gdlee@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Gary D. Lee) (07/13/90)
Index Number: 9094
I am currently running desqview 386 on a zenith 386-16 with a Sounding-
board synthesizer and the Vocal-eyes screen reader. It works pretty
well so far. I have found that you need to run the drivers for for the
synthesizer before you enter desqview but run the speech software it-
self in each task. Also you need to have the synthesizer configured
as a parallel device so that you can tell desqview not to manage printer
contention. This is because the synthesizer looks like a printer port
to desqview and if it manages printer contention it will not let
more than one task have the port at the same time.
You can have tasks running in the background but if they write to
the screen, you will have their speech intruding on your foreground
task. With most programs like spreadsheets databases, and word
processors, this is not a problem. If you have any questions about
desqview, vocal-eyes, ortions about the sounding board, vocal-eyes
or desqview please write or call.
Gary Lee
Senior Microcomputer analyst
Ball State University
work phone 317-285-1853
UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee}!bsu-cs!gdlee
ARPA: gdlee@bsu-cs.bsu.eduRick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Rick Alfaro) (07/21/90)
Index Number: 9344 [This is from the Blink Talk Conference] > Don that is great that he got desqview working with the > sounding board and vocaleyes. Now, we have to get it to > work with accent, and jaws. Walter, The key to the whole Desqview and speech thing is the 386 machine! I have gotten desqview working on a 286 with speech, but it is very difrerent and almost useless in my opinion because of the amount of useable memory by desqview. On a 386, the memory management is quite different and desqview will use all available expanded memory for your diferent tasks, thereby freeing up your conventional dos memory. Even folks that are sighted and have no special drivers like we have for speech, have found out that using desqview on a 286 has very limited usefullness at best. There is one way of getting a little more out of a 286 with desqview, but it envolves dropping the memory on your mother board to 256K and configuring the rest aove that as expanded memory. I believe this procedeure is called "back filling" and is the only way that desqview will recognize any expanded memory in your machine. If you don't use this back filling technique, desqview will only take advantage of 64k of your extended memory if you use a special driver they provide. All the rest of desqview is put into conventional memory leaving you very little to work with for other tasks. I may have a couple of things not quite correct here, but generally speaking, this is what I understand the situation to be. I think that a 386 with speech and something like desqview could have a lot of possibilities for us blinks. This could especially be true if some of the software developers started to pay a little attention to multitasking environments such as Desqview and perhaps someday make their software "desqview aware". I am really glad to see some speech users getting into this multitasking stuff. I only have 286 machines, so unfortunately I haven't had the pleasure of trying to get desqview working with speech on a 386. Someday, I hope to be able to give this a shot. I would be really interested in hearing from anyone else that has done some experimenting with multitasking and speech... Regards, Rick -- Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!369!8!Rick.Alfaro Internet: Rick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org
Donald.Breda@f460.n101.z1.fidonet.org (Donald Breda) (07/24/90)
Index Number: 9425 [This is from the Blink Talk Conference] >> Don that is great that he got desqview working with the >> sounding board and vocaleyes. Now, we have to get it to >> work with accent, and jaws. RA> RA> Walter, RA> RA> The key to the whole Desqview and speech thing is the 386 RA> machine! I have gotten desqview working on a 286 with speech, RA> but it is very difrerent and almost useless in my opinion RA> because of the amount of useable memory by desqview. On a 386, RA> the memory management is quite different and desqview will use RA> all available expanded memory for your diferent tasks, thereby RA> freeing up your conventional dos memory. Even folks that are RA> sighted and have no special drivers like we have for speech, RA> have found out that using desqview on a 286 has very limited RA> usefullness at best. There is one way of getting a little more RA> out of a 286 with desqview, but it envolves dropping the memory RA> on your mother board to 256K and configuring the rest aove that RA> as expanded memory. I believe this procedeure is called "back RA> filling" and is the only way that desqview will recognize any RA> expanded memory in your machine. If you don't use this back RA> filling technique, desqview will only take advantage of 64k of RA> your e memory if you use a special driver they provide. All RA> the rest put into conventional memory leaving you very little RA> to work tasks. I may have a couple of things not quite correct RA> here, speaking, this is what I understand the situation to be. RA> I th with speech and something like desqview could have a lot RA> of blinks. This could especially be true if some of the RA> software to pay a little attention to multitasking environments RA> such as D perhaps someday make their software "desqview aware". RA> I am rea some speech users getting into this multitasking RA> stuff. I on machines, so unfortunately I haven't had the RA> pleasure o working with speech on a 386. Someday, I hope to RA> be able to gi I would be really interested in hearing from RA> anyone else that h experimenting with multitasking and RA> speech... Regards, Rick Hi Rick; My apologies to anyone else about thelength of this message. I would usually try to limit the quote. I think though that your comments about desqview are a bit inaccurate as it relates to a 286 machine Rick. Desqview can use expanded memory on a 286 if it is present, it just usually is not present unless you buy an intell above board or something like that. I have used desqview with an above board on a 286 giving me 2 megs of expanded memory above the 640k already present in the machine and retaining the 384k of extended memory for a ram disk. Desqview will use the intell above board just fine. Speech programs just by there nature though I don't think are really compatible with software such as desqview. I say this having run soft vert vocal eyes and screen reader with desqview on a 286 machine though so you can see where I am comming from when I make a statement like that. I haven't tried running speech after desqview though since I would really like to get it to work with speech loaded before desqview. I have gotten it to work although it is just not a pleasant way to operate. Sacrificing the comfort of normal DOS operation for the problems operating with desqview hasn't appealed to me as of yet. I must do some more work on it though since I think it can be made to run fairly nicely if i just don't give up. Haven't had enough time to devote to it, thats the real problem. ... Abled, Blinktalk and sSilver xpress in Boston 9600 HST -- Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!101!460!Donald.Breda Internet: Donald.Breda@f460.n101.z1.fidonet.org
Rick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Rick Alfaro) (07/24/90)
Index Number: 9430 [This is from the Blink Talk Conference] > RA> The key to the whole Desqview and speech thing is the 386 > RA> machine! I have gotten desqview working on a 286 with speech, > RA> but it is very difrerent and almost useless in my opinion > RA> because of the amount of useable memory by desqview. On a 386, > RA> the memory management is quite different and desqview will use > RA> all available expanded memory for your diferent tasks, thereby > RA> freeing up your conventional dos memory. Even folks that are > RA> sighted and have no special drivers like we have for speech, > RA> have found out that using desqview on a 286 has very limited > RA> usefullness at best. > Rick, > You hit the nail on the head. Good assment! Doug, Maybe you could clear something up for me that still is vague in my mind! What exactly is the difference between a 386 and a 386sx? I know one big difference is the price! The sx machines are very much more affordable. Does an sx have the same memory management scheme as the regular 386? Can we get just as much out of a 386sx for general purpose use as a 386? For example, will desqview be able to use expanded memory on an sx in the same way that it does with a regular 386? I mean, we are talking about a price difference of several hundreds of dollars between the sx and the regular one. It could be a very affordable way of getting into the world of 386 machines very cheaply! Some say that a 386sx is nothing but a faster 286 and others say that an sx isn't as fast as a full blown 386, but works basically the same and uses the same type of memory management. Can you shed some light on this? Regards, Rick -- Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!369!8!Rick.Alfaro Internet: Rick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org
William.Wilson@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (William Wilson) (07/25/90)
Index Number: 9480
[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]
DG> If you want more detailed information let me know. Chris would
DG> be glad to answer any questions. Also, within a month or so, I
DG> should be up and running myself.
Doug,
If you are up and running Deskview in a month that will probably be
before I could possibly accomplish such a thing! Bank robberies involve
planning you know!
Actually, I'm wondering how this would work out without a
Soundingboard driver! That is, if I had a '386 attached to the Dectalk,
couldn't I just run Vocal-Eyes in each window and get at least the same
results as described? Would I use the switch to load Vocal-Eyes into
extended memory in each window?
Hey, maybe I am just dreaming at this point, but somehow thinking this
could all work helps me to justify throwing even more money into this
"hobby", soooo, you wanna drive the get away car?
Willie
... Like a bat out of Bellevue!
--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.0!William.Wilson
Internet: William.Wilson@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.orgRick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Rick Alfaro) (07/25/90)
Index Number: 9492 [This is from the Blink Talk Conference] > Hi Rick; My apologies to anyone else about thelength of this message. I > would usually try to limit the quote. I think though that your comments > about desqview are a bit inaccurate as it relates to a 286 machine Rick. > Desqview can use expanded memory on a 286 if it is present, it just > usually is not present unless you buy an intell above board or > something like that. I have used desqview with an above board on a 286 > giving me 2 megs of expanded memory above the 640k already present in > the machine and retaining the 384k of extended memory for a ram disk. > Desqview will use the intell above board just fine. Speech programs just > by there nature though I don't think are really compatible with software > such as desqview. I say this having run soft vert vocal eyes and screen > reader with desqview on a 286 machine though so you can see where I am > comming from when I make a statement like that. I haven't tried running > speech after desqview though since I would really like to get it to work > with speech loaded before desqview. I have gotten it to work although it > is just not a pleasant way to operate. Sacrificing the comfort of normal > DOS operation for the problems operating with desqview hasn't appealed > to me as of yet. I must do some more work on it though since I think it > can be made to run fairly nicely if i just don't give up. Haven't had > enough time to devote to it, thats the real problem. Don, Thanks for your reply. Let me relate to you my experience with desqview and a 286 andperhaps you can see why I have come to the conclusions in my previous message... I have 640k conventional memory, 384k extended and 1 meg expanded that comply to the lotus intel 4.0 specifications for expanded memory. Desqview did indeed recognizxe that the 1 meg of expanded memory was there, and upon first impression, you would think that everything was just fine. However, the probelm comes when setting up several tasks and activating them in different windows. When desqview makes full use of expanded memory, it is supposed to swap applications in and out of expanded and leave your dos memeory as fre as possible. Here is where I realized that desqview wasn't really using the expanded memory like it was supposed to do. The expanded memory I have isn't an above board, but is an everex expanded memory card with 1 meg on board. Anyhow after several hlurs of frustrating fiddeling, I called Quarterdeck and was told that the only way to truly take advantage of any lims 4.0 expanded memory on a 286 was to use the back filling technique that I sort of described in the previous mesage. What was frustrating about it is that at first, it really seemed like it was going to work just fine, but when checking the amount of dos ram that was being taken, and finding that switching between 3 or 4 large applications was not working out, my hopes for a good multitasking system sort of vanished! It is for those reasons that I still respectfully maintain that Desqview on a 286 with expanded memory is a real waste of time without back filling. However, I am very curious about your experience with it. Did you try running some large applications? For example, Wordperfect in one window, Lotus in another, and perhaps something like Dbase in still another? It was only after trying that was that I realized that desqview really wasn't doing the job I had expected... On another note, now that I have your attention, <grin>, I would love to hear what your opinion is of your talking vcr. I bvelieve you had one of the Optinca models. I had sent you a message on this quite some time ago, but it wa when you had a problem with your system and had missed a bunch of messages in the echo. I am really anxious to get one of those rascals, but really would like to hear from someone that has had first hand experience with one. I'm anxiously awaiting your reply! <smile> Regards, Rick -- Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!369!8!Rick.Alfaro Internet: Rick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org
covici@well.sf.ca.us (John Covici) (08/09/90)
Index Number: 9613 In article <13123@bunker.UUCP> Rick.Alfaro@f8.n369.z1.fidonet.org writes: > >I have 640k conventional memory, 384k extended and 1 meg expanded >that comply to the lotus intel 4.0 specifications for expanded >memory. Desqview did indeed recognizxe that the 1 meg of expanded >memory was there, and upon first impression, you would think that >everything was just fine. However, the probelm comes when setting >up several tasks and activating them in different windows. When >desqview makes full use of expanded memory, it is supposed to swap >applications in and out of expanded and leave your dos memeory as >fre as possible. Here is where I realized that desqview wasn't >really using the expanded memory like it was supposed to do. The problem is that most expanded memory boards don't really comply with LIMEMS 4.0 . I had this same problem with an Intel Above board where it would not map the area from 1000 to a000 to expanded memory so DV couldn't take full advantage of it. There is something called a "charge Card" which last I remember you can attach to that kind of board and it will make it fully comply with the standard. I actually have not seen a memory board by itself which complies properly. Given the price, 386SX's are the thing to get rather than the 286 stuff. John