redbeard@pro-graphics.cts.com (Dave Chow) (10/07/90)
i hear some stuff about this chip. does anybody have any specs yet? whatever happened to AE's Ramkeeper? i heard that it has been discontinued.
dcw@goldilocks.lcs.mit.edu (David C. Whitney) (10/30/90)
Could someone send me a comprehensive description of the Zip Chip GS models? I don't subscribe to any Apple // mags anymore since A+ went down the toilet. This looks like an interesting product, and I could use some more speed... -- Dave Whitney Computer Science MIT 1990 | I wrote Z-Link and BinSCII. Send me bug dcw@lcs.mit.edu | reports. I need a job. Send me an offer. Every now and then one makes a mistake. Mine was probably this post.
C489030@UMCVMB.MISSOURI.EDU (Greg Hodgdon) (10/30/90)
hi all There are three models of Zip Chip GS out there now. They are: Zip Chip GS - 8Mhz, 8K cache Zip Chip GS Plus - 8Mhz, 16K cache Zip Chip GSx - 8Mhz, 16K cache the GSx is slot based and upgradable. Roger Coats has them advertised, but I don't know whether they're available yet (can't use 'em in my //e anyway...) RC's prices are $189 for the GS, $224 for the GS Plus and $269 for the GSx. Sounds like a good deal compared to AE's card (also kind of sounds like an ad for RC) ciao! Greg Hodgdon C489030@UMCVMB.MISSOURI.EDU "the missourian from new jersey!"
6600prao@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Parik Rao) (10/30/90)
note there is a incompatibility with the Zip Chip GS and the RamFast SCSI card. Its not just DMA, the two don't interact well at the moment. The beta units were working fine. CVTEch and Zip Tech are figuring out whats going on as we speak, the problem should be ironed out real soon. It is not known whether the problem is with the Zip Chip or with the ramfast. Its not limited to just the new versions of the RamFast ROMs. I dunno if the card works with the Apple DMA SCSI card. Haven't seen any problems reported though, and a few people have gotten it already (From Q. Computers or Roger Coats or P+).
-Rich-@cup.portal.com (Richard Sherman Payne) (10/31/90)
I just called Roger Coats, with the intention of ordering a GS Zip Chip, along with a Ramfast and some software. They said that they had not recieved and yet, and had'nt a clue as to when they would <sigh>. There was some good news however. The Ramfast, advertised at $199, was only $169 (If I remember the price correctly). The phone service was efficient and courteous, though they did not verify the information till we were done. I prefer to have it echo'd back, but it was all verified. They said that they would ship within 3 days, so I hope to see my new stuff within a week (San Diego to San Jose). Now, to get my 105 MB drive... Rich -Rich-@cup.portal.com
bh1e+@andrew.cmu.edu (Brendan Gallagher Hoar) (10/31/90)
Just ordered a GSX from Rogger Coats at about 7:20 EST 4:20 their time today...they had 4 in stock then...and no Zip GSs or ZIP GS pluses only GSXs...after I Called, they had only 3 in stock... heh heh Of course, I have an old GS-RAM non-DMA compat. (got it 3 years ago), so, until I find a good cheap source for a SIMM card looks like 8MHz and 256k or 2.8 Mhz an 1.75K for a while. Anyone know if there is a DMA off switch on the GSX? Brendan G. Hoar bh1e+@andrew.cmu.edu Carnegie Mellon, Inc.
gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) (11/01/90)
In article <sb=XHdm00WB9EOtHcy@andrew.cmu.edu> bh1e+@andrew.cmu.edu (Brendan Gallagher Hoar) writes: >Anyone know if there is a DMA off switch on the GSX? Not logically possible. DMA is a memory bus function, not a CPU function.
toddpw@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Todd P. Whitesel) (11/01/90)
October 24, wednesday, 1:10 pm. I read on comp.sys.apple2 that Roger Coats has ZIP GS's. Twenty minutes later I've got a GSX on order for a total bill of $293.31. Nothing happens until saturday afternoon. I get a call from RC verifying my credit card and order (supposedly because I'm a new customer). I am barely awake (it's 1 pm) and don't make any judgements on that until later. They tell me it will ship monday. October 30, tuesday. I get a package. It's hip. It's hot. IT'S HERE. runs at 8 mhz out of the box, documentation sez it's user-upgradable to 10 mhz. Lots of config options, the only one I have to change from default is Appletalk compatibility delay. The disk they give you has a hyperstudio stack w/ the runtime version that shows you around the card and how to install it. I found it to be worthless after looking through the manual but I like that they went to the trouble. The stack is basically a readme file in case they have last minute changes. Basically they have a copy of the Installer on the disk, with two scripts: install the Init, CDev, and CDA install the application that lets you configure the Init The Init overrides the DIP switch settings. Switches you would only change when you boot the O/S can be flipped for you by the Init -- a nice feature. (maybe because I'm using it?) Initially, I had gobs of problems because I was using the RAMfast loaded driver: cursor tracks during disk access, finder.info getting rearranged. I isolated the loaded driver by reinstalling the system without it (worked fine) and then adding the driver (always crashed during boot). So far it has worked fine as long as I am using the firmware and not the loaded driver. The only problem I have noticed is that ORCA/C prizm and its custom open file dialog crashes if you try to click disk and you're on the last HD partition. I believe this is due to the firmware RAMfast driver (or rather, prizm not reacting to it properly) because I remember it doing that before I installed the RAMfast driver when I originally got it (a few weeks ago). I am running 5.0.3, ROM 1 w/ 2.25 megs (GS Sauce), Sonic blaster in slot 1, and Appletalk on the printer port. The RAMfast is in slot 6 and the ZIP GS is in slot 3. I have noticed few other compatibility problems. (twilight started acting funny when I had AppleTalk disabled via slot 7 in order to try MIDI Synth though.) All the FTA demos run smoother, Rastan looks smoother, Arkanoid doesn't slow down when there are a lot of objects moving (uh oh), crystal quest is about the same speed but I didn't play a real game, Qix is the same speed because it is syncing to VBL. The desktop is a lot nicer, but view by name windows with lots of files still take a while to draw in finder -- it is more bearable however. Soundsmith works. Graphic player is the same speed (it's sync'd to the music). The software experience "Z" demo barfed after about a second. AppleTalk stuff works if the AppleTalk compatibility delay is enabled (I have the card's dip switches set for no AppleTalk -- the Zip Init changes the AppleTalk setting whenever I boot the O/S (which also installs the AppleTalk support code). Orca/C works perfectly fine as long as I don't try to click disk too often in prizm's custom get file box. Now to appease you techies: the Zip GSX board is darn spiffy. very few components, and I was amazed at how cool it runs. They have revised the board a LOT, however, mine has a ceramic capacitor soldered between two pins on the back side of it. The Tag RAM is also in a thin DIP 28 package as opposed to the 600 mil package used by the Data RAM (which is 6264's at 100 ns!!) ... BUT the silk screening shows that they originally planned on 600 mil packages for the Tag RAM too. There is an unconnected 40 pin DIP socket which you can plug your old 65816 into. the cable between the Zip board and the 65816 socket is 40 pin ribbon and it is plugged into the board on a 40 pin header -- so you can make your own replacements by buying a few inches of ribbon cable, and IDP-40, and an (I think) IDC-40, all of which are availble from our EE dept.'s stockroom although I can probably get them cheaper at a local electronics supply store. I don't expect my cable to get trashed, but I like it that Zip made the easiest to trash part of the thing so that it could be replaced easily. The chip count on the thing is amazing -- CPU, big fat ASIC circuit to control everything, and cache ram -- the ASIC is soldered directly (it's a 128 pin QFP/Gullwing) however. The only big minus I see is that the ASIC runs at 40 mhz already (4x max. main CPU speed) so pushing this baby for the ASIC 65816 could be a real challenge depending on how Zip is getting their glue ASIC fabricated. BTW, there is a spot for you to solder in a voltage regulator in case you want to experiment with WDC prototype 65816's, and there is a dip socket for both types of oscillator cases (user upgradability again). Summary: damn good considering how long it's been available. I am however looking forward to getting a loaded driver for the RAMfast that works properly (even before I got the Zip it wasn't much faster than the firmware driver!) and I hope Zip cleans up the board soon because it looks like they have the hardware changes pretty much figured out. I would like to see the final board design user-upgradable to 20 mhz but I am not expecting miracles. Recommendation: if you use your GS a lot, BUY IT! Todd Whitesel toddpw @ tybalt.caltech.edu
bh1e+@andrew.cmu.edu (Brendan Gallagher Hoar) (11/01/90)
Sorry, I was under the assumption that the GSX used DMA... So, whats the deal? (For some reason, I'm feeling really stupid this week) I use my GS for telecomm only, and ordered a GSX... that makes sense :P duh... I guess I'm slowly growing computer illiterate.. Brendan G. Hoar bh1e+@andrew.cmu.edu Carnegie Mellon, Inc.
taob@pnet91.cts.com (Brian Tao) (11/01/90)
Thanks for posting your first impressions on the ZipGS, Todd! I really, Really, REALLY want one (>12-MHz if possible!!!), but I am going to get a big HD and a RAM4000 first. I hear Zip and Chinook are working together to iron out the minor incompatibilities between the two cards. Hopefully the problem you have with the Disk button will be fixed along with it. Incidientally, where did you get System 5.0.3? Off the Platinum Paint disk? BT \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ | UUCP: torag!pnet91!taob | / WARNING: \ | INET: taob@pnet91.cts.com | \ / |-------------------------------| / Sig is under \ | | \ construction / | "That's it, that's all..." | /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ | |
6600prao@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Parik Rao) (11/02/90)
They found the problem, its on the Zip Chip. It looks like you will have to send the zip Chip GS back to Zip to get it "working" with the RAMFast. I think you just have to rewire a circuit, but why try to fix it when its under warranty...
scottr@gnh-applesauce.cts.com (Scott Rothstein) (11/04/90)
Programs Plus says $249 for the GSX (model 1600 -- the good one). Sounded kind of low, so I called 2x, double checking each time, and still got $249. ////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ \ Internet: scottr@applesauce.cts.com /\ ts'hahl: /\ 'tis but / / AKA: Monte \/ no retreat \/ a scratch \ \ America Online: ScottR2 /\ no surrender /\ -- M.P. / /----------------------------------------------------------------------\ \ Once upon a midnight dreary, while I pondered, weak and weary, / / -- Edgar Allan Poe \ \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\////////////////////////////////////
PYC121@URIACC.URI.EDU (Andy Kress) (12/06/90)
Hi, I was wondering. With the Transwarp GS you can adjust the speed
using a CDA and NDA (I think, i dont own one). Is there anything like
this for the Zip? I would want to be able to switch between speeds if
I did get an accelerator and have heard no mention of this. I know the
Zip for the IIe had a parameter file on the startup disk specifying the
speed. Is this how the Zip GS works? I don't really care for that
approach, I want to be able to change on the fly. All of this is assuming
you can change speeds. Any info would be appreciated.
Andy Kress
PYC121 at URIACC
Apple II: The power to take over the world!
RECENTLY GOT MY FIRST ISSUE OF GS+ MAGAZINE! MORE INFO ON THE FIRST
6 PAGES THAN IN AN ENTIRE ISSUE OF INCIDER/A+. THIS IS THE BEST IIGS
MAGAZINE THERE IS! EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE A SUBSCRIPTION! BTW...TO
THE EDITOR OF THIS MAGAZINE. WHEN I TRY TO SEND YOU MAIL IT ALWAYS
BOUNCES BACK!dcw@lcs.mit.edu (David C. Whitney) (12/06/90)
In article <9012052027.AA27116@apple.com> PYC121@URIACC.URI.EDU (Andy Kress) writes: > > Hi, I was wondering. With the Transwarp GS you can adjust the speed > using a CDA and NDA (I think, i dont own one). Is there anything like > this for the Zip? Yes. You can do it through CDA, Cdev and an app which twiddles an INIT (so it get set at boot time too). You have full control over the card (including overriding the DIP switches). Speed is changable to one of 8 settings (described in percentage of full speed - whatever it is for your card). NDA is pending. -- Dave Whitney Computer Science MIT 1990 | I wrote Z-Link and BinSCII. Send me bug dcw@lcs.mit.edu | reports. I need a job. Send me an offer. "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance" --Binky (aka Matt Groening)
whitewolf@gnh-starport.cts.com (Tae Song) (12/11/90)
YEs, you can change speeds with the GSX using the CDA, CDev and INIT file that comes with the GSX. Infact there are so many ways to change things the docs for the GSX in pretty comfusing... anyways... They have a thermometer type of speed control ranging from 0-100% ( I think it was 0%... or something like that). whitewolf@gnh-starport
apollo@pro-hindugods.cts.com (System Administrator) (05/27/91)
I want to purchase a ZipChip for my Apple //gs. I was thinking the 10 Mhz with 64K Cache. Does anyone know anything about the kind of support Zip Technology gives to Apple // users like myself, and if the ZipChip 10 Mhz is a good buy? Thank you. Amrit ==The Hindu Love Gods BBS - - - - Bloomfield Hills, MI - - - - 313/644-0481=== ProLine: Steve@pro-hindugods | Internet: Steve@pro-hindugods.cts.com | UUCP: crash!pro-hindugods!Steve | ARPA: crash!pro-hindugods!Steve@nosc.mil | ==============================================================================
PKBRANDON@MSUS1.MSUS.EDU (05/28/91)
I got *very* good support from ZIP Tech with my ZipGSX 8/32. You can add more cache ram yourself, and cache seems to be more important than pure speed so I think I went the right way ordering 8mhz with 32K cache! ------------------------------------------------------------------ --- Paul Brandon Psychology Dept Mankato State Univ --- --- PKBRANDON@MSUS1.MSUS.EDU Mankato, MN 56001 --- ------------------------------------------------------------------
ericmcg@pnet91.cts.com (Eric Mcgillicuddy) (05/28/91)
I have the 8MHz version and recently upped the cache to 64k. Don't bother with a larger cache, 16k is good enough for most of the current crop of programs. Within a couple decimals points, there is no difference in speed. I estimate that 8Mhz has an effective speed of 7.7MHz, if ther is no I/O, with 16k and 7.8MHz with 64k. The big loser is 8k, effective speed is less than 6MHz. The benchmakrs used are very rough at this point, SHRConvert GIFs, a few games, some Orca compilers. None have any noticable improvement over 16k. The speed improvement does give you close to 25% speed increase right out of the box, but the cost is much higher. Orca/C has a number of standard benchmarks included in source form, once compiled this may give a more scientific appraisal of speed differentials, or it may not. I don't care how fast the GS does a benchmark, benchmarks aren't much fun. UUCP: bkj386!pnet91!ericmcg INET: ericmcg@pnet91.cts.com