levin@bbn.com (Joel B Levin) (08/14/90)
In article <HEMSTREE.90Aug14084932@handel.handel.CS.Colostate.Edu> hemstree@handel.CS.Colostate.Edu (charles he hemstreet) writes: |and thus the question of the day for you great gurus out there. We |have SE's in our lab hooked up to image writers. Students take their |disk to another station to print out final copies on a laser printer. |When you go to the chooser to select the laser, it reformats the |document. How can we keep this from happening? Tell the students to print it on the SE with "Tall Adjusted" checked in the Page Setup dialog. This will make it close enough to what will appear on the LW. Also they will need to have bitmap fonts on their systems to match the LW fonts (if they stick to Times, Helvetica, and Courier the generic System Disk will have them). /JBL = Nets: levin@bbn.com | "How does a mouse let me move the cursor anywhere or {...}!bbn!levin | I want?" "What are address busses?" "How do pots: (617)873-3463 | icons work?" --Time-Life Books
resnick@cogsci.uiuc.edu (Pete Resnick) (08/14/90)
hemstree@handel.CS.Colostate.Edu (charles he hemstreet) writes: >When you go to the chooser to select the laser, it reformats the >document. How can we keep this from happening? More or less, you can't. More to the point, the IW and LW printers are going to have different formats either way since the IW figures out it's characters with bitmaps and the LW uses PostScript chars. Also, the page sizes are slightly different. There are, however, a few things you can tell users to make sure this doesn't happen to them. 1) Use tabs and NEVER USE MULTIPLE HARD SPACES. This is probably the worst culprit I see consulting Mac word processor users. These will inevitably be reformatted since in a proportional font, spaces can be different sizes. 2) Never use hard returns to reformat. If you need to move something down, use the Paragraph format for "space before" or "space after" or "keep with next paragraph." Or, if you are really in a bind, use the Position format if you have Word 4.0. Hard returns screw up everything if you ever change anything in the document anyway. 3) Use the Page preview command after choosing LW. This way, you can readjust your margains or re-check to make sure that everything is still as it should be. If you follow these, generally you will not even notice changes in the LW output. Good Luck, pr -- Pete Resnick (...so what is a mojo, and why would one be rising?) Graduate assistant - Philosophy Department, Gregory Hall, UIUC System manager - Cognitive Science Group, Beckman Institute, UIUC Internet/ARPAnet/EDUnet : resnick@kant.cogsci.uiuc.edu BITNET (if no other way) : FREE0285@UIUCVMD
awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) (08/15/90)
In article <1990Aug14.164654.26727@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> resnick@cogsci.uiuc.edu (Pete Resnick) writes: >1) Use tabs and NEVER USE MULTIPLE HARD SPACES. This is probably >the worst culprit I see consulting Mac word processor users. >These will inevitably be reformatted since in a proportional font, >spaces can be different sizes. The rule I use is "never use a space when you can use a tab, and never use a tab when you can use an indent". There are a few cases in which you may need to use a "fixed" or "hard" space (option-space on the keyboard). For example, the other day someone wanted to creat a centered column of bulleted items. A tab would not do since you would have to position the tab for each line based on where it was centered. A couple of option-spaces worked quite well. >2) Never use hard returns to reformat. If you need to move something >down, use the Paragraph format for "space before" or "space after" or >"keep with next paragraph." Or, if you are really in a bind, use the >Position format if you have Word 4.0. Hard returns screw up everything >if you ever change anything in the document anyway. I'd have to disagree here. The only time hard returns become a problem is when people terminate lines with them rather than letting the word processor wrap on its own. I'd recommend against using the fancier features of Word 4.0 unless you have a really good feel for how Word does things. There are nearly always several different ways to acheive an effect in Word and some can be hard to track down. (I find nullifying the effects of the Position command to be a pain in the butt.) Hard returns used to govern horizontal spacing are easy to find and easy to delete (you can use search and replace if nothing else.) If you use some of the more complex formatting commands in Word, you may spend a lot of time hunting down the method used to modify horizontal spacing. Also, Word can get confused when you start stringing a lot of those "Keep lines together" and "Keep with next paragraph" commands. While they are quite powerful when used by someone skilled with Word, they are easy to get fouled up in. >3) Use the Page preview command after choosing LW. This way, you can >readjust your margains or re-check to make sure that everything is >still as it should be. > >If you follow these, generally you will not even notice changes in >the LW output. The bottom line is that the ImageWriter isn't a good device to format output intended for the LaserWriter. While you can set the ImageWriter for tall adjusted, you simply have to remember that the ImageWriter has a larger imageable print area than the LaserWriter. The best best would be to inform the students to keep their margins large, and when they move to print their docs on the Laser, select Page Setup and click OK, and then do a Print Preview. >Good Luck, >pr >-- >Pete Resnick (...so what is a mojo, and why would one be rising?) >Graduate assistant - Philosophy Department, Gregory Hall, UIUC >System manager - Cognitive Science Group, Beckman Institute, UIUC >Internet/ARPAnet/EDUnet : resnick@kant.cogsci.uiuc.edu >BITNET (if no other way) : FREE0285@UIUCVMD - Allen
resnick@cogsci.uiuc.edu (Pete Resnick) (08/15/90)
awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) writes: >>1) Use tabs and NEVER USE MULTIPLE HARD SPACES. >the other day someone wanted to creat a centered column of bulleted items. A >tab would not do since you would have to position the tab for each line based >on where it was centered. A couple of option-spaces worked quite well. Bad choice. This may screw up spacing. You have the choice of left-justified, right-justified and center tabs as well as left right and center paragraphs for tables (an under-utilized feature). Each should be used over hard spaces. I agree that indents should be used over tabs. >>2) Never use hard returns to reformat. >I'd have to disagree here. [reasons deleted] Agreed that Paragraph positioning can be a pain and sometimes so can Keep with next (although I have run into few problems with it), but space before and after is an easy tool that should be used. Using hard returns forces Word to make dubious decisions about the tops of pages and when to keep something together at the end of the page. Also, if you use styles, changing things is really no problem at all. Almost nothing I ever do is in Normal style. >>3) Use the Page preview command after choosing LW. >The bottom line is that the ImageWriter isn't a good device to format output >intended for the LaserWriter. While you can set the ImageWriter for tall >adjusted, you simply have to remember that the ImageWriter has a larger >imageable print area than the LaserWriter. The best best would be to inform >the students to keep their margins large, and when they move to print their >docs on the Laser, select Page Setup and click OK, and then do a Print Preview. Couldn't agree more. I think that novices need to slowly learn some features of Word. I agree that some of the more powerful features are difficult to master, but some are so useful, you wonder how you ever got along without them and why you hadn't tried them in the first place. pr -- Pete Resnick (...so what is a mojo, and why would one be rising?) Graduate assistant - Philosophy Department, Gregory Hall, UIUC System manager - Cognitive Science Group, Beckman Institute, UIUC Internet/ARPAnet/EDUnet : resnick@kant.cogsci.uiuc.edu BITNET (if no other way) : FREE0285@UIUCVMD
mosemann@hoss.unl.edu (Russell Mosemann) (08/15/90)
In <35942@ut-emx.UUCP> awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) writes: >In article <1990Aug14.164654.26727@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> resnick@cogsci.uiuc.edu (Pete Resnick) writes: >>1) Use tabs and NEVER USE MULTIPLE HARD SPACES. This is probably >>the worst culprit I see consulting Mac word processor users. >>These will inevitably be reformatted since in a proportional font, >>spaces can be different sizes. >The rule I use is "never use a space when you can use a tab, and never use a >tab when you can use an indent". There are a few cases in which you may need >to use a "fixed" or "hard" space (option-space on the keyboard). For example, >the other day someone wanted to creat a centered column of bulleted items. A >tab would not do since you would have to position the tab for each line based >on where it was centered. A couple of option-spaces worked quite well. [Lots of stuff deleted] Perhaps the easiest thing for the students to do is to choose the LaserWriter driver and then type in their paper. When they choose the ImageWriter driver to print out the draft, it will change and not look right, but when they go back to the LaserWriter driver, it will "look right" again. The final copy will look like what they first typed in. Russell mosemann@hoss.unl.edu
awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) (08/15/90)
In article <1990Aug14.214156.15034@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> resnick@cogsci.uiuc.edu (Pete Resnick) writes: >awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) writes: > >>>1) Use tabs and NEVER USE MULTIPLE HARD SPACES. >>the other day someone wanted to creat a centered column of bulleted items. A >>tab would not do since you would have to position the tab for each line based >>on where it was centered. A couple of option-spaces worked quite well. > >Bad choice. This may screw up spacing. You have the choice of left-justified, >right-justified and center tabs as well as left right and center paragraphs >for tables (an under-utilized feature). Each should be used over hard spaces. >I agree that indents should be used over tabs. OK, I'm always willing to re-examine old habits to see if there is a better way. One of the people on the network I manage wanted to set up several lines of topic heads centered on the page horizontally. They also wanted bullets to preceed each topic head on its line. For example: * Topic A * Another Topic, Lets Call It B * And So On, .... Lets ignore WHY they wanted it this way. You also need to assume that there should be a constant amount of space between the bullet (*) and the topic text. We do not want the text centered on either the bullet or the beginning of the text. Now, without setting tabs separately in each line, my solution was to use the option-space between the bullet and the topic text, and to select all the topic lines and use center paragraphs. I have never, in hundreds of Word files, seen a problem with the fixed space. Word does not expand or contract the option-space as it does the standard space. If someone has an easier solution, I'm ready to copy it to disk. >>>2) Never use hard returns to reformat. >>I'd have to disagree here. [reasons deleted] > >Agreed that Paragraph positioning can be a pain and sometimes so can >Keep with next (although I have run into few problems with it), but >space before and after is an easy tool that should be used. Using >hard returns forces Word to make dubious decisions about the tops of >pages and when to keep something together at the end of the page. >Also, if you use styles, changing things is really no problem at all. >Almost nothing I ever do is in Normal style. Using the Format Paragraph options gets into what I call "text programming". I have seen novice users (even those very comfortable with word processing in Word) make selections in the Format dialog that conflict with other document settings, i.e. setting some value for Space After _and_ using double-spacing. Another thing they confuse is the page margin and the left/right indent. The problem with using dialogs to format text is that you have to bring up the dialog to see the settings. By using returns, you can see exactly how much space your lines are taking up (assuming you know the fontsize selected - a simple menu click). I don't know how the hard returns mess up pagination any more than setting breaks before, keep together, etc. Either way you have to tweak the page, and typically our editors will decide where those breaks should be, defeating any "smart-programmed" text. Style sheets are another can of worms, especially linking them. Not only do people have to keep track of what the sheets do, but how changes in the base sheets will cascade down through the descendant sheets. >I think that novices need to slowly learn some features of Word. I agree >that some of the more powerful features are difficult to master, but >some are so useful, you wonder how you ever got along without them and >why you hadn't tried them in the first place. I couldn't agree more. Word is such a powerful tool that people can develop different but equally powerful ways of using it. I have coached people who've used Word since 1.05 and show them ways of getting work done with tools they never realized Word had (or if they did, what could be done with such tools.) - Allen
russotto@eng.umd.edu (Matthew T. Russotto) (08/15/90)
In article <36022@ut-emx.UUCP> awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) writes: >Using the Format Paragraph options gets into what I call "text programming". >I have seen novice users (even those very comfortable with word processing in >Word) make selections in the Format dialog that conflict with other document >settings, i.e. setting some value for Space After _and_ using double-spacing. >Another thing they confuse is the page margin and the left/right indent. > >The problem with using dialogs to format text is that you have to bring up the >dialog to see the settings. By using returns, you can see exactly how much >space your lines are taking up (assuming you know the fontsize selected - a >simple menu click). <FLAME ON (low)> USE THE FLAMING RULER <FLAME OFF> -- Matthew T. Russotto russotto@eng.umd.edu russotto@wam.umd.edu ][, ][+, ///, ///+, //e, //c, IIGS, //c+ --- Any questions?
awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) (08/15/90)
In article <1990Aug15.143724.19341@eng.umd.edu> russotto@eng.umd.edu (Matthew T. Russotto) writes: ><FLAME ON (low)> >USE THE FLAMING RULER ><FLAME OFF> I assume you are referring to the style sheet popup in the ruler. I'd forgotten about that one, but it still has the problem of linked style sheets. As a matter of fact, I encourage people to use the ruler and in fact, all the visible formatting aids to work on documents. In the next couple of months I get to upgrade everyone on my local network to Word 4.0b, and I dread the extra power 4.0 gives in the hands of novices. I just spent an hour "debugging" a document creating by one of my "seed" 4.0 workstations. - Allen
palmer@gap.caltech.edu (David Palmer) (08/16/90)
awessels@walt.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) writes: >In article <1990Aug15.143724.19341@eng.umd.edu> russotto@eng.umd.edu (Matthew T. Russotto) writes: >><FLAME ON (low)> >>USE THE FLAMING RULER >><FLAME OFF> >I assume you are referring to the style sheet popup in the ruler. I'd >forgotten about that one, but it still has the problem of linked style sheets. >As a matter of fact, I encourage people to use the ruler and in fact, all the >visible formatting aids to work on documents. >In the next couple of months I get to upgrade everyone on my local network to >Word 4.0b, and I dread the extra power 4.0 gives in the hands of novices. >I just spent an hour "debugging" a document creating by one of my "seed" 4.0 >workstations. Here's a suggestion: Set up a Word preferences with a set of styles appropriate for the things the people on your network do (e.g. A centered, boldface, 18 point style named 'Title', an indented normal style named 'paragraph' etc.), add them to your menus, strip down the full menus to the things people use (eliminate mail, table of contents, index, etc.), enable the ruler, and do other things to make life easier. Then distribute that preferences file with the program. Power users will reconfigure things as they want them, but novices will be able to write things in 'paragraph' style, for instnace, without realizing that they are using style sheets. -- David Palmer palmer@gap.cco.caltech.edu ...rutgers!cit-vax!gap.cco.caltech.edu!palmer I have the power to cloud men's minds -- or at least my own.