Joe_Luzzi.FULLERTON_CC@QMBRIDGE.CALSTATE.EDU (Joe Luzzi) (11/06/90)
Time: 10:00 AM
Date: 10/26/90
Subject: Apple ///
With all this talk about Apple ///, I'm curious as to the specifics of the
machine: cpu, memory size, etc... What made it different than the II?
Thanks.
=============================================================================
Joe M. Luzzi
California State University, Fullerton
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
Joe_Luzzi.fullerton_cc@qmbridge.calstate.edu space for rent
Joe@csu.fullerton.edu
ljmluzz@calstate.edu
Genie: JM.LUZZI
AOL : JMLUZZI
=============================================================================tmaster@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (The Master) (11/06/90)
In article <9011051918.AA26746@apple.com> Joe_Luzzi.FULLERTON_CC@QMBRIDGE.CALSTATE.EDU (Joe Luzzi) writes: > > Time: 10:00 AM > Date: 10/26/90 >Subject: Apple /// >With all this talk about Apple ///, I'm curious as to the specifics of the >machine: cpu, memory size, etc... What made it different than the II? > >Thanks. Apple /// was a more powerful machine than than ][, and arguably even more powerful than a //e or //c. What it had: 6502 microprocessor running at 2 mhz peak. The processor slows down for memory refresh and screen refresh, giving effective speed of 1.4 mhz. However, screen refresh can be turned off, so it operates at 1.8 mhz (not that for certain devices it also slows down for 1 mhz.) 128k ram minimum. There were two piggyback memory boards produced by apple - one and only one was always installed. The 12 volt version would support up to 128k, the 5 volt would go up to 256k. On Three produced one which would go up to 512k which is the maximum memory that the apple /// can handle as 'normal' memory. The memory was managed by bank switching (address 0-2000 and A000-FFFF would always be in memory, and you bank switch in the 2000-BFFF range.) Also enhanced indirect addressing allowed loading/storing of values in other banks. The mechanism behind this was you use and indirect store on the zero page, and in another location (+1600 from zero page) you stored the bank number. The system had 80 columns built in along with upper and lower case. The entire system was ram based, including the character set (128 distinct printing characters + the inverse of these characters) and keyboard layout. It also supported a 40 column color text mode where the foreground and background color of each character position could be specified (16 colors available.) Its graphics modes were 140x192, 280x192 (two of these with varying color restrictions) and 560x192. It has a built is rs232 port, video port (which with simple circuit can be used to drive a rgb monitor), 2 game ports (one of which can be used for a silentype printer) and a disk drive port in which up to 3 disk ///'s (140k drives) could be hooked up (The system has 1 interal drive.) It also has 4 slots, with very similiar pinouts to the normal apple // slots. It was designed to have a clock built in, but the company that was supposed to make the clock chip didn't finish it on time. However, the chip is now available for about $10, so plug that in plus a few batteries for backup and you have a clock also. Ulike the //e however, which used many custom chips to keep the chip count low, the apple /// uses pretty all standard ls chips plus a few roms and proms. The chip count, not including ram, is around 100. SOS, the Sophisticated Operating System, stores files in the same way as prodos. To make a sos call, a break instruction is used with the call code and a pointer following the break. It supported interrupts, so devices such as the serial port and keyboard has buffering. The Master tmaster@ucscb.ucsc.edu
$CSD211@LSUVM.BITNET (Mark Orr) (11/06/90)
>Subject: Apple /// >With all this talk about Apple ///, I'm curious as to the specifics of the >machine: cpu, memory size, etc... What made it different than the II? >Thanks. >============================================================================= >Joe M. Luzzi >California State University, Fullerton >/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ >Joe_Luzzi.fullerton_cc@qmbridge.calstate.edu space for rent >Joe@csu.fullerton.edu >ljmluzz@calstate.edu >Genie: JM.LUZZI >AOL : JMLUZZI >============================================================================= I have an Apple ///. It's a nice computer. Essentially it's a big heat sink with a computer inside. The specs are as follows: - 2.0 MHz 6502B - 256k RAM (the original had 128k, and memory boards which attach directly to the motherboard have been made that hold 512k) - using the Apple II Emulation disk, a 48k Apple II (with integer or applesoft ROMS) may be emulated. Most software works with the emulation mode, but a few crash. Very rarely, the sound doesn't come out right. The emulation disk that comes with the system does a pretty good job emulating a II+ but some people have modified it to use the ///'s advanced features (i.e. 80 colums, upper and lower case characters, the enhanced high resolution modes, etc., but there is no way to get anymore than 48k) - The /// has two "new" graphic screens. a 140x192 medium res. screen (16 colors) and a 560x192 double high-res. screen (monochrome) - I believe there is an enhanced sound generator (as well as the old II sound hardware). I think it's a single 6-bit oscillator or something (the manual says it's a 64 tone sound generator) - two DB-9 joystick ports - the only thing these were ever used for was to drive the silentype printer (they did make one joystick - the Cursor /// - but from my experience these were essentially reject Joystick II's) - a built in serial port - a DB-15 RGB output w/NTSC out (Apple II programs ran only in black and white) - a disk controller that would daisy chain 4 disk ///'s - 4 Apple /// slots - no bulit in languages (4k ROM, self-test and system monitor only. The /// was a disk based system) - SOS: the Sophisticated Operating System...the precursor to ProDOS. Confusing for the novice to set up...but overall a clean unobtrusive OS. Vitally important that you get SOS and System Utilites upgrades...the older version sometimes damaged disks. Later an enhanced Apple /// plus came out ('84). Lasted less than a year. It added interlaced graphics and reduced chip count. Overall, there were about a quarter of a million Apple ///'s sold. But it would suprise you how much software was written for that machine. ---------------------------- Mark Orr ! $CSD211@LSUVM.SNCC.LSU.EDU ! ----------------------------
ART100@psuvm.psu.edu (Andy Tefft) (11/06/90)
And don't forget, in the first bunch IC's tended to wiggle out of their sockets (thermal expansion and contraction), which really hampered the machine from taking off (not as bad as the PCjr's chicklet-style keyboard did though!) as Apple replaced motherboards.
NOWAKO09@SNYBUFVA.BITNET (APPLE //GS - THE POWER TO BE YOUR BEST) (11/06/90)
Why did Apple kill off the ///? It seemed like an enhanced //e
before the //e existed. Was there marketing troubles? Backlog? This was
before the Mac so it had no internal competition (not he ][ 'cause it could
be considered to have evolved from the ][ line). It sounds like it was a
respectable machine for the day.
BTW whats the differance between a Lisa and a low end Mac? I've been
seeing ads for reconditioned Lisa's and was wondering....
- Joe Nowakowski
- Nowako09@snybufvatmaster@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (The Master) (11/06/90)
In article <0B88F2251FFF80AE0F@snybufva.bitnet> NOWAKO09@SNYBUFVA.BITNET (APPLE //GS - THE POWER TO BE YOUR BEST) writes: > > Why did Apple kill off the ///? It seemed like an enhanced //e >before the //e existed. Was there marketing troubles? Backlog? This was >before the Mac so it had no internal competition (not he ][ 'cause it could >be considered to have evolved from the ][ line). It sounds like it was a >respectable machine for the day. > BTW whats the differance between a Lisa and a low end Mac? I've been >seeing ads for reconditioned Lisa's and was wondering.... > - Joe Nowakowski > - Nowako09@snybufva There were a few problems.. 1) It had early reliability problems because apple used cheap sockets for the chips, so the chips became disconnected through thermal expansion/ contraction. 2) There was not alot of initialy software released for it. The hoped for market was business, but with not alot of software, not many places bought them. 3) It was fairly expensive. I believe at the time it came out, you were looking at around $5000 (this included a 5 meg profile I believe.). The //e also came out a little while afterwards, putting many of the new features of the /// (80 col, lowercase, more memory) in that computer. The //e was cheaper however, and with the fact that there wasn't much software for the /// that was for the //, that started eroding it probably. I remember some old apple adds in Solftalk and such where they had an apple /// displayed and next to it was a //e. 3-EZ Pieces (appleworks for the apple ///) was an attempt to revive it also (could use same files on a /// and //e). Apple did release a ///+. The main things it added was a //e type keyboard (normal apple /// keyboard has no direct delete key, but by pressing control \ (or is it control |) a delete code can be generated on the old apple ///. The ///+ also included the clock chip and interlaced graphics/text (a switch on the side could turn this on/off.). It might have also included 256k ram standard. All of these additions were available for a normal apple /// however. The clock chip is pretty much a doit it yourself job, the interlace (I believe) is largely a rom upgrade for the video rom. The keyboard is getting a new keyboard. Apple ///'s are uncommon, apple ///+'s are downright rare (I don't think I have ever seend a ///+ personally. Not including the ///'s I own I have probably seen about half a dozen other ///'s around however (a few for sale at swap meets and so forth..) The Master tmaster@ucscb.ucsc.edu
$CSD211@LSUVM.BITNET (Mark Orr) (11/07/90)
Hey /// users. A neat trick: Sometime ago I went through my library of broken (no copy protection) software on my /// in II+ emulation mode. Once I BLOADed the software into memory, I hit Control-Open Apple-RESET to pop the /// into it's system monitor. I found that patches of the II's memory are preserved. I found that two programs: and old game called Sabotage and a newer one, Activisions' H.E.R.O. ran perfectly when I executed (G'd) them from the Apple /// monitor. Anybody know of any more?? These programs ran at double their normal speed (sound effects and all)...You should hear the machine language sound effects from Apple Trek (the old integer trek game from cassette days) ----------------------------- Mark Orr ! $CSD211@LSUVM.SNCC.LSU.EDU ! -----------------------------
cbdougla@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu (Collin Broad Douglas) (11/07/90)
I was aware that the Apple /// uses a proprietary microprocessor with the
6502A as a 'major' component (at least that's what it says in my 1980 product
overview catalog :) )
Collin Douglas
cbdougla@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu