[misc.handicap] VA Hospitals

Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/03/90)

Index Number: 10818

Did anyone else watch the program on TV last Thursday?  The one
Diane Sawyer did on Veteran's Hospitals?  Having spent a fair
amount of time in VA hospitals, but NOT the one in Cleveland
that was featured on TV, I have to say that my experience does
not compare precisely with what Diane reported.  You spend a
lot of time waiting of course, but once that is past I have
experienced considerate, caring, professional attention.  They
have limited resources to work with, but I sincerely believe
they do the best they can with what they have.

I do hear that the quality of care varies greatly from one
hospital to another, all the way from excellent to wretched.

What distressed me most, even more than the lack of attention
to the paralized vietnam vet, was the reaction of VA Secretary
Derwinski.  He seemed to be much more upset at the media for
reporting despicable conditions than he was for the existence
of the conditions reported.  I understand he has dispatched
a team of investigators to the Cleveland VA hospital.  Probably
not to investigate the actual patient care, but to investigate
the lapse of security that let Diane get in with her hidden
TV camera.

... Xpress Yourself!

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Joe.Chamberlain@f140.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain) (10/05/90)

Index Number: 10890

 JO> What distressed me most, even more than the lack of attention
 JO> to the paralized vietnam vet, was the reaction of VA Secretary
 JO> Derwinski.  He seemed to be much more upset at the media for
 JO> reporting despicable conditions than he was for the existence
 JO> of the conditions reported.  I understand he has dispatched
 JO> a team of investigators to the Cleveland VA hospital.  Probably
 JO> not to investigate the actual patient care, but to investigate
 JO> the lapse of security that let Diane get in with her hidden
 JO> TV camera.
     
        I agree.  He seemed to be making excuses rather than 
statements of improvements.  

        In reality, a recent study demonstrated that the Vet 
would receive better and easily available care if the VA system 
were replaced by a voucher system redeemable at local hospitals.  
Local hospitals operate at least 30 percent below capacity.

                                -=joe=-

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Pandora.Nigh@f3.n157.z1.fidonet.org (Pandora Nigh) (10/05/90)

Index Number: 10892

     Hi Jack, unfortunately a what was said on the tv was correct. My SO 
works for Motorola and does the maintenance on the Wade Park VA. 
hospital. While he has never seen much of the patients he has been over 
a lot of the hoptial area and it is always filthy and is falling apart. 
He also has fits about the caliber of people that they have working 
there. One of the things that the main radio console does is to operate 
the pagers and the intercom system. He has been beeped (emergency paged) 
several time late at night to go out there because the system is totaly 
dead. When he gets there he finds out the idiots have just turned off 
the radio. Even when he call after the page to find out what type of 
problem and he asks them to check if the radio is on, they tell him yes. 
The idiots can't even figure out if the radio is on or off and it has a 
big idiot on/off light on the console. He has been there several times 
when it rains and there are leaks all over the place, sometimes enough 
for it to look like the place just went through a flood.
     Right now several of the area congressmen are getting into the act 
and taking statements of other complaints from Vets that are recieving 
service there or have had. There is also another Vets hospital here but 
nothing much is being said about the Brecksville facility yet.
                       Pandora

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Ann.Stalnaker@p0.f14.n385.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker) (10/05/90)

Index Number: 10893

 > Did anyone else watch the program on TV last Thursday?
 > The one Diane Sawyer did on Veteran's Hospitals?
 
Jack, I saw Prime Time last Thursday night and I was appalled at 
what was shown and reported, however, I was NOT surprised as I've 
been told some horror stories by some of the Vets.
 
I guess it all has to do with certain areas as well as how overcrowded 
the hospitals are but gee whiz - what's going to happen if the 
government keeps cutting back funds for health care for our veterans 
who have served their country???
 

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Neola.Fritz@f627.n290.z1.fidonet.org (Neola Fritz) (10/05/90)

Index Number: 10895

I have worked in a VA hospital for over 15 years now.  There are many
dedicated workers around me.  We care.  Sometimes we are over worked, but
still care.
If nothing else, the program aired last Thrusday night, makes me want to
rededicate myself to caring just a little bit more.  Burn out will just
have to wait a few more years.  I feel it is a privledge to serve those
who have given so much to our country.

... Out of enviromental space.  Press <ESC>

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Andy.Anderson@f120.n138.z1.fidonet.org (Andy Anderson) (10/09/90)

Index Number: 10967

NF> have to wait a few more years.  I feel it is a privledge to
NF> serve those
NF> who have given so much to our country.
NF> 
As a 100% disabled Vet,allow me to thank you ,and all dedicated VA 
workers.THANK YOU.

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Gjoseph.Peck@f203.n321.z1.fidonet.org (Gjoseph Peck) (10/10/90)

Index Number: 10991

In a message of Oct 02 20:53, Neola Fritz (1:290/627) said:
 NF )I have worked in a VA hospital for over 15 years now.  There are many
 NF )dedicated workers around me.  We care.  Sometimes we are over worked, but
 NF )still care.
 NF )If nothing else, the program aired last Thrusday night, makes me want to
 NF )rededicate myself to caring just a little bit more.  Burn out will just
 NF )have to wait a few more years.  I feel it is a privledge to serve those
 NF )who have given so much to our country.

Thank you, Neola!!!

Its a pleasure to hear from inside the VA the words you've written above!

Until the Gramm-Rudman-Hollings budget axe got my position, I, too,
worked at a VA hospital...  Its the caring, concerned people that
many of our brother/sister veterans continue to search out, time
and time again.

I'm sure that your caring and concern is a bright light in a
sometimes cold and sterile environment for many!

I thank an' salute you ...  (if ONLY many others around ya could
also catch that same spirit!!!)

Ci'ao for Ni'ao

    - Joe -

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Jack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/12/90)

Index Number: 11067

 NF> I have worked in a VA hospital for over 15 years now.  There
 NF> are many dedicated workers around me.  We care.  Sometimes we
 NF> are over worked, but still care.

Hi Neola.  Almost everyone that I have encountered at VA hospitals
has just the same attitude as you have.  They are overloaded with
work, which means you have to do a lot of waiting.  But I never
fail to get the impression that they really care.  I have heard
"horror stories" of exceptions, and don't doubt that they exist.
But they are exceptions, not the rule.

I truly believe I've seen more caring in VA hospitals than in
general public hospitals.

 NF> If nothing else, the program aired last Thrusday night, makes
 NF> me want to rededicate myself to caring just a little bit more.

... Jack.
 # Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26)

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Jack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/12/90)

Index Number: 11068

 AS> Jack, I saw Prime Time last Thursday night and I was appalled at
 AS> what was shown and reported, however, I was NOT surprised as
 AS> I've been told some horror stories by some of the Vets.

I guess I've just been lucky, Annie.  My VA experiences have been
almost all positive.  I suppose it's natural to comment more on the
horror stories, which no doubt do exist.  People don't talk much
about the positive experiences.  I have to go back to the VA hospital
here next week for a recheck of my ear.  The hearing aids haven't
been working well lately.  I'm convinced the problem is electronic,
but they won't agree without checking the residual hearing first.

... Jack.
 # Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26)

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Jack.O'keeffe@f34.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/12/90)

Index Number: 11069

 JC>         In reality, a recent study demonstrated that the Vet
 JC> would receive better and easily available care if the VA system
 JC> were replaced by a voucher system redeemable at local hospitals.
 JC> Local hospitals operate at least 30 percent below capacity.

That may be true in aggregate, Joe.  But I can tell more horror stories
about local hospitals than about the VA.  Also, most local hospitals
have very little experience with some of the conditions that the VA
routinely treats.

Something drastic needs to be done with the entire health care system
in this country.  Except for South Africa, the US is the only developed
country without some comprehensive health care system serving everyone
who needs it.  We spend FAR more on health care, but get a very poor
return on our investment.

... Jack.
 # Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26)

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dmimi@uncecs.edu (Mimi Clifford) (10/13/90)

Index Number: 11083

I have been interested in the dialog about the VA and find the same
arguments crop up in regard to other medical/psychological issues
from time to time.  Namely, people seem to want 'caring' from those
taking care of them.  Now, I'd be the last to want to be seeing
someone who is cold, and who doesn't seem to respect me and my
feelings, but, even more than caring, I want him/her to be expert
at whatever he/she is advising me about.  I'd rather have a surgeon
who is REALLY GOOD with a knife and diagnosis and who is an sob as
a person than one who is the opposite, for example.  Same with
audiologists, orthopods, etc., etc., etc.  The VA may or may not
have as expert personnel as other medical facilities, but they do
seem to be grossly overloaded and to have rather poor salery and
other monetary support.  If I had a choice, Id go elsewhere.  The
biggest problem, of course, is how to find out if a particular
individual is good or not, and I don't know the answer to that
one.  By good, I mean expert at whatever I'm consulting him/her
about.  Asking a different 'good' expert for a referral is one way,
but not always successful either.

Joe.Chamberlain@f140.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain) (10/13/90)

Index Number: 11103

 JO> Something drastic needs to be done with the entire health care system
 JO> in this country.  Except for South Africa, the US is the only 
developed
 JO> country without some comprehensive health care system serving everyone
 JO> who needs it.  We spend FAR more on health care, but get a very poor
 JO> return on our investment.
     
        The American health care system has become bloated and 
inefficient.  It keeps taking more of the gross nation product 
and continues to row in the share of the national budget.  In 
1989 the U.S. spent $2200 per person on health care, Great 
Britian spent $600, and Singapore $300; all with about the same 
result.  The health care system now takes about 15 cents out of 
every dollar spent in America.  Health care costs in America are 
nearly eight times that of our international competitors.  By not 
having the internal discipline to say no to the excesses America 
is adding yet another nail to its economic coffin.

                                -=joe=-

 

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Pandora.Nigh@f3.n157.z1.fidonet.org (Pandora Nigh) (10/17/90)

Index Number: 11131

     Hi Jack, yes the quality does vary. We have two seperate VA 
hospitals here. The Wade Park facility that was shown on Diane Sawyers 
report and the Brecksville Center. Only the Wade Park facility has been 
really bad. I also think that anytime you go to the hospital you can run 
into some real bad care and unsatisfactory enviornmental conditions. I 
have been in hospitals that at night if you ring for a bed pan or 
anything else you can wait hours for response. ( I have solved this 
problem- I wet the bed and then they have to remake the whole thing plus 
transfer me in the middle of the night and this takes longer than to get 
a bed pan. Once you do that to them it's amazing how fast they come when 
you buzz.) I have been on wards where the nursing staff had no idea how 
to transfer or help you transfer from the bed to a chair. There concept 
was to dislocate your shoulders and collar bones as they drop you to the 
floor. At Metro General hosptial I had a filthy room, the window sill 
and the side of the bed next to that looked like it hadn't been cleaned 
in years. I guess when ever and what ever hospital you go to you can 
run into problems. But there is no excuse for the degree of abuse that 
the  Wade Park facility did.
                                   Pandora

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Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe) (10/24/90)

Index Number: 11252

To: dmimi@uncecs.edu (Mimi Clifford)

 MC> I'd rather have a surgeon who is REALLY GOOD with a knife and
 MC> diagnosis and who is an sob as a person than one who is the
 MC> opposite, for example.  Same with audiologists, orthopods,

 MC> biggest problem, of course, is how to find out if a particular
 MC> individual is good or not, and I don't know the answer to that

Mimi, time was when one trusted any health professional until he/she
proved unworthy of the trust.  Now just the opposite is true.  One
distrusts them all until they demonstrate they are trustworthy.  The
horror stories abound, and not only in the VA facilities.

... Caveat Emptor!

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