harnad@psycho.Princeton.EDU (Stevan Harnad) (06/29/91)
More information on mail editors. Read especially the first message. Many thanks to Betty Harris of Texas A & M! > Date: Fri, 28 Jun 91 11:00 CDT > From: <B1H6017@TAMSIGMA.BITNET> > > The VAX READ/EDIT command will invoke a full featured > editor. There are several editors available on VAX systems. The default > editor is the EDT editor. The problem that the VAX users are having has > to do with the default setting for the EDT editor. The EDT editor can be set > to either a full screen editor or a line editor via the system setup file. > > If you get a * when you type read/edit, then type c and then hit the return > key. This should put you into the EDT editor with full editing capabilities > (including full screen editing, scrolling, a find text function and > the ability to delete large blocks of text). To exit the editor, hold > down the control key and type z and you should see the * again. Type > quit (to abandon changes) or exit (to save the file) to exit the editor. > *exit causes our system to save the file as MAIL_#######.TMP. You can then > rename the mail.tmp file to a more descriptive name. > > If the EDT editor does not present the * and does not enter full screen > mode, the problem is most likely in the system file which sets the > defaults for the editor. On our VAX system the login.com file specifies > what editor configuration file the system will use. You will have to edit > this editor configuration file to set the defaults for the editor. > > READ/EDIT Command summary: > > The following commands perform the operations necessary to: > 1). locate the beginning of the announcement that you wish to read > 2). delete announcements that you do not wish to keep > using the VAX EDT editor. > > Note: All numbers in the following command summary are entered via the > numeric (keypad). Comments are enclosed in parentheses () and are > not to be typed. PF# indicates pressing a function key. > > You can use the FIND function in EDT to skip to the desired announcement. > First locate a unique search string from the announcement listings. > The key sequence is: > PF1 > PF3 > search string (type in a unique search string) > 4 (numeric keypad search forward) or 5 (keypad - search backward) > (pressing PF3 again will locate the 2nd occurrence of the string) > > You can use the CUT/PASTE function to delete irrelevant announcements. > Key strokes > . (keypad - beginning of text to be deleted) > use the arrow keys, 8 (keypad) or search function to highlight text > 6 (keypad - cuts highlighted text) > > The most efficient method involves using a combination of find and cut > For instance if I am interested in reading the 3rd announcement but > not the first two announcements and there is a unique string in the > header for the third announcement. Lets say the unique string is > 'APA call'. First move to the beginning of the first announcement. > type > . (keypad) > PF1 > PF3 > APA call > 4 (keypad, search forward) > (you should now be at the 1st occurrence of 'APA call', now use the arrow) > (key to move above the beginning of the 3rd announcement) > 6 (keypad - to cut the first two announcements) > > If you accidentally cut text that you want to keep, you can restore the > deleted text with PF1 6. > > Other useful EDT commands > PF4 delete entire line right of curser > - delete word right > 4 set scroll direction forward/down > 5 set scroll direction backward/up > 8 scroll 16 lines > 7 goto top(5) or bottom(4) of file > PF2 help > > Happy editing, Betty Harris Texas A&M -------------------------------------------------- > Date: Thu, 27 Jun 91 18:47:46 PDT > From: packer@garnet.berkeley.edu > > I imagine that most of us are reading your journal via modem connection > to a mainframe from a remote PC. In such a case, a full screen editor > like vi doesn't help - the constraint is modem speed and terminal > emulation. But use of PC software that allowed scrolling backward and > forward through the pages of the screen image (easy on the Mac and HP > machines) would help a lot, although of course the full text of each > file would first have to be read in full. I don't recall the name of > the software for IBM compatibles that will permit this, though I know > it exists. Martin Packer U. C. Berkeley I use a PS and modem both to edit and read PSYCOLOQUY and vi is just fine. It lets you jump wherever you like in a file, either by jumping to a pattern or marker, or by going back and forth by screenfuls, or by going to any line number. If you're clever, you can even get it to scroll continuously without much trouble. Emacs is even smarter. So PC/modem is not a problem. > Date: Thu, 27 Jun 91 19:08 PDT > From: Vicki Fromkin <IYO1VAF@UCLAMVS.BITNET> > > This has been very helpful. Based on the discussion I screamed loudly > to our e-mail people and find that there is another editor system PDF > Mail that I can use which is more convenient for receiving and > answering mail than the one in general use. So now I will find out how > to use that and hopefully things will be eased. Vicki Find out especially whether there is software for processing email digests, bundled by topic and consisting of several items with headers. > Date: Thu, 27 Jun 91 21:17 CST > From: JIM <CLARK@UWPG02.UWinnipeg.CA> > > Although full screen editors can search for patterns and some can then > scroll screen by screen (e.g., EVE), I find it difficult to believe > that such a system would be easier than doing a single directory > command (dir), which can then be paged if necessary by a return, or > messages read by typing in the number of the message you want to read. > That is how the SAS, SPSS, STATS, WP, etc. bulletin boards work. > Perhaps we need a psychological study (rather than a vote)?? Take care > Jim > > PS. After you've read the first message you want out of the package, > how do you get back to see the rest of the table of contents? Simply > return to start of file? Again in single message system, after reading > one message, you simply type dir and directory picks up where it left > off. > > PPS. Of course, whatever full screen editing system you use, presumably > it has to be invoked for each "Issue" of the journal. Since several > Issues arrive at once, the bundled approach would again seem to lose > out to the single entry approach. Only one issue arrives at one time, but the issue consists of several sections (announcements, discussion, employment), each a separate piece of email. These sections each begin with the list of item headers, then each item is preceded again by its header. The topic under discussion concerns how best to scan those items. An editor allows you to jump straight from the list at the beginning to each item and then back again to the list. That seems to me to be just about equivalent to having each item as a separate piece of mail, accessed by going to the directory. [Note that this discussion of mail editors is not being posted as a regular issue of PSYCOLOQUY, so there is no list of headers.] > [The Following was sent to Jack Hailman, by way of seconding > his original query about the scrolling problem.] > Date: Thu, 27 Jun 91 15:26 EDT > From: WHAYES@ALBION.BitNet > > THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU! You are right on the money about > having to scroll through the screens of Psycoloquy. Even if nothing > can be done about it, I still wanted you to know you have at least one > fervent ally. Regards, Bill Hayes As you see, something CAN be done... > Date: Fri, 28 Jun 91 17:22 +0800 > From: "C. Harry Hui, Psychology Dept., Univ of Hong Kong" > <HUIHARRY@HKUCC.BITNET> > > One simple thing the editors can do is to arrange messages in order of > sizes. The shortest message should come first, and the longest last. > Yes some people need to look at the long, and hence the later, > message. But if you don't have a good editor it is easier to scroll > through short messages to get to the long one, than to scroll through > long messages to sget to the short one you are interested in. I will ask the Assistant Editor to bundle them in short --> long order. > Date: Fri, 28 Jun 1991 08:47 MST > From: "EPHRAIM SCHECHTER (RESEARCH & INFORMATION) 492-7067" > <SCHECHTER_E@CUBLDR.Colorado.EDU> > > For readers using VAX/VMS and DEC's MAIL system-- read/edit n (where > 'n' is the message number) pulls the message into whatever editor > you've told DECMail to use. The default is a clunky line-editor, that > won't serve the purpose we're talking about, but you can set a DECMail > parameter to use any of the editors on your VAX/VMS system--EDT, EVE, > etc. Talk to your computer center folks to find out what editors are > available and what their features are, and how to set Mail to use the > one you pick. > > Ephraim Schechter > Office of Research & Information > University of Colorado-Boulder See earlier for more details. > Date: Fri, 28 Jun 1991 11:37:11 EDT > From: FAC_JLFUNSTO@VAX2.ACS.JMU.EDU > > My preferred solution, though it still means scrolling screen by screen > is to use a screen-capture program, many of which are available on > bulletin boards as shareware or public domain. E.g., SNIPPER, which > doesn't show its cursor on my screen, probably owing to the PROCOMM > version I now use; TELEPORT, which captures whole screens with unwanted > matter; or PCOUTLINE, which allows capture of marked blocks. These can > be saved to floppies or VAX directories, read at leisure, and dumped > back into the communication program, in whole or in part, for > redistribution. Jay Funston Some may prefer this, but the optimal solution for scanning would seem to be one that avoids having to scroll, cut or save: Just the capacity to jump intelligently to the item you want and to scan it. Then if you want to save anything, you can do that in an editor too, including cutting out what you don't want to save. > Date: Fri, 28 Jun 91 11:36 EDT > From: "HAROLD W. GORDON" <HWGORDON@pittvms.BITNET> > > The /EDT editor on the VAX/VMS does indeed give one line at a time, but > a full-screen editor is invoked when the letter, c, (for change to full > screen) is typed at the * prompt. ~C will get you out. The main > difficulty may be, however, the terminal emulation program from a PC. > The capabilities of a full-screen editor are dependent on what keys are > what on the keyboard. > > I like the Table of Contents idea, and I like the idea of key words or > symbols so one can jump from message to message. Harold Gordon See fuller explanation in the first item at the top of this message. > Date: Fri, 28 Jun 91 13:15:51 -0400 > From: psrjsrs@prism.gatech.edu (Ray Shaw) > > This is intended as a personal response, but you may send it on to all > if you wish. > > I was moderately offended by your quick dismissal of my point: > > > From: psrjsrs@prism.gatech.edu (Ray Shaw) > > 2. From Stevan Harnad > > >It's probably not a good idea to scale down our format to the resources > > >of the least powerful viewing system. > > > > In the early days of PC's (early to mid 80's), any programmer who > > agreed with [this] statement would not be writing software for the > > majority of the market. WordPerfect is *still* capable of running in > > 640K and on floppies, though by your argument, it should only be > > available for those with 2 MB RAM and a hard drive... > > Your reply: ----------------------------------------------------------- > PSYCOLOQUY is not a piece of software targeted for the mass market, it > is a scholarly journal. Software can be upgraded subsumptively, whereas > we have to settle on the one solution that is most convenient for > most users. Bundling in digests format seems to be that solution. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > > First of all, this point isn't completely true -- you can change > solutions later if everyone upgrades. Yes the solution can be changed, but the unitary constraint stands: The one solution we pick must be the most convenient for most users. > Secondly, that it is a scholarly journal is irrelevant to my point. > Scholars are a subset of the so-called 'mass market', and as such (as some > of the other replies illustrated) use a wide variety of systems, some > more primitive than I would have guessed. You suggest that if scholars > were the only ones for whom a piece of software was targeted that it > should be available only on what the majority of scholars used. This > is senseless. Whoever is using the "least powerful viewing system" > is out of luck? S/He doesn't deserve access? The emphasis was on scholarly JOURNAL as opposed to mass market software. The solution that is most convenient for most scholars is the one we will try to adopt. > My point still holds -- > > > Since there are so many different systems, any universal system has to > > be available on the least common denominator, or it is functionally > > unavailable to some. That seems to defeat your purpose. > > I have obviously overstated my position -- as the excerpted replies > showed, most of us (myself included) are capable of using the system > as is quite well (I'm on unix, and can do amazing things with e-mail). > > However, I didn't realize that scholarly journals were intended to be > *elitist* methods for disseminating scholarly information. My mistake. > > Ray Shaw The scholarly information will be disseminated in the way that is most convenient for most scholars. Stevan Harnad