scottg@gnh-starport.cts.com (Scott Gentry) (01/12/91)
Since the start, the perception in general seems to be that there aren't applications available for the the Apple IIGS. In response to this, I'd like to ask, very sincerely, just what applications users would like to see? I asked this question on America Online and _nobody_ answered. The one category of application that I don't really want to hear about is the game. It is my belief that it is a tiring battle to get a game published on the IIGS, so please limit responses to productivity applications since publication of applications isn't as uphill a climb. My purpose is to try to get a general feeling about what needs to be done to "raise the stakes" in the IIGS market. So, please, before answering the one question asked above, think about your response in terms of what _you_ need to make the GS a more productive machine for you. Additionally, think of a price range for such an application. If you desire, you can email your response to me at: uunet!ingr!ne1300!brnded!scott or at the address in the .sig entry below. Thank you! _______________________________________________________________________________ | Scott Gentry * ALPE AFL Scott * I never said that!| | 2051 Mercator Drive * GEnie W.GENTRY * But you never | | Reston, VA 22091 * UUCP: uunet!ingr!ne1300! * know! | | (703) 264-5652 * brnded!scott * Do You? | |_____________________________________________________________________________|
johns@pro-library.cts.com (System Administrator) (01/13/91)
In-Reply-To: message from scottg@gnh-starport.cts.com > Since the start, the perception in general seems to be that there aren't > applications available for the the Apple IIGS. In response to this, I'd like > to ask, very sincerely, just what applications users would like to see? I > <stuff deleted> > My purpose is to try to get a general feeling about what needs to be done to > "raise the stakes" in the IIGS market. So, please, before answering the one > question asked above, think about your response in terms of what _you_ need to > make the GS a more productive machine for you. Additionally, think of a price > range for such an application. Scott, I would like to see a finder utility to view text for the gs. There is one out to view apple preferred, SHR, paintworks graphics by clicking the mouse twice. It is called "Finder.View", by Jupiter Systems. It does not state the author. It is sharware, and I believe the fee is only $5, which to me is worth more, just for being a time saver alone in searching graphic files. Having one for the ability to do this for text would be great. I know we have nda's for this, but with all the conflicts with gsos, maybe someone could come up with a "Finder.Text". Number two request of course, would be multitasking capability for the gs, hopefully compatible with existing software. It would be really nice to have this feature running a bbs system, not to mention dl'ing files while finsihing other projects. I would not care if it slowed the system down, because I can make up for some of the loss with a speedup card. I need multi-function capabilities, and would be willing to pay well for this feature. Third, and last request, is a "Text Editor" with a fairly larger buffer. I use Proterm alot, like it all around, but am not able to load text files above 32k, I believe it is. It works really well for all the functions I need in editing text files, except for the buffer size, and having to load a terminal program when I don't need one. Maybe the double click mouse feature could be included in this one, as in the finder.view above. With clicking on a file from the finder, features as in proterm, and a larger buffer, it would be great for me, and as for price, again I would pay whatever was fair for the author. And, thanks for asking....Can I expect them all by next week. :-) John ---- ProLine: johns@pro-library | Pro-Library BBS 206/694-3276 UUCP: orgicse!clark!pro-library!johns | 3/12/2400 baud, 24hr, register ARPA: crash!pro-library!johns@nosc.mil | Apple*Van, Vancouver, WA. Inet: johns@pro-library.cts.com | Vancouver Apple Users Group ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
toddpw@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Todd P. Whitesel) (01/14/91)
johns@pro-library.cts.com (System Administrator) writes: >I would like to see a finder utility to view text for the gs. There is one >out to view apple preferred, SHR, paintworks graphics by clicking the mouse ... >Having one for the ability to do this for text would be great. I know we have I have one. It's called TextView and I wrote it to figure out how to figure out which files were double-clicked on. TextView currently does not page, making it very annoying with large text files (it wasn't a project in itself, although I think there is enough interest to warrant me finishing it up once the first LHG beta is ready -- a few days, OK, unknown?). Todd Whitesel toddpw @ tybalt.caltech.edu
taob@pnet91.cts.com (Brian Tao) (01/14/91)
From johns@pro-library.cts.com (System Administrator): > I would like to see a finder utility to view text for the gs. [..snip..] > Third, and last request, is a "Text Editor" with a fairly larger buffer. > I use Proterm alot, like it all around, but am not able to load text > files above 32k, I believe it is. It works really well for all the > functions I need in editing text files, except for the buffer size, and > having to load a terminal program when I don't need one. Maybe the > double click mouse feature could be included in this one, as in the > finder.view above. With clicking on a file from the finder, features as > in proterm, and a larger buffer, it would be great for me, and as for > price, again I would pay whatever was fair for the author. And, thanks > for asking....Can I expect them all by next week. :-) There is a good utility called GSXEdit 1.0 recently uploaded to comp.binaries.apple2. Although it doesn't support opening files from the Finder, the author (and damned if I could remember his name...) has that feature listed in his "have to haves" in the docs. GSXEdit has great potential to be an all-purpose text editor. I think it is the only editor which will let you change the text and background colour info in Teach documents. Worth taking a look at. Brian T. Tao {taob@pnet91.cts.com} || Computer guru? Someone who got University of Metro Toronto || their computer a couple of weeks Scarberia, ON, MIC 3A8 *B-) || before you did. (Alvin Toffler)
mcgu5464@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Ronald J Mcguire) (01/14/91)
In article <1991Jan13.113530.22929@clark.edu> johns@pro-library.cts.com (System Administrator) writes: <Stuff from Scotts original post deleted> >I would like to see a finder utility to view text for the gs. There is one >out to view apple preferred, SHR, paintworks graphics by clicking the mouse >twice. It is called "Finder.View", by Jupiter Systems. It does not state the >author. It is sharware, and I believe the fee is only $5, which to me is >worth more, just for being a time saver alone in searching graphic files. >Having one for the ability to do this for text would be great. I know we have >nda's for this, but with all the conflicts with gsos, maybe someone could come >up with a "Finder.Text". I asked for this a while back, and noone seemed interested. I would also like to make one suggestion to Jupiter, and wouldn't send in my $5 til then, that scrolling be added so that you can see *ALL* the file, and not just part of it. Considering that this is a low level task, executing toolbox calls, $5 would be about as high as it could go. Of course, this may discourage authors, but I'm only (if I do) sending in $10 for cosmo which is a far superior program. (Before you flame me, I don't play games, and therefore would not have bought the program anyway. If I feel that I play it enuf in the future...) Small tools like these programs make the finder *VERY* *VERY* useful. I also have a non-payed for copy of ProSel which I had to use only once (Mr Fixit when Copy][+ fucked up my sys disk) and will probably never use again because I like the finder so much. >Number two request of course, would be multitasking capability for the gs, A MMU and MultiFinder would be great! But until then I'd like a NDA that would print AWGS files. This would alow me to work on my document while printing it. as NDAs have already proven to run many at once. I don't care how slow the editing would be, it's still better than nothing, and with a buffer... This I feel is at least a realistic and specific goal, not "multitasking" which is quite vague. Now I've forgotten what my original request was going to be, but you can be assured that I'll remember it as soon as I power down! Dan
mcgu5464@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Ronald J Mcguire) (01/14/91)
Now I remember! (I knew that would happen!) Since the Apple and the Commodore 64 both run off of basicaly the same processor, I'd like a C64 emulator that would read C64 disks and run the programs. Basicaly a lot of interuping and repointing for all the builtin C64 registers. The E wouldn't be able to handle this, but the GS should. (I have a lot of old EDUCATIONAL software the 64 that I'd like to run in the classroom where there are only apples) It would need to handle joystick emulation and everthing. The GS should be fast enuf for this and since I have 2 meg and will upgrade soon, doing even a dump of the whole ROMs shouldn't be unreasonable (considering that no program can use more than 64K as the 64 is not expandable). This would be ultra tedium tho, and I don't know if anyone else would be interested, but I may be willing to pay $25-~60 (as a 64 can be had for under $60). It may be better suited for a kind soul with nothing better to do with their time... Dan
jpenne@ee.ualberta.ca (Jerry Penner) (01/15/91)
In article <8906@uwm.edu> mcgu5464@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Ronald J Mcguire) writes: >Now I remember! (I knew that would happen!) > >Since the Apple and the Commodore 64 both run off of basicaly the >same processor, I'd like a C64 emulator that would read C64 disks >and run the programs. Basicaly a lot of interuping and repointing >for all the builtin C64 registers. The E wouldn't be able to handle >this, but the GS should. (I have a lot of old EDUCATIONAL software >the 64 that I'd like to run in the classroom where there are only >apples) It would need to handle joystick emulation and everthing. >The GS should be fast enuf for this and since I have 2 meg and will >upgrade soon, doing even a dump of the whole ROMs shouldn't be >unreasonable (considering that no program can use more than 64K >as the 64 is not expandable). This would be ultra tedium tho, and I >don't know if anyone else would be interested, but I may be willing >to pay $25-~60 (as a 64 can be had for under $60). It may be better >suited for a kind soul with nothing better to do with their time... > >Dan It would be next to impossible to implement the C=64's text mode because they have redefinable character sets. This makes graphical scrolling very possible at high speed since you're only pushing 2K of memory around rather than 32K for superhires (which is what you'd need to emulate it with). Maybe the other stuff wouldn't be hard to emulate, the sound is not too complex, but the GS is only 2.5 times as fast. Maybe if it was 10-20 times as fast, but then there'd be so much good stuff for the GS that emulating a C=64 wouldn't be even thought of except maybe as a "just to see if it can be done" type project. -- ------------- Jerry Penner alberta!bode!jpenne Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
chm114u@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au (01/15/91)
In article <8905@uwm.edu>, mcgu5464@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Ronald J Mcguire) writes: > In article <1991Jan13.113530.22929@clark.edu> johns@pro-library.cts.com (System Administrator) writes: > <Stuff from Scotts original post deleted> > >I would like to see a finder utility to view text for the gs. There is one > >out to view apple preferred, SHR, paintworks graphics by clicking the mouse There is a freeware program available called "About" and written by some members of the Wellington Apple Users Group of New Zealand. It is a text reader, with some file launching ability, which installs an icon in the ICONS folder which then allows double clicking of text files. It opens the text in a scrollable window but will only load the first part (I forget how long) of a large file. It was distributed sometime ago in the disk version of A2-central. I find it to be a very useful utility which works very well. Mike.
rhyde@ucrmath.ucr.edu (randy hyde) (01/15/91)
>>>>>>
Since the start, the perception in general seems to be that there aren't
applications available for the the Apple IIGS. In response to this, I'd like
to ask, very sincerely, just what applications users would like to see? I
asked this question on America Online and _nobody_ answered. The one
category of application that I don't really want to hear about is the game. It
is my belief that it is a tiring battle to get a game published on the IIGS, so
please limit responses to productivity applications since publication of
applications isn't as uphill a climb.
<<<<
Let's see...
I want Tex, Latex, Framemaker, FLEX, BISON, a decent C++ compiler, Turbo Pascal
(Turbo C++ too, what the heck), a decent assembler (if only Brian Fitzgerald
would finish LISA816), a really good drawing program (Canvas 3.0), TrueType,
Multifinder, a decent mouse-based text editor (simple to use, yet powerful),
ICON, SNOBOL4, SETL, LISP, Prolog, a decent linker, a decent database program
(like 4th Dimension or Omnis 5), ...
Some of these aren't "applications", but you get the idea.
*** Randy Hydellee@gnh-starport.cts.com (Larry Lee) (01/17/91)
You want something that operates like FINDER.VIEW. Ummm, Wings, by Vitesse, does much of what you are requesting. There is always a disk-catalog on the desktop, and the filetype is designated by a little icon. When Wings is set in "Auto mode", it will perform a certain function with a highlighted file is selected. For instance, if you select a $C0 pic and press return (double click, etc), Wings will display the picture for you. 320 and 640 modes. It will also display textfiles and do a wealth of other things that make it an excellent program. | ProLine.: llee@gnh-starport | Millions long for immortality who | | UUCP....: crash!gnh-starport!llee | don't know what to do on a rainy | | InterNet: llee@gnh-starport.cts.com | Sunday afternoon. | | AO .....: Watch this space! | -- Susan Ertz |
shankar@SRC.Honeywell.COM (Subash Shankar) (01/18/91)
In article <14880@smoke.brl.mil> gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes: >On my "to do" list is a port of the "sam" editor to the IIGS. There are >a few serious obstacles to be overcome, though: > 1. It runs as two processes, one to manage the files and one to > manage the user interface. These would have to be merged into a > single coordinated process, not an easy job. This may not be that big an obstacle. Back in the good old days, when I actually had time to program (on a //e back then), I wrote a syntax directed program ediitor which had multiple types of tasks: user interface, data structure manipulation, and the syntax stuff (for lack of a better term). At any time, more then one instance of each task could be in the queue, from which it would be fetched, processed, and various other processes would be placed in the queue. The queue also maintained dependency graph information between the different processes (e.g. display updates are immediate, while the corresponding data structure updates may be updated later - so, you need to maintain dependencies between the data structure updates and later screen views of the corresponding information). Although this needed some thought to structuring the code modules, it wasn't particularly hard to write, nor was performance unacceptably slow (the queue was a killer to write though, since it needed large amounts of cycle saving and the standard 6502 self modifying code tricks, if I recall correctly). I'm not advocating such a kludgish approach (especially since I never finished it and went on to better things before it was debugged (after finding out that 48/64K just didn't hack it for such a memory intensive implementation)), but I'm just saying that it might not be so hard to implement. --- Subash Shankar Honeywell Systems & Research Center MN65-2100 voice: (612) 782 7558 US Snail: 3660 Technology Dr., Minneapolis, MN 55418 shankar@src.honeywell.com srcsip!shankar
gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) (01/18/91)
In article <1991Jan17.202210.26092@src.honeywell.com> shankar@SRC.Honeywell.COM (Subash Shankar) writes: >In article <14880@smoke.brl.mil> gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes: >>On my "to do" list is a port of the "sam" editor to the IIGS. There are >>a few serious obstacles to be overcome, though: >> 1. It runs as two processes, one to manage the files and one to >> manage the user interface. These would have to be merged into a >> single coordinated process, not an easy job. >I'm just saying that it might not be so hard to implement. Thanks for the suggestions. Whatever solution I come up with would have to be via portable C; I would incorporate this into the master BRL "sam" sources that I maintain as a sort of distribution service to keep people from pestering Rob too much about "sam". (One needs an AT&T UNIX System ToolChest "sam" license or else permission from Rob before I'll send the sources.) I'm pretty familiar with concurrent programming practicalities and know what needs to be done here, but without a portable method of implementing coroutines in portable C this IS a fairly difficult task.
prophet@oxy.edu (Dale Bruce LaFountain) (01/19/91)
* pn eopy1 eopy2 eopn3 ffy hfy eon lm 001 rm 075 pi 000 ps 001 pl 060 hd 000 ft 000 fp 001 ss 000 014 000 000 ts 007 012 Another application that I would like to see is a converter supporting JPEG compression (Todd P.W., would this be easy to implement with LHG??). It is a newer form of compression that is many times better than the GIF algorithm in its compression of picture data. I believe it dumps some of the color table information that is indistinguishable by the human eye, along with some other tricks that I'm not sure I can describe at this point. If anyone is up to tackling this one, I can probably track down some source code for it. Just a suggestion... -Dale LaFountain prophet@oxy.edu
mvk@itsgw.rpi.edu (Michael V. Kent) (01/20/91)
In article <m0ixFQM-00003aC@jartel.info.com> kimbrennan@gnh-starport.cts.com (Kim Brennan) writes: >GS Applications that I'd like to see. > >A true GS/OS Terminal program. While ProTERM may be good (opinions vary) it is >still an 8 bit program, which means it can not access even half of my hard >drive partitions...... Try out SCSI.Part by (I think) Richard Bennett. This will let any 8-bit program read up to four drives from one SCSI controller. It does this by mapping the drives to another slot. (Hey, I've got two drives attached to my Super Serial Card :) Mike
-Rich-@cup.portal.com (Richard Sherman Payne) (01/21/91)
>Another application that I would like to see is a converter supporting JPEG >compression (Todd P.W., would this be easy to implement with LHG??). It is >a newer form of compression that is many times better than the GIF >algorithm in its compression of picture data. I believe it dumps some of >the color table information that is indistinguishable by the human eye, >along with some other tricks that I'm not sure I can describe at this point. > >If anyone is up to tackling this one, I can probably track down some source >code for it. > >Just a suggestion... > >-Dale LaFountain >prophet@oxy.edu There is a shareware program out for JPEG conversion for the IBM, and one for the SParc as well. I have tried it on a Sun4, and it is slowwww. I think you would have time to read _War_and_Peace_ before you get your gif to view if this was implimented on a //gs. Also, a file packed with jpeg is not guarenteed to unpack to the same file. I have heard others who have compared the images say that images that have been packed this way are seriously degraded. On the plus side, a 690K gif compressed to 149K. It does compress well. But it does not seem like something the // users can use. Rich -Rich-@cup.portal.com
taob@pnet91.cts.com (Brian Tao) (01/23/91)
From chm114u@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au: > There is a freeware program available called "About" and written > by some members of the Wellington Apple Users Group of New > Zealand. It is a text reader, with some file launching ability, > which installs an icon in the ICONS folder which then allows > double clicking of text files. Mark Cinelli is the author of GSXEdit, a very promising shareware text editor for the GS. It was posted a little while ago to comp.binaries. It's a stand-along application, and it supports Teach files. Check this one out. Brian T. Tao {taob@pnet91.cts.com} || Computer guru? Someone who got University of Metro Toronto || their computer a couple of weeks Scarberia, ON, MIC 3A8 *B-) || before you did. (Alvin Toffler)
lucifer@world.std.com (Kevin S Green) (01/26/91)
In article <392@generic.UUCP> taob@pnet91.cts.com (Brian Tao) writes: >From chm114u@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au: > >> There is a freeware program available called "About" and written >> by some members of the Wellington Apple Users Group of New >> Zealand. It is a text reader, with some file launching ability, >> which installs an icon in the ICONS folder which then allows >> double clicking of text files. The program "ABOUT" will be uploaded by me to comp.binaries.apple2 due to a specific request by Joel Sumner for a program with its capabilities. It is in .bsq format and is approx. 54K. -- Kevin S. Green / lucifer@world.std.com / {xylogics;uunet}!world!lucifer Party naked... /AOL: Gargoth / Pro-line: kgreen@pro-angmar
ericmcg@pnet91.cts.com (Eric Mcgillicuddy) (01/28/91)
The GS is well supported in terms of most games, I'd rather have quality than quantity any day, however I would like to see some good simulations, Flight Simulator GS, 688, Sands of Fire, etc. For productivity, I am looking for a good Word Processor to replace Mousewrite. I was thinking of Graphic Writer III, but I do not want a DTP program, I need a user definable dictionary, possibly a thesaurus, standard GS font support and occasional colour text. It must also be supported by the publisher (which is the main reason I need to replace Mousewrite, there are no bug fixes forthcoming and there are many annoying bugs). I general, The product must sell for less than $100 mail order, be hard drive installable (don't laugh some aren't, usually no quit to Finder option), and be a desktop application. A desktop telecomm application as good as Proterm, preferably better, would be welcome. Does this help? UUCP: bkj386!pnet91!ericmcg INET: ericmcg@pnet91.cts.com