Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/03/90)
Index Number: 10818
Did anyone else watch the program on TV last Thursday? The one
Diane Sawyer did on Veteran's Hospitals? Having spent a fair
amount of time in VA hospitals, but NOT the one in Cleveland
that was featured on TV, I have to say that my experience does
not compare precisely with what Diane reported. You spend a
lot of time waiting of course, but once that is past I have
experienced considerate, caring, professional attention. They
have limited resources to work with, but I sincerely believe
they do the best they can with what they have.
I do hear that the quality of care varies greatly from one
hospital to another, all the way from excellent to wretched.
What distressed me most, even more than the lack of attention
to the paralized vietnam vet, was the reaction of VA Secretary
Derwinski. He seemed to be much more upset at the media for
reporting despicable conditions than he was for the existence
of the conditions reported. I understand he has dispatched
a team of investigators to the Cleveland VA hospital. Probably
not to investigate the actual patient care, but to investigate
the lapse of security that let Diane get in with her hidden
TV camera.
... Xpress Yourself!
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!26!Jack.O'keeffe
Internet: Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.orgJoe.Chamberlain@f140.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain) (10/05/90)
Index Number: 10890
JO> What distressed me most, even more than the lack of attention
JO> to the paralized vietnam vet, was the reaction of VA Secretary
JO> Derwinski. He seemed to be much more upset at the media for
JO> reporting despicable conditions than he was for the existence
JO> of the conditions reported. I understand he has dispatched
JO> a team of investigators to the Cleveland VA hospital. Probably
JO> not to investigate the actual patient care, but to investigate
JO> the lapse of security that let Diane get in with her hidden
JO> TV camera.
I agree. He seemed to be making excuses rather than
statements of improvements.
In reality, a recent study demonstrated that the Vet
would receive better and easily available care if the VA system
were replaced by a voucher system redeemable at local hospitals.
Local hospitals operate at least 30 percent below capacity.
-=joe=-
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!150!140!Joe.Chamberlain
Internet: Joe.Chamberlain@f140.n150.z1.fidonet.orgPandora.Nigh@f3.n157.z1.fidonet.org (Pandora Nigh) (10/05/90)
Index Number: 10892
Hi Jack, unfortunately a what was said on the tv was correct. My SO
works for Motorola and does the maintenance on the Wade Park VA.
hospital. While he has never seen much of the patients he has been over
a lot of the hoptial area and it is always filthy and is falling apart.
He also has fits about the caliber of people that they have working
there. One of the things that the main radio console does is to operate
the pagers and the intercom system. He has been beeped (emergency paged)
several time late at night to go out there because the system is totaly
dead. When he gets there he finds out the idiots have just turned off
the radio. Even when he call after the page to find out what type of
problem and he asks them to check if the radio is on, they tell him yes.
The idiots can't even figure out if the radio is on or off and it has a
big idiot on/off light on the console. He has been there several times
when it rains and there are leaks all over the place, sometimes enough
for it to look like the place just went through a flood.
Right now several of the area congressmen are getting into the act
and taking statements of other complaints from Vets that are recieving
service there or have had. There is also another Vets hospital here but
nothing much is being said about the Brecksville facility yet.
Pandora
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!157!3!Pandora.Nigh
Internet: Pandora.Nigh@f3.n157.z1.fidonet.orgAnn.Stalnaker@p0.f14.n385.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker) (10/05/90)
Index Number: 10893 > Did anyone else watch the program on TV last Thursday? > The one Diane Sawyer did on Veteran's Hospitals? Jack, I saw Prime Time last Thursday night and I was appalled at what was shown and reported, however, I was NOT surprised as I've been told some horror stories by some of the Vets. I guess it all has to do with certain areas as well as how overcrowded the hospitals are but gee whiz - what's going to happen if the government keeps cutting back funds for health care for our veterans who have served their country??? -- Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!385!14.0!Ann.Stalnaker Internet: Ann.Stalnaker@p0.f14.n385.z1.fidonet.org
Neola.Fritz@f627.n290.z1.fidonet.org (Neola Fritz) (10/05/90)
Index Number: 10895
I have worked in a VA hospital for over 15 years now. There are many
dedicated workers around me. We care. Sometimes we are over worked, but
still care.
If nothing else, the program aired last Thrusday night, makes me want to
rededicate myself to caring just a little bit more. Burn out will just
have to wait a few more years. I feel it is a privledge to serve those
who have given so much to our country.
... Out of enviromental space. Press <ESC>
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!290!627!Neola.Fritz
Internet: Neola.Fritz@f627.n290.z1.fidonet.orgAndy.Anderson@f120.n138.z1.fidonet.org (Andy Anderson) (10/09/90)
Index Number: 10967
NF> have to wait a few more years. I feel it is a privledge to
NF> serve those
NF> who have given so much to our country.
NF>
As a 100% disabled Vet,allow me to thank you ,and all dedicated VA
workers.THANK YOU.
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!138!120!Andy.Anderson
Internet: Andy.Anderson@f120.n138.z1.fidonet.orgGjoseph.Peck@f203.n321.z1.fidonet.org (Gjoseph Peck) (10/10/90)
Index Number: 10991
In a message of Oct 02 20:53, Neola Fritz (1:290/627) said:
NF )I have worked in a VA hospital for over 15 years now. There are many
NF )dedicated workers around me. We care. Sometimes we are over worked, but
NF )still care.
NF )If nothing else, the program aired last Thrusday night, makes me want to
NF )rededicate myself to caring just a little bit more. Burn out will just
NF )have to wait a few more years. I feel it is a privledge to serve those
NF )who have given so much to our country.
Thank you, Neola!!!
Its a pleasure to hear from inside the VA the words you've written above!
Until the Gramm-Rudman-Hollings budget axe got my position, I, too,
worked at a VA hospital... Its the caring, concerned people that
many of our brother/sister veterans continue to search out, time
and time again.
I'm sure that your caring and concern is a bright light in a
sometimes cold and sterile environment for many!
I thank an' salute you ... (if ONLY many others around ya could
also catch that same spirit!!!)
Ci'ao for Ni'ao
- Joe -
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!321!203!Gjoseph.Peck
Internet: Gjoseph.Peck@f203.n321.z1.fidonet.orgJack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/12/90)
Index Number: 11067
NF> I have worked in a VA hospital for over 15 years now. There
NF> are many dedicated workers around me. We care. Sometimes we
NF> are over worked, but still care.
Hi Neola. Almost everyone that I have encountered at VA hospitals
has just the same attitude as you have. They are overloaded with
work, which means you have to do a lot of waiting. But I never
fail to get the impression that they really care. I have heard
"horror stories" of exceptions, and don't doubt that they exist.
But they are exceptions, not the rule.
I truly believe I've seen more caring in VA hospitals than in
general public hospitals.
NF> If nothing else, the program aired last Thrusday night, makes
NF> me want to rededicate myself to caring just a little bit more.
... Jack.
# Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26)
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!34!Jack.O'keeffe
Internet: Jack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.orgJack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/12/90)
Index Number: 11068
AS> Jack, I saw Prime Time last Thursday night and I was appalled at
AS> what was shown and reported, however, I was NOT surprised as
AS> I've been told some horror stories by some of the Vets.
I guess I've just been lucky, Annie. My VA experiences have been
almost all positive. I suppose it's natural to comment more on the
horror stories, which no doubt do exist. People don't talk much
about the positive experiences. I have to go back to the VA hospital
here next week for a recheck of my ear. The hearing aids haven't
been working well lately. I'm convinced the problem is electronic,
but they won't agree without checking the residual hearing first.
... Jack.
# Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26)
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!34!Jack.O'keeffe
Internet: Jack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.orgJack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/12/90)
Index Number: 11069
JC> In reality, a recent study demonstrated that the Vet
JC> would receive better and easily available care if the VA system
JC> were replaced by a voucher system redeemable at local hospitals.
JC> Local hospitals operate at least 30 percent below capacity.
That may be true in aggregate, Joe. But I can tell more horror stories
about local hospitals than about the VA. Also, most local hospitals
have very little experience with some of the conditions that the VA
routinely treats.
Something drastic needs to be done with the entire health care system
in this country. Except for South Africa, the US is the only developed
country without some comprehensive health care system serving everyone
who needs it. We spend FAR more on health care, but get a very poor
return on our investment.
... Jack.
# Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26)
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!34!Jack.O'keeffe
Internet: Jack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.orgdmimi@uncecs.edu (Mimi Clifford) (10/13/90)
Index Number: 11083 I have been interested in the dialog about the VA and find the same arguments crop up in regard to other medical/psychological issues from time to time. Namely, people seem to want 'caring' from those taking care of them. Now, I'd be the last to want to be seeing someone who is cold, and who doesn't seem to respect me and my feelings, but, even more than caring, I want him/her to be expert at whatever he/she is advising me about. I'd rather have a surgeon who is REALLY GOOD with a knife and diagnosis and who is an sob as a person than one who is the opposite, for example. Same with audiologists, orthopods, etc., etc., etc. The VA may or may not have as expert personnel as other medical facilities, but they do seem to be grossly overloaded and to have rather poor salery and other monetary support. If I had a choice, Id go elsewhere. The biggest problem, of course, is how to find out if a particular individual is good or not, and I don't know the answer to that one. By good, I mean expert at whatever I'm consulting him/her about. Asking a different 'good' expert for a referral is one way, but not always successful either.
Joe.Chamberlain@f140.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain) (10/13/90)
Index Number: 11103
JO> Something drastic needs to be done with the entire health care system
JO> in this country. Except for South Africa, the US is the only
developed
JO> country without some comprehensive health care system serving everyone
JO> who needs it. We spend FAR more on health care, but get a very poor
JO> return on our investment.
The American health care system has become bloated and
inefficient. It keeps taking more of the gross nation product
and continues to row in the share of the national budget. In
1989 the U.S. spent $2200 per person on health care, Great
Britian spent $600, and Singapore $300; all with about the same
result. The health care system now takes about 15 cents out of
every dollar spent in America. Health care costs in America are
nearly eight times that of our international competitors. By not
having the internal discipline to say no to the excesses America
is adding yet another nail to its economic coffin.
-=joe=-
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!150!140!Joe.Chamberlain
Internet: Joe.Chamberlain@f140.n150.z1.fidonet.orgPandora.Nigh@f3.n157.z1.fidonet.org (Pandora Nigh) (10/17/90)
Index Number: 11131
Hi Jack, yes the quality does vary. We have two seperate VA
hospitals here. The Wade Park facility that was shown on Diane Sawyers
report and the Brecksville Center. Only the Wade Park facility has been
really bad. I also think that anytime you go to the hospital you can run
into some real bad care and unsatisfactory enviornmental conditions. I
have been in hospitals that at night if you ring for a bed pan or
anything else you can wait hours for response. ( I have solved this
problem- I wet the bed and then they have to remake the whole thing plus
transfer me in the middle of the night and this takes longer than to get
a bed pan. Once you do that to them it's amazing how fast they come when
you buzz.) I have been on wards where the nursing staff had no idea how
to transfer or help you transfer from the bed to a chair. There concept
was to dislocate your shoulders and collar bones as they drop you to the
floor. At Metro General hosptial I had a filthy room, the window sill
and the side of the bed next to that looked like it hadn't been cleaned
in years. I guess when ever and what ever hospital you go to you can
run into problems. But there is no excuse for the degree of abuse that
the Wade Park facility did.
Pandora
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!157!3!Pandora.Nigh
Internet: Pandora.Nigh@f3.n157.z1.fidonet.orgJack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/24/90)
Index Number: 11252
To: dmimi@uncecs.edu (Mimi Clifford)
MC> I'd rather have a surgeon who is REALLY GOOD with a knife and
MC> diagnosis and who is an sob as a person than one who is the
MC> opposite, for example. Same with audiologists, orthopods,
MC> biggest problem, of course, is how to find out if a particular
MC> individual is good or not, and I don't know the answer to that
Mimi, time was when one trusted any health professional until he/she
proved unworthy of the trust. Now just the opposite is true. One
distrusts them all until they demonstrate they are trustworthy. The
horror stories abound, and not only in the VA facilities.
... Caveat Emptor!
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!26!Jack.O'keeffe
Internet: Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org