t20l011@.ucsc.edu (10024011) (03/11/91)
I bought a new A500 in December of 1989 because I had heard about the fact that the new fatter agnus had been put in the all the 500's since April. I heard this from this newsgroup. I get my computer and I find out that it didn't have the chip in it. However not in order to get this chip that I purchased my computer to get (I had a A1000) I now have to buy it for $100 or so. I want to buy A3000 but now the educational pricing system is all screwed up. Come on C= get your act together. I have yet to see a letter that agrees with the 3 dealers in this area about the pricing deals. What is going on here?
dave@cs.arizona.edu (Dave P. Schaumann) (03/11/91)
In article <13275@darkstar.ucsc.edu> t20l011@.ucsc.edu (10024011) writes: > > I bought a new A500 in December of 1989 because I had heard about >the fact that the new fatter agnus had been put in the all the 500's since >April. I heard this from this newsgroup. I get my computer and I find out >that it didn't have the chip in it. However not in order to get this chip >that I purchased my computer to get (I had a A1000) I now have to buy it for >$100 or so. CBM may have been putting the new agnus in units *shipped* 4/89. This certainly doesn't mean that every unit in storage at that point was junked simply because it had "old" hardware... Just because you purchased a unit in 12/89 doesn't mean it was manufactured the day before. There are always a lot of units "in the pipeline" at any given point. I wouldn't be suprised if CBM doesn't announce 2.0 availability until the units containing it are ready to hit the stores. Who's going to want to buy a machine with 1.3 when 2.0 is ready? > I want to buy A3000 but now the educational pricing system is all >screwed up. Come on C= get your act together. I have yet to see a letter >that agrees with the 3 dealers in this area about the pricing deals. What is >going on here? I'll have to agree with you here. I have some simpathy for CBM since they have a new person at the head of the education department, but it has been a while now, and they need to get some things clear ASAP: 1. What are the educational prices (& all attendant details) 2. When are they in effect 3. They need to make heroic efforts to get these facts to the dealers as soon as possible. CBM may have the most wonderful educational pricing ever, but if my dealer hasn't heard about it, or doesn't want to hear about it, it doesn't to me a lick of good. -- Dave Schaumann | dave@cs.arizona.edu | Short .sig's rule!
es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) (03/11/91)
In article <13275@darkstar.ucsc.edu> t20l011@.ucsc.edu (10024011) writes: > > I bought a new A500 in December of 1989 because I had heard about >the fact that the new fatter agnus had been put in the all the 500's since >April. I heard this from this newsgroup. I get my computer and I find out >that it didn't have the chip in it. However not in order to get this chip >that I purchased my computer to get (I had a A1000) I now have to buy it for >$100 or so. You mention nowhere that COMMODORE promised you anything. Just because people on this newsgroup said something doesn't mean it is true. You should make sure you get an official response from a Commodore employee or, barring that, from your dealer. The new Agnus is NOT being placed in A500s. The answer is to get a 2000. > I want to buy A3000 but now the educational pricing system is all >screwed up. Come on C= get your act together. I have yet to see a letter >that agrees with the 3 dealers in this area about the pricing deals. What is >going on here? There is a new price list dated March 1 which should clear up much of the confusion. As soon as I get it I'll post it. There was a 1 month period of confusion but that should now be over. Paul Calkin now has a price list that he wants, rather than what the prior education boss wanted. -- Ethan Upon leaving office, Ronald Reagan began renting an office in the penthouse of the Fox Plaza, the Los Angeles high-rise used as the location for the terrorist movie "Die Hard".
DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu (03/11/91)
In article <1991Mar11.042149.17599@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) says: >from a Commodore employee or, barring that, from your dealer. The >new Agnus is NOT being placed in A500s. The answer is to get a 2000. All the newer 500s I've seen (within the last year? don't remember) have the newer Agnus. Of course, it has nothing to do with getting a 2000. I'm afraid that if the 500 can't accept the new (gee, we should stop calling it 'new' eh?) Agnus, then the 2000 can't either, because the 2000 design is based on the 500. :-) -- Dan Babcock
es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) (03/11/91)
In article <91070.000848DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu> DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu writes: >In article <1991Mar11.042149.17599@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, >es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) says: > >>from a Commodore employee or, barring that, from your dealer. The >>new Agnus is NOT being placed in A500s. The answer is to get a 2000. > >All the newer 500s I've seen (within the last year? don't remember) have >the newer Agnus. Of course, it has nothing to do with getting a 2000. >I'm afraid that if the 500 can't accept the new (gee, we should stop calling >it 'new' eh?) Agnus, then the 2000 can't either, because the 2000 design is >based on the 500. :-) > >-- Dan Babcock As I understand it, it is Commodore's policy not to allow 1MB of chip ram in an A500. It is a marketing decision. Although the A500 comes with the new agnus, that is only because it would cost them more to produce another version of the Agnus. The machine itself has not had the proper modifications to make use of the extra chip ram capability. If you have that done by your dealer, your warranty is gone. Perhaps this was done so as to give people a reason to buy the 2000 instead of the 500. I don't know. -- Ethan Upon leaving office, Ronald Reagan began renting an office in the penthouse of the Fox Plaza, the Los Angeles high-rise used as the location for the terrorist movie "Die Hard".
nguyent@balboa.eng.uci.edu (Thien Nguyen) (03/11/91)
In article <1991Mar11.042149.17599@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) writes: >In article <13275@darkstar.ucsc.edu> t20l011@.ucsc.edu (10024011) writes: >> >> I want to buy A3000 but now the educational pricing system is all >>screwed up. Come on C= get your act together. I have yet to see a letter >>that agrees with the 3 dealers in this area about the pricing deals. What is >>going on here? > > There is a new price list dated March 1 which should >clear up much of the confusion. As soon as I get it I'll post it. >There was a 1 month period of confusion but that should now be >over. Paul Calkin now has a price list that he wants, rather than >what the prior education boss wanted. > -- Ethan > I have the Educational Individual Price Schedule effective March 1, 1991, right here on my desk. It seems that prices went up a little! (None of the prices include the monitor) A500P $531.00 A2000C $1164.00 A2000HD/1 $1455.00 A2500/30 5Meg Ram,50Mg $2766.00 A2500/100 5Meg Ram,50Mg $3239.00 A3000-16/50 $2183.00 A3000-25/50 $2327.00 A3000-25/100 $3421.00 Interesting note: On Page one there is a typo. The math co-processor for A3000-25/100 is 68882 and on the price list, it says 68881.
dlarson@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dale Larson) (03/11/91)
In article <1991Mar11.042149.17599@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) writes: > You mention nowhere that COMMODORE promised you anything. >Just because people on this newsgroup said something doesn't mean >it is true. Thank you for pointing this out. > You should make sure you get an official response >from a Commodore employee or, barring that, from your dealer. The ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Bzzt. Wrong answer. There is a difference between Commodore the entity and the people who work for Commodore. Most of the people who work for Commodore are not authorized to (and won't) speak as representatives of Commodore the entity. Also note that there is a lot more than one Commodore -- the one that handles U.S. Sales and Marketing is CBM. Almost no one from CBM (the U.S. sales company) posts to the net. No one in the other companies (that includes all the engineers) is authorized to give official responses about US marketing/sales issues. For the most part, we don't have time to figure out what they're doing anyway. You might get some response by calling CBM, but you will likely have to rely on things like CBM press releases for official information from Commodore. So if you want information about whether you have a 1 year warrantee or whether you have the latest chip, etc., talk to your dealer. This is no different from most other manufacturing companies -- they prefer to communicate though media (i.e. press releases, advertising) and through dealers. Now if you want to ask a question like "how do I do X?" or "why doesn't Y work?" then you probably don't need an "official response" and people on the net both in and out of Commodore can help. In case you didn't catch it earlier, I'm not speaking on behalf of any of the Commodore companies. I'm only pointing out that I can't. Any information above is, to the best of my knowledege, correct, but may be completely inaccurate. For all I know, there is no longer an Authorized Dealer program, all CBM employees are required to respond to all posts in the comp.sys.amiga hierarchy, and all customers are flown directly to the West Chester, PA, headquarters of CBM for purchases, questions, warrantee repairs, etc. :-) :-) :-) -- Dale Larson dlarson@cbmvax.commodore.com I work at Commodore-Amiga, not for Commodore-Amiga. "Oh, its not my module? That should be easy to implement." -bj "I'm not dumb but I don't understand..." -The Kinks
DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu (03/12/91)
In article <1991Mar11.061707.3428@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) says: >In article <91070.000848DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu> DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu writes: >>In article <1991Mar11.042149.17599@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, >>es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) says: >> > As I understand it, it is Commodore's policy not to allow >1MB of chip ram in an A500. It is a marketing decision. Although > Perhaps this was done so as to give people a reason to >buy the 2000 instead of the 500. I don't know. Perhaps it just gives people a reason to hate Commodore marketing even more (like we didn't already!) -- Dan Babcock
es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) (03/12/91)
In article <19717@cbmvax.commodore.com> dlarson@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dale Larson) writes: > >> You should make sure you get an official response >>from a Commodore employee or, barring that, from your dealer. The > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >Bzzt. Wrong answer. There is a difference between Commodore the entity >and the people who work for Commodore. Most of the people who work for >Commodore are not authorized to (and won't) speak as representatives of >Commodore the entity. Also note that there is a lot more than one BUT, if some employee of Commodore (from the local country's sales division) makes a comment/promise without specifically denying that he is speaking on behalf of Commodore, he has spoken for the company as far as the law is concerned. Whether he was authorized to do so is irrelevant. -- Ethan Upon leaving office, Ronald Reagan began renting an office in the penthouse of the Fox Plaza, the Los Angeles high-rise used as the location for the terrorist movie "Die Hard".
lcline@agora.rain.com (Larry Cline) (03/12/91)
In article <91070.123408DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu> DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu writes: >In article <1991Mar11.061707.3428@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, >es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) says: > >>In article <91070.000848DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu> DXB132@psuvm.psu.edu writes: >>>In article <1991Mar11.042149.17599@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, >>>es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) says: >>> >> As I understand it, it is Commodore's policy not to allow >>1MB of chip ram in an A500. It is a marketing decision. Although >> Perhaps this was done so as to give people a reason to >>buy the 2000 instead of the 500. I don't know. > >Perhaps it just gives people a reason to hate Commodore marketing even >more (like we didn't already!) > >-- Dan Babcock It was my understanding that some of the revsions of the A500 motherboard may not accept 1MB chip mem. So it would not be a marketing decision, but an engineering problem. So until C='s official scapegoat..... err, solution/announcement, maybe we best lay off everybody about this one ( except for the person who is suppose to make the decision about the announcement). -- Larry Cline lcline@agora.rain.com
lcline@agora.rain.com (Larry Cline) (03/12/91)
In article <1991Mar11.184944.13781@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) writes: >In article <19717@cbmvax.commodore.com> dlarson@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dale Larson) writes: >> >>> You should make sure you get an official response >>>from a Commodore employee or, barring that, from your dealer. The >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> >>Bzzt. Wrong answer. There is a difference between Commodore the entity >>and the people who work for Commodore. Most of the people who work for >>Commodore are not authorized to (and won't) speak as representatives of >>Commodore the entity. Also note that there is a lot more than one > > BUT, if some employee of Commodore (from the local >country's sales division) makes a comment/promise without >specifically denying that he is speaking on behalf of Commodore, >he has spoken for the company as far as the law is concerned. >Whether he was authorized to do so is irrelevant. > -- Ethan > > > Upon leaving office, Ronald Reagan began renting an >office in the penthouse of the Fox Plaza, the Los Angeles >high-rise used as the location for the terrorist movie "Die >Hard". And this is the official position of Columbia University? -- Larry Cline lcline@agora.rain.com
patrick_meloy@outbound.wimsey.bc.ca (Patrick Meloy) (03/12/91)
A bit more about the 'in the pipeline' suggestion for 'older' hardware. I have seen people getting machines that were manufactered 1-2 years back from mass marketeers. Don't forget that this big box-movers buy in HUGE lots and it takes time to sell them all off. Also the warehouse personnel don't always know the proper procedures for stock rotation and you can end up with a shipment that sits there for a year while other newer shipments go through. This is part of the risk people take when buying 'cheap'. Most specialty retailers never have more than 5-10 units in stock and have a high turnover. The odds of getting an older machine are pretty slim. --------------------------------------- | patrick_meloy@outbound.wimsey.bc.ca | | 'The Outbound' BBS Vancouver BC | ---------------------------------------
navas@cory.Berkeley.EDU (David C. Navas) (03/14/91)
In article <> dlarson@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dale Larson) writes: >No one >in the other companies (that includes all the engineers) is authorized >to give official responses about US marketing/sales issues. For the most >part, we don't have time to figure out what they're doing anyway. Not to be rude or anything (heaven forbid), but I don't think anyone *has* figured out what they're doing :) Frankly, if they don't put out some ads that point out the fact that A(>=2000) buyers get on-site repair -- a thing unheard of from Apple, or IBM-compatible makers, AND a thing frequently complained about by my father at his workplace -- somebody is missing the boat in a major way. Of course, my opinion and all that -- note Followup-To (which may not be working, but please use it anyway :)) David Navas navas@cory.berkeley.edu "Oh, that's an Apple??? I though they just shot themselves in the head..." [Also try c186br@holden, c260-ay@ara and c184-ap@torus]
dhansen@amiganet.chi.il.us (Dave Hansen) (03/14/91)
>It was my understanding that some of the revsions of the A500 motherboard >may not accept 1MB chip mem. So it would not be a marketing decision, >but an engineering problem. So until C='s official scapegoat..... err, >solution/announcement, maybe we best lay off everybody about this one ( >except for the person who is suppose to make the decision about the >announcement). Boy does this one ever strike me as a rerun of the PC-Colt. Remember that? The smaller, less expensive one was only supposed to run at a slower speed than the more expensive model that touted the additional turbo speeds. But someone found that where CBM had omitted the direct software command to switch speeds, the keyboard equivalent was still there. A former CBM employee said that you better not switch the little Colt to the higher speed as you will damage something and a repair person can tell that you did. From what I recall talking to local dealers when the Enhanced Agnus was released, some A500s did require additional mods in order to accept the Enhanced Agnus, a few very old rev. boards were not easy to mod for that, but not until recently have I heard that the A500 wouldn't accept one. That sounds to be either: 1. A marketing ploy. (I doubt that, CBM has learned that customers aren't so gulable). or 2. Another of the rumor mills churning out drivel. Perhaps CBM marketing would care to end this thread? voice: (708)691-4747 Internet:dhansen@amiganet.chi.il.us
kkrueger@zeus.unomaha.edu (Kurt Krueger) (03/16/91)
In article <13275@darkstar.ucsc.edu>, t20l011@.ucsc.edu (10024011) writes: > I bought a new A500 in December of 1989 because I had heard about > the fact that the new fatter agnus had been put in the all the 500's since > April. I heard this from this newsgroup. I get my computer and I find out > that it didn't have the chip in it. However not in order to get this chip > that I purchased my computer to get (I had a A1000) I now have to buy it for > $100 or so. Are you absolutely sure that your computer does not have the Super Agnes? A friend of mine just bought one and thought he did not have the SA, but it turns out he does, but the chip is not activated, and no dealer can activate it until the 2.0 release. He only has 512K of chip RAM, but the PAL mode is usable. So, if you are not absolutely sure that you do not have it, try running a PAL program to see what happens. > I want to buy A3000 but now the educational pricing system is all > screwed up. Come on C= get your act together. I have yet to see a letter ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Excellent suggestion!! I've run into some difficulties too. -- Kurt Krueger | BITNET: kkrueger@unoma1 | //\ MBA student | Internet: kkrueger@zeus.unomaha.edu | \X/--\ M I G A --
t20l011@ucscl.UCSC.EDU (10024011) (03/17/91)
I know that I do not have the new chip, I took my computer apart to dust out the insides and to fix my damn internal drive button and I checked to see if the chip was the new one alas it was not.
schweige@TAURUS.CS.NPS.NAVY.MIL (Jeffrey M. Schweiger) (03/17/91)
In article <dhansen.8494@amiganet.chi.il.us> dhansen writes: >... From what I >recall talking to local dealers when the Enhanced Agnus was released, some >A500s did require additional mods in order to accept the Enhanced Agnus, a few >very old rev. boards were not easy to mod for that, but not until recently >have I heard that the A500 wouldn't accept one. That sounds to be either: >1. A marketing ploy. (I doubt that, CBM has learned that customers aren't so >gulable). >or >2. Another of the rumor mills churning out drivel. > >Perhaps CBM marketing would care to end this thread? I don't believe that anyone from CBM marketing presently reads (or at least posts to) Usenet. I know that modification instructions for the A500 to _activivate_ the 1 meg Agnus have been posted to the net before (don't have it handy at the moment), but I also remember that CBM does not support the modification. I did have a copy of the following post available, which may be of interest. >From: chanson@isis.cs.du.edu (Chris Hanson) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware Subject: Re: help on installing 1meg agnus ... Summary: You may not want to... Keywords: Weird, 1meg, Agnus, Commodore, WARRANTY, Fat, etc. Message-ID: <1990Oct13.035003.3737@isis.cs.du.edu> Date: 13 Oct 90 03:50:03 GMT References: <12411@chaph.usc.edu> Reply-To: chanson@isis.UUCP (Chris Hanson) Organization: Matrix Lines: 39 We (Progressive Peripherals & Software) got a fax the other day from Commodore. No explanation of it has followed, and I presume other dealers and developers got it. (At least, I hope so.) It reads as follows: {---cut here ---} One Megabyte Agnus use in Commodore A500 Computers Commodore Business Machines does not support the One Megabyte addressing feature of the Fat Agnus 8372 IC in A500 Computers. Regardless of the version of Fat Agnus, all A500's have been factory jumper set to be functionall identical. 8370 Fat Agnus chips are used on rev 5 boards with 256K x 1 DRAMS. 8372 Fat Agnus chips are used on rev 6a boards with 256K x 4 DRAMS. The boards are functionall interchangable. Each will support 512K of chip RAM and 512K of expansion RAM with an A501 installed. Enabling the One Megabyte feature, at the customers' request, will void the warranty. Instructions detailing implementation of the One Megabyte addressing have been circulated without Official Approval and Commodore does not assume any liability for damages resulting from this mode of operation in the A500. {---cut here ---} I have retyped it, exactly as it was sent, with all capitalization and page/line formatting intact. You go figure. I don't get it either. Chris - Xenon -- #define chanson Christopher_Eric_Hanson || Lord_Xenon || Kelson_Haldane I work, but you don't know who I work for. And they don't know I'm here. ::I'm @ chanson@nyx.cs.du.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- ******************************************************************************* Jeff Schweiger Standard Disclaimer CompuServe: 74236,1645 Internet (Milnet): schweige@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil *******************************************************************************