steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) (05/15/91)
I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard which is bundled with the individual user upgrade I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. Is that impression correct or am I just paranoid about being screwed by Apple (again)? Steve Goldfield
omalley@mace.cc.purdue.edu (John O'Malley) (05/15/91)
In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu> steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: >I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the >postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard >which is bundled with the individual user upgrade >I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. Every HyperCard version that Apple has ever bundled with Macs has been a "full-power" version, fully capable of doing user level 5, scripting, etc. It's never been a crippled or runtime-only version. The only difference between the version that's bundled with new Macs and the one you buy from Claris is the Home stack and the number of pre-made stacks that comes with it. The "HyperCard Sampler" now shipping with Macs contains a Home stack with buttons only for the couple of stacks that are included (Audio Help, Appointments with Audio, Addresses with Audio). We don't yet have the golden master disks for System 7, but I believe that System 7's HyperCard Sampler contains the same three stacks. The version you get is definitely HyperCard 2.1. One other thing to note: You get very minimal HyperCard documentation with new Macs. To get the complete set of stacks and all the manuals, you gotta upgrade to the Claris distribution of HyperCard. -John --- John O'Malley / Macintosh / Purdue University / (317) omalley@cc.purdue.edu / Specialist / Computing Center / 494-1787
gaynor@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu (05/16/91)
In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu>, steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: >I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the >postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard >which is bundled with the individual user upgrade >I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. You are correct. The Hypercard 2.1 that you get with the System 7.0 Personal Upgrade Kit is the "Hypercard 2.1 Sampler". In other words, you get the full-bore binary, but a Home stack that only allows User Level 1 and 2, and only 3 other stacks (Appointments with Audio, Addresses with Audio, and Audio Help). Claris says that it won't be releasing a "full" upgrade kit for HC until early June. (Source: phone conversation with Claris upgrade folks). --- Jim Gaynor - AgVAX System Manager - Academic Computing - Ohio State University VMS:<gaynor@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu> UNIX:<gaynor@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> Disclaimer : All opinions expressed here are mine and only mine. So there! Witty Quote: "Think, think, think, think..." - Winnie-the-Pooh, Taoist Bear.
fdm@WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (Frank D. Malczewski) (05/16/91)
In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu> steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: >I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the >postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard >which is bundled with the individual user upgrade >I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. Actually, I'm kind of surprised that there is even a version of HyperCard included at all (considering I just spent $59.xx to upgrade to 2.0...) >Is that impression correct or am I just paranoid >about being screwed by Apple (again)? No, the screwing actually occurs when you have to fork out $$ to upgrade to HyperCard. You are actually getting a freebie here, so you must definitely be getting paranoid. I'd say that you may want to visit your nearest shrink, as you are beginning to take your Mac way too seriously... :-) >Steve Goldfield --Frank Malczewski (fdm@wlv.imsd.contel.com)
elliott@veronica.cs.wisc.edu (James Elliott) (05/16/91)
In <7470@mace.cc.purdue.edu> omalley@mace.cc.purdue.edu (John O'Malley) writes: >One other thing to note: You get very minimal HyperCard documentation >with new Macs. To get the complete set of stacks and all the manuals, >you gotta upgrade to the Claris distribution of HyperCard. And the documentation with the $50 upgrade is pretty good, IMHO. After having HC 2.0 for about two weeks I created myself a nifty stack that won a local creative design contest, and netted me an SE/30 to replace my SE. Just in time for System 7! I sold my old computer, bought a color monitor and am now gleefully enjoying the nice look and feel (not to mention great new functionality) of System 7, and virtual memory to boot. -- Jim Elliott "Like a bridge he'll come between us, not a wall" elliott@veronica.cs.wisc.edu
jah@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Jonathan Helton) (05/16/91)
In article <1991May15.184533.2610@wlbr.imsd.contel.com> fdm@WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (Frank D. Malczewski) writes: >In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu> steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: >>I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the >>postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard >>which is bundled with the individual user upgrade >>I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. > >Actually, I'm kind of surprised that there is even >a version of HyperCard included at all (considering >I just spent $59.xx to upgrade to 2.0...) > >>Is that impression correct or am I just paranoid >>about being screwed by Apple (again)? > >No, the screwing actually occurs when you have to >fork out $$ to upgrade to HyperCard. Apparently Apple's educational upgrade policy allows students and faculty to upgrade to the complete (five floppy disc) version for free. This does not, of course, include manuals. But there is a HyperTalk scripting stack included.
pem@usage.csd.unsw.oz.au (Peter E. Middleton) (05/16/91)
In article <1991May15.170509.370@zardoz.eng.ohio-state.edu>, gaynor@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu writes: > In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu>, steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: > >I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the > >postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard > >which is bundled with the individual user upgrade > >I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. > > You are correct. The Hypercard 2.1 that you get with the System 7.0 > Personal Upgrade Kit is the "Hypercard 2.1 Sampler". In other words, > you get the full-bore binary, but a Home stack that only allows User > Level 1 and 2, and only 3 other stacks (Appointments with Audio, > Addresses with Audio, and Audio Help). > > Claris says that it won't be releasing a "full" upgrade kit for HC > until early June. (Source: phone conversation with Claris upgrade > folks). > Just a comment..... With HyperCard 2.0 in the Home stack type command-right arrow to get to the perferences card. Call up the message box (Cmd-M) and type "magic". This reveals the hidden user level buttons. Set them as desired.......well it works for me on 2.0 :-) regards peter ==================================================================== | Peter E. Middleton usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU | | | | IBM: Apple: | | "Intuitive Graphical Interface "Desktop" | | with workplace extensions". | ====================================================================
pejacoby@mmm.serc.3m.com (Paul E. Jacoby) (05/16/91)
In article <1991May15.170509.370@zardoz.eng.ohio-state.edu> gaynor@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu writes: >You are correct. The Hypercard 2.1 that you get with the System 7.0 >Personal Upgrade Kit is the "Hypercard 2.1 Sampler". > >Claris says that it won't be releasing a "full" upgrade kit for HC >until early June. (Source: phone conversation with Claris upgrade >folks). Jim, did the Claris folks mention whether we people who have paid for the 2.0v2 upgrade already will be getting the 2.1 stuff free? I can't imagine they would make us pay for 2.1 as well...but then again, they do have to fund MacWrite Pro development somehow :-) -- | Paul E. Jacoby, 3M Company | | | Maplewood, MN 55144-1000 | Parachuting? Why jump out of a | | => pejacoby@3m.com | perfectly good airplane? | | (612) 737-3211 | |
elliott@veronica.cs.wisc.edu (James Elliott) (05/17/91)
In <1991May16.131158.14222@mmm.serc.3m.com> pejacoby@mmm.serc.3m.com (Paul E. Jacoby) writes: >Jim, did the Claris folks mention whether we people who have paid for >the 2.0v2 upgrade already will be getting the 2.1 stuff free? I can't >imagine they would make us pay for 2.1 as well...but then again, they do >have to fund MacWrite Pro development somehow :-) I'm a different Jim, but I happened to call Claris yesterday so I can tell you that they will upgrade registered 2.0v2 owners for free. If you call them, they'll flag you to receive the upgrade as soon as it ships. -- Jim Elliott "Like a bridge he'll come between us, not a wall" elliott@veronica.cs.wisc.edu
gsnow@pro-freedom.cts.com (Gary Snow) (05/17/91)
In-Reply-To: message from gaynor@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu |In other words, you get the full-bore binary, but a Home stack that only |allows User Level 1 and 2...... All you have to do is pull up the Message Box (Command-M), and type: set userlevel 5 and you will have a working home stack..... Gary --- UUCP: ogicse!clark!pro-freedom!gsnow | Pro-Freedom: 206/253-9389 ProLine: gsnow@pro-freedom | Vancouver, Wa ARPANet: crash!pro-freedom!gsnow@nosc.mil | Apple*Van InterNet: gsnow@pro-freedom.cts.com | Vancouver Apple Users Group
steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield;232HMB;3-6292;;MF62) (05/17/91)
In article <1991May15.184533.2610@wlbr.imsd.contel.com> fdm@WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (Frank D. Malczewski) writes: #>In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu> steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: #>>I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the #>>postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard #>>which is bundled with the individual user upgrade #>>I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. #> #>Actually, I'm kind of surprised that there is even #>a version of HyperCard included at all (considering #>I just spent $59.xx to upgrade to 2.0...) #> #>>Is that impression correct or am I just paranoid #>>about being screwed by Apple (again)? #> #>No, the screwing actually occurs when you have to #>fork out $$ to upgrade to HyperCard. You are actually #>getting a freebie here, so you must definitely be #>getting paranoid. I'd say that you may want to visit #>your nearest shrink, as you are beginning to take your #>Mac way too seriously... :-) #> #>>Steve Goldfield #> #>--Frank Malczewski (fdm@wlv.imsd.contel.com) Ignoring the misplaced sarcasm above, a lot of the people responding to my comment appear to be ignorant of the well-publicized agreement between Apple and Bill Atkinson, who wrote HyperCard. That agreement provided that Apple had to give HyperCard away. As I stated to someone who sent me mail, I have no objection to Apple charging for manuals when they upgrade HyperCard because it costs money to print the manuals. But the program and its new upgrades should be given away according to the original agreement. In the case of System 7, I am paying ($95 worth at our university price) for the upgrade. Since the old version of HyperCard won't work with System 7, it certainly is logical and consistent with the old agreement to give away the new compatible version with the System 7 upgrade. If the full manuals and stacks aren't included, that appears at least in spirit, if not in letter, to violate the agreement. $95 should pay for quite a bit of printing and shipping. Steve Goldfield
jackb@MDI.COM (Jack Brindle) (05/18/91)
In article <1991May16.223411.28619@agate.berkeley.edu> steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield;232HMB;3-6292;;MF62) writes: >upgrade. Since the old version of HyperCard won't work with >System 7, it certainly is logical and consistent with the old >agreement to give away the new compatible version with the System >7 upgrade. If the full manuals and stacks aren't included, that >appears at least in spirit, if not in letter, to violate the >agreement. $95 should pay for quite a bit of printing and >shipping. Hypercard 2.0v2 works exceedingly well with System 7. I've used it quite a bit over the past several months. Apple uses it extensively for their developer documentation. The new Hypercard adds features that support some of the new System 7 features, but is indeed NOT required for use with System 7. So, you don't need to spend any money, just continue using your old version of Hypercard. Me, I like the new features... Besides, that agreement was between Atkinson and Apple. We don't know what modifications have been made in the ensuing years. Obviously it is not up to US to prosecute... Jack Brindle ham radio: wa4fib/7
hankin@sauron.osf.org (Scott Hankin) (05/18/91)
Attention Claris folks:
If I purchase the System 7.0 Personal Upgrade, do I get to be a
registered HyperCard owner? (I got 2.0 from the Boston Computer
Society, and 2.0v2 from Claris because they were being nice. I am
currently not a registered Claris HyperCard owner/user.)
- Scott
Scott Hankin (hankin@osf.org) | "I don't understand women."
Open Software Foundation | "Do you understand color TV?"
11 Cambridge Center | "No."
Cambridge, MA 02142 | "So what's the problem?"jf@ap.co.umist.ac.uk (John Forrest) (05/18/91)
In article <1991May15.170509.370@zardoz.eng.ohio-state.edu> gaynor@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu writes: >In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu>, steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: >>I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the >>postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard >>which is bundled with the individual user upgrade >>I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. > >You are correct. The Hypercard 2.1 that you get with the System 7.0 >Personal Upgrade Kit is the "Hypercard 2.1 Sampler". In other words, >you get the full-bore binary, but a Home stack that only allows User >Level 1 and 2, and only 3 other stacks (Appointments with Audio, >Addresses with Audio, and Audio Help). > >Claris says that it won't be releasing a "full" upgrade kit for HC >until early June. (Source: phone conversation with Claris upgrade >folks). > Surely this is just the same situation as with system 6..7 and HC2.1 - the system was delivered in the form of level 1 and 2 only, but it is quite easy to get the other levels - you go to the home stack, go to the "previous" card, type "magic" in the command (CMD-M gets the window up), and bingo! Don't ask me why it is - possibly to get some more money out of the innocent? John Forrest Dept of Computation UMIST PS. Why is this in comp.sys.mac.apps and not comp.sys.mac.hypercard?
drc@claris.com (Dennis Cohen) (05/20/91)
pejacoby@mmm.serc.3m.com (Paul E. Jacoby) writes: >Jim, did the Claris folks mention whether we people who have paid for >the 2.0v2 upgrade already will be getting the 2.1 stuff free? I can't >imagine they would make us pay for 2.1 as well...but then again, they do >have to fund MacWrite Pro development somehow :-) Those of you who are _REGISTERED_ owners of 2.0v2 will be getting the 2.1 upgrade for free. See, there is a reason to send those cards in to Customer Support. -- | Dennis Cohen drc@claris.com COHEN2 AFC DCohen 71076,1377 | Internet AppleLink AmerOnline CompuServe | Disclaimer: Any unattributed opinions expressed above are _MINE_!
pejacoby@mmm.serc.3m.com (Paul E. Jacoby) (05/20/91)
In article <12087@claris.com> drc@claris.com (Dennis Cohen) writes: >Those of you who are _REGISTERED_ owners of 2.0v2 will be getting the 2.1 >upgrade for free. See, there is a reason to send those cards in to Customer >Support. >| Dennis Cohen drc@claris.com COHEN2 AFC DCohen 71076,1377 Thanks Dennis for clearing this up. It's nice to see company's use registration cards for something other than demographics and advo-mail lists! I find it interesting that I have actually been CALLED by a number of Mac companies in response to notes scrawled in the impossibly small spaces on the registration cards. I don't think GE or Sears has so much as acknowledged any of my appliance warranty cards :-) -- | Paul E. Jacoby, 3M Company | | | Maplewood, MN 55144-1000 | Parachuting? Why jump out of a | | => pejacoby@3m.com | perfectly good airplane? | | (612) 737-3211 | |
drg@mdaali.mda.uth.tmc.edu (David Gutierrez) (05/22/91)
In article <1991May15.163318.10245@agate.berkeley.edu> steve@violet.berkeley.edu (Steve Goldfield) writes: > I'm getting the strong impression, from some of the > postings I've seen, that the version of HyperCard > which is bundled with the individual user upgrade > I just ordered won't be the "full-power" version. You won't get any version of HyperCard if you get System 7 from a user group. Our licenses don't permit us to distribute it. I don't know if Compu$erve and AOL will have it, but I think the only way you'll be able to get HyperCard 2.1 legally is to buy the System 7 upggrade kit or a HyperCard 2.1 upgrade kit, if Claris decides to come out with one. David Gutierrez drg@mdaali.mda.uth.tmc.edu "Only fools are positive." - Moe Howard
bcarter@claven.idbsu.edu (Bruce Carter) (05/23/91)
In article <5057@lib.tmc.edu> drg@mdaali.mda.uth.tmc.edu (David Gutierrez) writes: >You won't get any version of HyperCard if you get System 7 from a user >group. Our licenses don't permit us to distribute it. I don't know if >Compu$erve and AOL will have it, but I think the only way you'll be able >to get HyperCard 2.1 legally is to buy the System 7 upggrade kit or a >HyperCard 2.1 upgrade kit, if Claris decides to come out with one. It is not available on any online services other than AppleLink to my knowledge. Bruce Carter Internet: bcarter@claven.idbsu.edu Courseware Development Coordinator duscarte@idbsu.idbsu.edu Boise State University Bitnet/CREN: duscarte@idbsu