bbs@alchemy.UUCP (BBS Administration) (09/22/90)
In article <7085@darkstar.ucsc.edu> unknown@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (The Unknown User) writes: [Stuff Deleted] >>>Or where are the Apple II programmers working on networking? TCP/IP? I >>>know folks who are working on this for the Amiga. Or how about having >>ever heard of ProLine? [Disclaimer deleted] > Isn't TCP/IP related to UUCP? If I'm even correct that they >have something to do with each other, then I think I have something to say >about this.. Well, sort of. UUCP is a collection of programs and files that allow one Unix system to transfer files with another. TCP/IP (Transfer Control Protocol/Internet Protocol) is simply that, a protocol for exchanging information between computers and it's not a set of programs like UUCP. In fact, if you queue up files to be sent to another site with UUCP, they might be sent via TCP/IP; so you can see the difference. Using UUCP to get files ready to send does not imply that UUCP protocols will be employed to make the transfer. At least, this is how I understand things. > ProLine does not use UUCP. From what I understand, all messages >run through some gateway machine that runs both UUCP and whatever >(proprietary?) standard that Morgan Davis's using in ProLine. Yes, from what I understand, the Apple II couldn't handle the CPU requirements to run UUCP. You have to remember, Morgan is trying to support *all* Apple II computers, including the +, so it's not like he can just say "Oh, here's UUCP for ProLine, but you have to have a TransWarped IIGS." Or, maybe he will do just that in the future, who knows? Anyhow, his protocol is called MDSS (Mail Delivery SubSystem) and it's a simple extension of Xmodem (well, there is some simple handshaking, then files are transmitted using Xmodem -- the Xmodem transfer is "standard" 128 byte, checksum, etc.). Now, as for this gateway stuff, yeah. It sort of used to be that way I think. ProLine has a different version of MDSS that talks to a system running Unix BBS software called Pnet. I think this was how articles and mail posted on a ProLine eventually made their way out to the "rest of the world." However, times have changed. Morgan has provided technical information to people who wanted it and now there are other gateways out there. I wrote a package for my Unix BBS software that allows me to send and receive news/mail to/from a site running ProLine. One of my neighbors is an Internet site, so once things arrive here, they reach "the rest of the world" pretty quickly now. I may make this a general purpose package and sell it to sites running standard news software on a Unix site, or maybe someone else will do it and release it in the public domain. It was rather simple to write, the hardest part was finding an implementation of Xmodem that worked well with ProLine (that is to say, all the Unix versions I got were probably wrong, or tried to use CRCs or something). > What I am interested in is true UUCP so that I could get >permission from my school (I'm not saying they'd even do it, I just >mean theoretically) and get my own newsfeed from the UNIX machine I have >an account on. This would be for a BBS or something. Well, you may want a "special" way of doing this. On most Unix sites, the news directory and all articles in the news system, have read permission enabled for "other" (meaning anyone). Since this is true, and since you have an interactive account, you could batch these articles together, and compress them and send them using Zmodem or something. For a while, when going to college, this is what I did for my BBS. I wrote a few C programs to do it, and I was really happy. Maybe the thing I wrote would be easier for you... I dunno, but there are lots of options out there now-a-days. If you use an MS-DOS (Ick, I didn't type that, it was someone else :) BBS, then you might be able to use Zmodem and compress the articles, but since ProLine can't do that right now, you might be better off using the gateway thing I wrote or something similar. > One question about ProLine that I have is this though: Does every >ProLine site in the country have to call up that one gateway (thus >messages get out/in daily or hourly or whatever but potentially HUGE phone >bills) or do messages 'jump' from one node to the next (thus possibly >days or WEEKS until a message gets out/in)??? I think I answered this already. But there's something else that might interest you. When I was writing my conference system for Unix, I had to learn about how USENET articles are distributed. They use what might be called a "flooding" technique in that once a new article arrives at a given site, a copy is sent to all other neighboring sites that don't already have a copy. This seems to distribute the article pretty quickly. I think the same goes for ProLine. Once an article is received via a Unix gateway, it is sent to a ProLine, who then sends it to it's neighbors, and then they do the same thing until everyone who wants a copy, has a copy. Quite simple, and efficient. Hope this helps clear the air! -- John John Donahue, Senior Partner | UUCP: ucrmath!alchemy!{bbs, gumby} | The Future Alchemy Software Designs | INET: {bbs, gumby}@alchemy.UUCP | Begins Now -------------------+---------+-------------------------------------+----------- Communique On-line | +1-714-243-7150 {3, 12, 24, 96HST} Bps. 8-N-1 | Next Wave: Information System | Alchemy Software Designs Support System | Communique