jpenne@ee.ualberta.ca (Jerry Penner) (06/02/91)
In article <9106012041.AA01198@apple.com> MQUINN@UTCVM.BITNET writes: > >>> That's why we see a GS at all. [...] > >True. No law forces Apple to produce the GS. That doesn't mean/prove/suggest >that Apple Inc. supports it. All that proves is that they haven't completely [lots nuked] Please! Can everyone quit whining about support from Apple or lack thereof!?! Nothing you say on this forum in such a negative tone is going to help *at all* to improve Apple's strategy for the II line. And it certainly doesn't help any developers decide to keep working on new software for the Apple II. If you'd vent your energy in something a little more creative and positive, you'd probably be a lot happier about your machine. If your computer is so lousy then sell it. I like mine and I plan to keep using and programming it for years, even if Apple never makes a new II CPU. Every few weeks another Apple whine thread is started. Next time you feel the urge to whine, just press 'k' on your newsreader. Starting with the next post after this one I'm going to do just that. -- Jerry Penner Edmonton, Alberta, Canada jpenne@bode.ee.ualberta.ca or alberta!bode!jpenne
warren.e@pro-beagle.cts.com (Warren Ernst) (06/03/91)
In-Reply-To: message from jpenne@ee.ualberta.ca Like hell I wont complain about Apple's lack of marketing support for the Apple //, but for a reason: For example, I view the purchace of my computer like that of a car. If I get an 84 Mazda RX-7, I plan on keeping it for a while and using it for a while too. When the new '85s come out, I dont expect to be able to waltz into the Mazda dealership and demand an upgrade to the new model. That's not only bad business, but its unrealistic for an owner to think he deserves the new model just because he bought the old one. Now say that Mazda wants all their earlier customers to buy 85's and ditch their 84's, so they stop producing parts for 84's and tell Mazda repair people to tell 84 owners to go jump in a lake, their old machines blow. As far as I'm concerned, this is what Apple has done to the //. But even more effectively than a car manufacturer could do, because cars don't NEED third party software to work. When Apple stops mentioning the // to Apple Dealers and Software Companies, in favor of the Macs instead, the only interpretation I have of it is that my old machine blows. It might not be true, but it comes from the top levels of Apple, so it cant get ignored by those people making a business of computers. So us users get stuck in the middle. All the great marketing success of the Mac was carried out at the expense of the Apple //, plain and simple. I'll be bitter if I damn well want to. -Warr /===============================++========================================\ | Warren Ernst || & This is called an ampersand. | | warren.e@pro-Beagle.cts.com || @ This is called an at sign. | | wernst@ucsd.edu || * This is called an asterisk. | | GEnie too || ] This is called a square bracket. | +-------------------------------+| ) This is called a parenthesis. | |1HOME:INVERSE2X=RND(1)*24+1:VTA|| # This is called a pound sign. | |BX:HTABX:?X;:HTAB26-X:?X;:GOTO2|| ^ This is called a little pointy thing.| \===============================++========================================/
MQUINN@UTCVM.BITNET (06/04/91)
On Sun, 2 Jun 91 01:35:24 GMT Jerry Penner said: > >Please! Can everyone quit whining about support from Apple or lack >thereof!?! I'm starting to get a little sick of some people trying to undermine what I say by saying I (and many others) are 'whining'. FIRST of all, I was NOT whining. I was stating the facts as they are. I've been sitting back, trying not to get involved in this discussion again, but I saw too many posts basically saying that the lack of support issue is non-existant. > Nothing you say on this forum in such a negative tone is >going to help *at all* to improve Apple's strategy for the II line. 'Negative tone'? I've been holding back trying NOT to do that. If the facts sound negative, I can't help that. If you think pointing out the facts to people that don't see them will do no good, you must think that the press does no good when they report the news. People find out things about some subject and act on that information. If they never heard of the problem, they can't do anything to help it. >And it certainly doesn't help any developers decide to keep working on >new software for the Apple II. Any developers that make (or made) software for the II have already made their decision to either pull out or stick with it. Developers are probably more aware of the problem than I am anyway, so I doubt anything I say would alter their decision one way or the other... although they might decide to tell apple of the problem, which would most likely help. The best way to get software companies to write software for the II is to get apple on the ball and support the II. >If you'd vent your energy in something >a little more creative and positive, you'd probably be a lot happier >about your machine. Just the opposite! But before I get into that, what makes you think I'm *NOT* doing something creative? I'm in the process of writing two applications right now. One's a game and the other is a utility that can be used for MANY things. I've also written articles and created graphics for GS+ magazine. I show off GS software on the ONLY GS our campus has. What more shall I do? As for being happier about my machine if I did this, all it does is make me frustrated that I have this machine, which has great -potential- and could compete if improved, and I'm doing everything I can do, but apple just won't do anything to help it (although, some of these rumors look like apple may be changing their minds... God, I hope so!) >If your computer is so lousy then sell it. My computer is not lousy... the support I get for it IS. Besides, I couldn't get anything for it even it I DID try to sell it because everyone thinks that it's either not a good computer or they think that it's not supported, and many people think both. >I >like mine and I plan to keep using and programming it for years, even >if Apple never makes a new II CPU. Well, good for you. I plan on doing the same, but it sure would be a hell of a lot nicer if it were as equally powerful as other computers in it's price range (a '386 or even an LC). >Every few weeks another Apple whine thread is started. Next time you >feel the urge to whine, just press 'k' on your newsreader. Starting >with the next post after this one I'm going to do just that. Believe me, I'd appreciate if you did just that. About the whining bit you keep repeating, read above. > Jerry Penner Edmonton, Alberta, Canada >jpenne@bode.ee.ualberta.ca or alberta!bode!jpenne ---------------------------------------- BITNET-- mquinn@utcvm <------------send files here pro-line-- mquinn@pro-gsplus.cts.com
sb@pnet91.cts.com (Stephen Brown) (06/04/91)
jpenne@ee.ualberta.ca (Jerry Penner) writes: >In article <9106012041.AA01198@apple.com> MQUINN@UTCVM.BITNET writes: >> >>>> That's why we see a GS at all. [...] >> >>True. No law forces Apple to produce the GS. That doesn't mean/prove/suggest >>that Apple Inc. supports it. All that proves is that they haven't completely >[lots nuked] > >Please! Can everyone quit whining about support from Apple or lack >thereof!?! Nothing you say on this forum in such a negative tone is >going to help *at all* to improve Apple's strategy for the II line. [cut] This is whining about whining. I would like to whine about 'whining about whining'. It wastes bandwidth as much as whining does. So who is worse? The whiners or the whiners about whiners? Or even whiners about whiners about whiners? It doesn't really matter does it? You have your kill file. Use it and don't whine. +---------------------------------------------------------+ | Stephen Brown Toronto, Canada | | Internet: sb@pnet91.cts.com UUCP: utzoo!pnet91!sb | +---------------------------------------------------------+ | Apple II Forever !!! | +---------------------------------------------------------+ | Like my new .signature. ? Too bad. | +---------------------------------------------------------+