad to see all the postive press for MacConnection. Have you told THEM, Nope. Considering how ecologically aware they are, I don't want to waste the paper.... :-) (Maybe when they get an e-mail address....) -- Ralph Brandi ralph@mtunq.att.com att!mtunq!ralph R.I.P. Radio Canada International 1942-1991
bh11+@andrew.cmu.edu (Braddock John Hathaway) (04/28/91)
I've had very good experiences with the company Software (and hardware) that fits. Their customer service reps were the tops (very knowledgeable ... far beyond what I have come to expect from mail-order companies, and friendly to boot) and when I had a problem with an item I received, they were quick to help me with tech support. --Brad
hoepfner@heawk1.gsfc.nasa.gov (Patrick Hoepfner) (04/28/91)
dplatt@ntg.com (Dave Platt) writes: >In article <1991Apr24.193220.19013@milton.u.washington.edu> picard@milton.u.washington.edu (Mary Stumpel) writes: >I've had only good results dealing with MacConnection. Some of you might like to try out MacZone. I work at NASA and between myself and another person, we can purchase multiple thousands of dollars of stuff on a blanket purchase order for several different companies. MacWarehouse (the one with the girl on the cover of their magazine saying "Call Me") is a bit of a disapointment. You can tell that they have been instructed to hang up as quickly as possible. In addition to the fact that they know almost nothing about Mac products (except their names). MacConnection has always been good. But I really like MacZone (800)248-0800 because they are always al least one dollar less than anyone else. And they were the first company to tell not to buy something! They are also able to tell me of some upcomming new releases of software that I didn't know about. Call around. If you find a company that will spend a little more time on the phone giving you good advice, deal with them! This is the only way that the good companies will survive and the bad ones will clean up their act or go out of business! Vote with your dollars! NASA isn't paying me to say this! So don't blame them! +--------------------------+---------------------------------------+ / Patrick Hoepfner | NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center \ / America Online: PatrickH9 | Internet: hoepfner@heasfs.gsfc.nasa.gov \ +-----------------------------+------------------------------------------+
starta@tosh.UUCP (John Starta) (04/29/91)
costello@UUCP (Michael E. Costello) writes: > I've noticed that myself. I wonder whether it has to do with some consent > decree or something... I always use that number and take it as a credit > to having been around "in the early days." I doubt it is anything that complicated. Rather, I think they are using their current number (800-334-4444) because it doesn't require the conversion, thus making it quicker and easier to dial. John -- John A. Starta Internet: tosh!starta@asuvax.eas.asu.edu Chief Technologist UUCP: ...ncar!noao!asuvax!tosh!starta Micro Orchard Co. AOL: AFA John; CompuServe: 71520,3556
chai@hawk.cs.ukans.edu (Ian Chai) (04/29/91)
In article <1991Apr28.015451.10630@cbnewsj.att.com> ralph@cbnewsj.att.com (Ralph Brandi) writes: >In article <4542@ryn.mro4.dec.com> long@mcntsh.enet.dec.com (Rich Long) writes: > >> I'm glad to see all the postive press for MacConnection. Have you told THEM, > >Nope. Considering how ecologically aware they are, I don't want to >waste the paper.... :-) (Maybe when they get an e-mail address....) Well, actually, when I read this Friday, I *called* them and told them about it and the supervisor was trying to think who was it she knew at a university with Usenet access... -- Ian Chai Internet: chai@cs.ukans.edu Bitnet: 2fntnougat@ukanvax I don't believe in flaming. If I appear to be flaming, either (a) it's an illusion due to the lack of nonverbal cues or (b) my sprinkler system has suffered a momentary glitch, so just ignore me until it's fixed.
ralph@cbnewsj.att.com (Ralph Brandi) (04/30/91)
In article <17360@burdvax.PRC.Unisys.COM> dave@PRC.Unisys.COM (David Lee Matuszek) writes: >MacWarehouse is somewhat worse in terms of "truth in advertising." Agreed. The thing that angers me about MW is their penchant to advertise things that aren't out yet. They've had MacGlobe in their catalog for 6 months now. But when I called to order, they told me it isn't scheduled to come out until July. I can understand if it appears in one catalog--deadlines slip, and lead time in publishing is a pain. But it's been in at least the past three catalogs. Not cool. I've never seen MacConnection do this. In a business where it's the little things that differentiate between competitors, that's enough to swing me to MacConnection. I've dealt with MacConnection a number of times. I've always found them knowledgable and helpful. The one time I had a problem with some software I bought (wrong software on the disk), they replied quickly and appropriately (sent a new copy, testing first to make sure it had the right software on the disk.) -- Ralph Brandi ralph@mtunq.att.com att!mtunq!ralph R.I.P. Radio Canada International 1942-1991
francis@wolfman.cis.ohio-state.edu (RD Francis) (04/30/91)
In article <1991Apr29.173121.12990@cbnewsj.att.com> ralph@cbnewsj.att.com (Ralph Brandi) writes: In article <17360@burdvax.PRC.Unisys.COM> dave@PRC.Unisys.COM (David Lee Matuszek) writes: >MacWarehouse is somewhat worse in terms of "truth in advertising." Agreed. The thing that angers me about MW is their penchant to advertise things that aren't out yet. They've had MacGlobe in their catalog for 6 months now. But when I called to order, they told me it isn't scheduled to come out until July. I can understand if it appears in one catalog--deadlines slip, and lead time in publishing is a pain. But it's been in at least the past three catalogs. Not cool. I've never seen MacConnection do this. In a business where it's the little things that differentiate between competitors, that's enough to swing me to MacConnection. While I, too, normally go with MacConnection before MacWarehouse, that "advance advertising" isn't always a bad thing. If you go ahead and order the advance item (at least on the occasion when I did this), they'll ship it when it comes out, and will ship the rest of your order immediately. you'll only get charged for one shipment (saving $3) and will be one of the first people to get it once they do have it. you should even avoid the "We're already out of stock" bit, since presumably they can put in their initial orders based in part on what they've already sold. Mind you, if what you've pre-ordered turns out to be a real dog, you've missed the chance to see negative reviews before you buy. -- R David Francis francis@cis.ohio-state.edu
omh@cs.brown.edu (Owen M. Hartnett) (04/30/91)
About a year ago, I called MacWarehouse's "Corporate" number to ask about Syquest drives. They said they didn't carry them. After I hung up, I checked their catalog, and sho 'nuff, they had 'em. If I could find it in their catalog faster than the telephone answerer, that was good enough for me, I called MacConnection. BTW, the best "voice mail" I heard was the messaging system for MacZone: "Someone should have answered your call by now. This means either two things: 1) we are unexpectedly busy or 2) we're trying to ignore you." (That's the truth, they actually had that message on there.) -Owen Owen Hartnett omh@cs.brown.edu "FAITH, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel." -Ambrose Bierce - The Devil's Dictionary
chai@hawk.cs.ukans.edu (Ian Chai) (05/01/91)
I just got off the phone with MEI, you know, the bulk disk people? I had 7 High Density disks die on me after a short amount of usage, so I called them up today, and asked about exchanging them for good disks. The phone jockey was polite and offered to send out replacement disks after verifying my order number without waiting for me to send in the bad disks. There was only one snag, which was that the disks are on back order, but that's not their fault. -- Ian Chai Internet: chai@cs.ukans.edu Bitnet: 2fntnougat@ukanvax I don't believe in flaming. If I appear to be flaming, either (a) it's an illusion due to the lack of nonverbal cues or (b) my sprinkler system has suffered a momentary glitch, so just ignore me until it's fixed.
ralph@cbnewsj.att.com (Ralph Brandi) (05/01/91)
In article <FRANCIS.91Apr29173742@wolfman.cis.ohio-state.edu> francis@wolfman.cis.ohio-state.edu (RD Francis) writes: >While I, too, normally go with MacConnection before MacWarehouse, that >"advance advertising" isn't always a bad thing. If you go ahead and >order the advance item (at least on the occasion when I did this), >they'll ship it when it comes out, and will ship the rest of your >order immediately. you'll only get charged for one shipment (saving >$3) and will be one of the first people to get it once they do have I can understand this when the program's supposed to be out in a week or two, but *6 months*? That's how long they've been advertising MacGlobe in their catalog. It's not supposed to be out until July. If it had been in once, and then the date slipped, so they pulled it, I would understand that, too. But the product has been shown all this time, despite the clear understanding that it isn't out, and won't be for months. I don't particularly care for the ethics behind that. In all fairness, my father has never had any problems in his dealings with MacWarehouse. I haven't bothered because I've been so pleased with MacConnection, except for this one time. -- Ralph Brandi ralph@mtunq.att.com att!mtunq!ralph R.I.P. Radio Canada International 1942-1991