lefty@TWG.COM (Lefty) (12/12/90)
In article <1990Dec5.042527.7127@nas.nasa.gov> kde@heawk1.gsfc.nasa.gov ( Keith Evans) writes: > Here are some quotes on the superiority of the Lotus Sutra. > > {lengthy quotes from the Lotus Sutra ostensibly extolling the merits of > the Lotus Sutra thoughtfully deleted} > Keith apparently fails to realize the senselessness of using a piece of scripture to establish its own validity. If this were a workable principle, then the fundamentalist Christians would be one-hundred percent right; we would all go to their Hell for not accepting Jesus as our personal savior. I have been increasingly disturbed by Mr. Evans' insistence that his particular sect is the One True Buddhism. His statements to that effect put him in a class with the fundamentalists; his very statements belie any undestanding or commitment to the spirit of Buddhism. One of the cardinal Buddhist sins is sowing dissension within the Sangha. How do you reconcile your actions, Mr. Evans? If you wish to believe that chanting "Nam Myoho Renge Kyo" is the essence of Buddhism, you are welcome to. But to demean the beliefs of other Buddhists in the way that you have is reprehensible. As one who is quite familiar with the Soto and Rinzai sects of Zen, I am personally offended by your constant railing against more mainstream forms of Buddhism. You show a serious ignorance of both the history and range of the Buddhist thought, and if the views expressed in your postings are in any way indicative of the views of the majority of followers of Nichiren Shoshu, then I am sorry to see that a noble system of philosophy has fallen to such depths. > How can you continue your slanderous ways? How can _you_ continue to post this bilge, week after week? Certainly you are not doing Nichiren Shoshu any good in this way. Your arrogant, abusive, annoying and divisive tone speaks volumes, none of them positive. You would quite possibly do well to spend less time chanting, less time posting and more time meditating. > I have more if that is not enough. Please, _please_, spare us. Your posting the entire text of the Lotus Sutra, cross-referenced and annotated, is of no value here. It's easily obtainable in bookstores and libraries for those who might have an interest. Although that's becoming increasingly unlikely, give the tirades with which you've already graced us. > Nam-myoho-renge-kyo, Nam-myoho-renge-kyo. > Respectfully, > Keith Evans kde@heawk1.gsfc.nasa.gov I can only assume that the word "respectfully" is used in your signature for some ironic effect; either that, or it is based on some definition of the word "respect" with which I am totally unfamiliar. -- Lefty (lefty@twg.com) | "And you may ask yourself, D:.O:.D:., C:.M:.C:. | 'How do I work this?'"
kde@heawk1.gsfc.nasa.gov ( Keith Evans) (12/13/90)
>Yu apparently fail to realize the senselessness of using a piece of >scripture to establish its own validity. If this were a workable >principle, then the fundamentalist Christians would be one-hundred percent >right; we would all go to their Hell for not accepting Jesus as our >personal savior. Personally, I am not so concerned about quotes from the sutras, although Nichiren (1222-1282) them alot. It was merely a means of leading them to understand something about Nichiren Daishonin. >I have been increasingly disturbed by your insistence that your >particular sect is the One True Buddhism. Your statements to that effect >put you in a class with the fundamentalists; your very statements belie >any >undestanding or commitment to the spirit of Buddhism. >One of the cardinal Buddhist sins is sowing dissension within the Sangha. >How do you reconcile your actions, Mr. Evans? >If you wish to believe that chanting "Nam Myoho Renge Kyo" is the essence >of Buddhism, you are welcome to. But to demean the beliefs of other >Buddhists in the way that you have is reprehensible. The question is 'What is the cause of suffering?' and 'How does one overcome it?' Actually, you mean to say that very few people are truly committed to their beliefs as they say as long as you believe in something, you're ok. How did this kind of thinking come about? Because theur beliefs don't really improve their life? >You show a serious ignorance of both the history and range of the Buddhist >thought, and if the views expressed in your postings are in any way You mean because Buddha taught in so many expedient ways to help the people, you think that their is more than one Buddhism. Another question is why should you not listen to your Zen teachers and follow Nichiren's teaching? >indicative of the views of the majority of followers of Nichiren Shoshu, >then I am sorry to see that a noble system of philosophy has fallen to >such depths. The fervor of belivevers in no way degrades the philosophy, it just makes it harder for others to understand and want to join. >You would quite possibly do well to spend less time chanting, less time >posting and more time meditating. Here you are doing exactly what you are telling me not to. -- Nam-myoho-renge-kyo, Nam-myoho-renge-kyo. Respectfully, Keith Evans kde@heawk1.gsfc.nasa.gov
tilley@cs.rochester.edu (Dave Tilley) (12/14/90)
I am slightly concerned that this will get worse. Can we please try to lower our anger levels. Until recent days, I have greatly enjoyed this group. But now it seems to be turning into talk.misc.religion in tone. If Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo is your way please feel free to chant. If it is not then fine. Lets move on in the spirit of a Sangha. For those who have not read the Lotus Sutra and are turned off by Nichiren Shoshu, please do not let this turn you off with respect to the Lotus Sutra. I am not at all partial to Nichiren Shoshu. But I have found the Lotus Sutra to be wonderful (along with many others). I happen to be partial to Zen and the writings of Thich Nhat Han (sp?). Thus I am somewhat partial to the Heart Sutra, Avatamsaka Sutra, and those Sutras dealing with mindfulness. I have found nothing in the Lotus to be against these teachings. In fact (as opposed to what has happened here) I have found the Lotus Sutra to be a unifying sutra. For those interested in a reference Threefold Lotus Sutra Sutra of Innumerable Meanings Sutra of the Lotus Flower of the Wonderful Law Sutra of Meditation on the Bodhisattva Universal Virtue Trans. Bunno Kato, Yoshiro Tamura and Kojiro Miyasaka Revisions by: W.E. Soothill, Wilhelm Schiffer and Pier P. Del Campana Kosei Pub. Co. ISBN 4-333-00208-7 Price was $10.95 USA Dave -- +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ Dave Tilley cs.rochester.edu