stc7@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Steven T Chiang) (03/28/91)
Has anyone heard the rumor that the Apple II will be featured on 60 Minutes (the tv news show). I saw a post about it on AO that said something to the effect that the Apple II would be presented as a computer abandoned by Apple Inc, and it gave an address to mail letters to, in hope that they will read them on the air. Any comments? And does anyone know the date of the show? _______________________________________________ _______________ | Steve Chiang Apple //gs Forever! | Coming Soon: | |-----------------------------------------------|---------------| | Columbia University in the Harlem area :P | DreamGrafix: |
MQUINN@UTCVM.BITNET (03/28/91)
On Thu, 28 Mar 91 08:37:16 GMT <info-apple-request@APPLE.COM> said: > Has anyone heard the rumor that the Apple II will be featured >on 60 Minutes (the tv news show). I saw a post about it on AO that >said something to the effect that the Apple II would be presented as a >computer abandoned by Apple Inc, and it gave an address to mail >letters to, in hope that they will read them on the air. > > Any comments? And does anyone know the date of the show? Yes. I posted that message from AO to the net a few days ago. I don't know the date. All I've heard is what was in that one message on AO. If you hear anything else, let us know. _______________________________________________ _______________ >| Steve Chiang Apple //gs Forever! | Coming Soon: | >|-----------------------------------------------|---------------| >| Columbia University in the Harlem area :P | DreamGrafix: | ---------------------------------------- BITNET-- mquinn@utcvm <------------send files here pro-line-- mquinn@pro-gsplus.cts.com
mcgu5464@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Ronald J Mcguire) (03/29/91)
I found this filtered down to my local BBS...
------cut -----
Brd ->Apple Computer Systems | Numb ->50 of 50
Sub ->60 Minutes does Apple? | To ->Apple II users
From ->Bill Petro (#101) | Date ->03/27/91 11:38:08 PM
Did you ever wonder what would happen if an irresistible force met an immovable
object?
(from ATB on America Online)
Path: Across the Boards!/60 Minutes
Subj: I got called by them 91-03-23 16:09:39 EST
From: BurgerBill
After the infamous ad in Incider from Apple. I contacted 60 minutes about our
"little" problem. They are doing a story and are contacting people I refered
them to and getting interviews. In my talks with them, they have been amazed at
how blantant Apple Inc has been in ignoring the needs of their customers.
I urge you to write letters to 60 minutes explaining your distaste with Apple
Inc and their ignorance of the Apple II.
Write to...
60 Minutes
Attn : Story Editor
524 W 57th Street
New York NY, 10019
Please don't fill it with profanity or speculation. Only document real cases
such as the Duet card. Companies discontiuning support and Apple's blantant Mac
only push into the Education Market.
Burger Bill Heineman
IIgs user and Software Developer.
[]==========================================================================[]
This was my response:
Since Bill is on Comp.sys.apple2, Right now he is the only one who "KNOWS" that 60 Minutes
is going to do a story on this. It sounds more like to me that he is *trying*
to get them to do a story. If they *do* do a story, Apple will simply defend
themselves with saying what an outdated platorm the ][ is, and they advertise
where they can get the most of their money. While the coverage *may* hurt Mac
sales (which I doubt, apple will turn it into an advertisment) it will
definately hurt the few remaining GS sales. Would *YOU* buy a computer at full price that you know is being dumped? As of now, the Sears selling ][s rumor is
false. This is official word from Apple. Therefore we still only have a dealer
platform. If people stop buying the remaining ][s from dealers, we will only
speed up the demise of the ][. This is the one, only time I would urge you NOT
to respond!
Daniel Grossbsherman@mthvax.cs.miami.edu (Bob Sherman) (03/29/91)
In <1991Mar28.083716.30880@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> stc7@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Steven T Chiang) writes: > Has anyone heard the rumor that the Apple II will be featured >on 60 Minutes (the tv news show). I saw a post about it on AO that >said something to the effect that the Apple II would be presented as a >computer abandoned by Apple Inc, and it gave an address to mail >letters to, in hope that they will read them on the air. > Any comments? And does anyone know the date of the show? Let me suggest this, since you are in New York City, make a local call to the network that carries 60 minutes, and to speak to the 60 minutes production office, ask the producer if such a segment is planned, if so, get all the information direct from the source and pass it along to us here on the net.. If not so, pass that along to us also, and let's put the thing to sleep.. -- bsherman@mthvax.cs.miami.edu | | MCI MAIL:BSHERMAN
aford@pro-mansion.cts.com (Adam Ford) (03/30/91)
In-Reply-To: message from stc7@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu
I'd like to Video Tape it. Please E-Mail me the Time....
---
ProLine: aford@pro-mansion | Please Support the Apple II
Internet: aford@pro-mansion |
UUCP: crash!pro-mansion!aford | Line of computers.
ARPA: crash!pro-mansion!aford@nosc.mil |
BitNet: aford%pro-mansion.cts.com@nosc.mil |
lbotez@pro-sol.cts.com (Lynda Botez) (03/31/91)
Daniel Gross writes: >... [publicity on 60 Minutes] will definitely hurt the few remaining GS >sales. Would *YOU* buy a computer at full price that you know is being >dumped? ... If people stop buying the remaining ][s from dealers, we will >only speed up the demise of the ][. This is the one, only time I would >urge you NOT to respond! Daniel -- Unfortunately, it is too late to do anything much about it. Bill Heineman contacted 60 Minutes only as a last resort -- a sort of "last straw". The Apple Computer Dealers really don't care too much about the IIgs. As much as I hate to admit it; most have written the computer off. Today I was looking around a few of the Apple computer dealers here in Los Angeles and couldn't find one machine on display (even in the back). I did find a copy of Hypercard IIGS though (which I bought -- I was really surprised!). The person who rang up my sale told me they had sold their one remaining IIgs about six months ago at a Clearance Sale. Most dealers consider the Mac LC the IIgs replacement. If 60 Minutes does have a story -- I doubt it would prevent future sales too much. The main customer is still the school; and they, for sure, know what's going on. Apple's been telling them for years now how they should be moving over to Macs. I just don't understand how a company can continually put down one of its own products; but then, Apple will always remain a mystery to me. Lynda
declan@remus.rutgers.edu (Declan McCullagh/LZ) (04/01/91)
In article <8306@crash.cts.com>, lbotez@pro-sol.cts.com (Lynda Botez) writes: > I just don't understand how a company can continually put down one of its > own products; but then, Apple will always remain a mystery to me. But Lynda, they're putting down one of their products in favor of another of their products. Companies often do that: no, don't buy our Model X when you can get our Model Z for $2,000 more - it's got more features! To look at it from a purely empirical viewpoint, the Macintosh will be easier to support in the long run, and Apple will be able to make more money on it than they could with the Apple II (though they could possibly support both). In the end, that's what drives companies to make decisions - the romance is over, enter the MBA. -Declan
philip@yunexus.yorku.ca (Phil McDunnough) (04/01/91)
In article <Mar.31.13.20.18.1991.4069@remus.rutgers.edu> declan@remus.rutgers.edu (Declan McCullagh/LZ) writes: [description of today's marketing ways] >In the end, that's what drives companies to >make decisions - the romance is over, enter the MBA. >-Declan Well, we shall see about that. I should like to think that the era of the MBA type is coming to an end, and fast. It's only a matter of time before people see through much of the marketing hype surrounding cars, computers, etc...Software that costs $300 or so, which should be selling for $50, will eventually be seen for what it is. I find it rather humorous that there are plenty of C() compilers out there making people fortunes when few if any can compete with GNU C(). One of the problems Canada has been having is a surplus of MBA types, lawyers, accountants,etc...and a shortage of engineers,scientists,etc... Computer companies like HP used to be run by engineers. They are now run by bean counters. I will never forget what they did to my transportable HP-UX box called the Integral( dropped it) and the way they deengineered their micro line in order to be PC compatible. We have enough sheep in the world. In the longer term, it is ideas and not marketing tricks that survive. And, for the record, Apple has a great computer in the GS. It's quite unique, and they'd be foolish not to use it wisely. Philip McDunnough NeXT/GS Mail->philip@utstat.utoronto.ca
declan@remus.rutgers.edu (Declan McCullagh/LZ) (04/01/91)
In article <22185@yunexus.YorkU.CA>, philip@yunexus.yorku.ca (Phil McDunnough) writes: > In article <Mar.31.13.20.18.1991.4069@remus.rutgers.edu> declan@remus.rutgers.edu (Declan McCullagh/LZ) writes: > > > [description of today's marketing ways] > > >In the end, that's what drives companies to > >make decisions - the romance is over, enter the MBA. > > >-Declan > > Well, we shall see about that. I should like to think that the era of the > MBA type is coming to an end, and fast. It's only a matter of time before > people see through much of the marketing hype surrounding cars, computers, > etc...Software that costs $300 or so, which should be selling for $50, will > eventually be seen for what it is. Ah, we disagree. Especially in the automobile industry, people like the glamour surrounding cars. If you're going by specs alone, a $100,000 1991 Lotus Esprit Turbo isn't much faster than a $33,000 300ZX Twin Turbo or Dodge Stealth. But some people still buy the Lotus - and relish the marketing hype which will define them as "a person of substance." Note that I don't necessarily disagree with you as to what the market _should_ be like: I, too, should like to think that the era of the MBA is at a close. However, I don't see that happening. To bring this thread back to comp.sys.apple2... Remember that Apple, too, now has to bean count with the rest of them. They sell stock, they have large shareholders, and they have to show a profit, or their stock drops dramatically, and the company is in trouble - it's a viscous cycle. That's one reason I say that the MBA is still in charge. > I find it rather humorous that there are plenty of C() compilers out there > making people fortunes when few if any can compete with GNU C(). Yup. While gcc is a bit large to use with a 640K MS-DOS or 1-2 MB IIgs system, Sun still sells their $10,000 compilers, which aren't as good as gcc. NeXT is an exception; they use GNU software extensively. > And, for the record, Apple has a great computer in the GS. It's quite > unique, and they'd be foolish not to use it wisely. The IIgs is rather unique, but I don't see Apple using it wisely. -Declan
unknown@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (The Unknown User) (04/01/91)
In article <8306@crash.cts.com> lbotez@pro-sol.cts.com (Lynda Botez) writes: >The Apple Computer Dealers really don't care too much about the IIgs. As >The person who rang up my sale told me they had sold their one remaining >IIgs about six months ago at a Clearance Sale. Most dealers consider the >Mac LC the IIgs replacement. I really hope that you call up Apple's 800 number and report that dealer! It has been said that that's what you SHOULD do! (I think someone even quoted an Apple source for that recommendation, but I'm not positive) -- /unknown@ucscb.ucsc.edu Apple IIGS Forever! ULTIMA VI GS -mail me. CDs-mail me\ \ McIntosh Junior: The Power to Crush the Other Kids. /
gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) (04/01/91)
In article <22185@yunexus.YorkU.CA> philip@yunexus.yorku.ca (Phil McDunnough) writes: >In the longer term, it is ideas and not marketing tricks that survive. Unfortunately, marketing has a habit of killing or at the very list ruining technically good ideas. Worse yet, stockholders normally are not interested these days in the long run, and corporate management knows it. >And, for the record, Apple has a great computer in the GS. It's quite >unique, and they'd be foolish not to use it wisely. Quite true, but has Apple's management given you cause to expect better?
asong@pro-nbs.cts.com (Andi Song) (04/01/91)
In-Reply-To: message from declan@remus.rutgers.edu
Declan, you say that companies often put down products in favor of
another one of theirs. But look at the auto indistry. Each automaker sells
a complete line of cars that ranges up and down the scale. In Nissan, they
go from the $7000 Sentra to the $35,000 Turbo Z. At Mercedes, there is the
$28,000 190E to the $110,000 500SL. Yet though the dealers would LIKE you
to buy a 500SL, they'd just as gladly sell you a 190E if that's all you can
afford. And they'll still service and support your 1964 Mercedes just as
well as they service and support your '91 Mercedes. So Apple should still
support the IIgs, while continuing on to push the Mac. That's 1 million
IIgs users and countless more II+/e/c users that they're leaving in the
dust. And if a IIe is all you can afford then Appple should be happy that
your at least buying somthing from them, rather than a PC or Amiga.
----
ProLine: asong@pro-nbs
Internet: asong@pro-nbs.cts.com
UUCP: crash!pro-nbs!asong
ARPA: crash!pro-nbs!asong@nosc.milphilip@yunexus.yorku.ca (Phil McDunnough) (04/01/91)
In article <Mar.31.21.32.17.1991.23569@remus.rutgers.edu> declan@remus.rutgers.edu (Declan McCullagh/LZ) writes: [quotes my "negative" views of MBA types] >Ah, we disagree. Especially in the automobile industry, people like >the glamour surrounding cars. If you're going by specs alone, a >$100,000 1991 Lotus Esprit Turbo isn't much faster than a $33,000 >300ZX Twin Turbo or Dodge Stealth. But some people still buy the >Lotus - and relish the marketing hype which will define them as "a >person of substance." This is nonsense. People who define themselves that way, or who judge people using this type of approach, are totally superficial. There's nothing wrong with liking cars. They are hardly the secret to a happy life. >Note that I don't necessarily disagree with you as to what the market >_should_ be like: I, too, should like to think that the era of the MBA >is at a close. However, I don't see that happening. I do. Have a look at the ratio of engineers to MBA types in Japan, and compare that figure to the corresponding one in either Canada or the US. It's frightening. Moreover, neither country( Canada/US) does particularly well in international science competitions at a high school level. MBA types are basically not going to generate anything innovative. You might ask yourself why the US has virtually lost the whole electronics' (and automotive) industry. >To bring this thread back to comp.sys.apple2... Remember that Apple, >too, now has to bean count with the rest of them. They sell stock, >they have large shareholders, and they have to show a profit, or their >stock drops dramatically, and the company is in trouble - it's a >viscous cycle. That's one reason I say that the MBA is still in >charge. This is the approach that it is irrelevant what you are marketing. You seem to be implying that people running a computer company could very well be doing a good job at selling peanuts, and vice versa. It's a very short term view of things. >> I find it rather humorous that there are plenty of C() compilers out there >> making people fortunes when few if any can compete with GNU C(). > >Yup. While gcc is a bit large to use with a 640K MS-DOS or 1-2 MB >IIgs system, Sun still sells their $10,000 compilers, which aren't as >good as gcc. NeXT is an exception; they use GNU software extensively. True. But at people who buy Sparc's do it for the available( expensive) software. NeXT is just beginning, and it isn't clear where it will end up. The future does not belong to proprietary companies. >> And, for the record, Apple has a great computer in the GS. It's quite >> unique, and they'd be foolish not to use it wisely. >The IIgs is rather unique, but I don't see Apple using it wisely. Why would you say that? Until a couple of years ago, it was a reasonably priced computer. It would not take much to bring it up to par. A bit faster and 1/2 the price. >-Declan Philip McDunnough NeXT/GS Mail-> philip@utstat.utoronto.ca