James.Womack@f14.n300.z1.fidonet.org (James Womack) (05/24/91)
Index Number: 15774
[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]
Stephen, don't come down so hard on Jay as a hardliner. Recently there
was a post from a person rejoicing that so many residential schools
for the deaf are closing so more deaf kids can be mainstreamed. This
poster claimed at another time to believe in letting the Deaf be exposed
to more than just one communication (and I think educational) method.
Yet this statement of "rejoicing" betrays a hardliner position far
greater than a great of flexibility on various topics including cochlear
implants shown by Jay and others.
I have seen the Jay-type "hardliners, myself included I suppose, state
more than once that the other side definitely has a place as long as
it is not a wholesale push down the throat of Deaf people. On the other
line, I have seen the other side showing that contrary to lip service,
throat cramming is what is really in their hearts.
I have no doubt that Jay, myself, Tim and others will make statements
contending with ideas held by oralists that will get us branded as
"hardliners" , "Deaf Apartheits" and worse. But kindly look at what
the other side is also saying and you will see why lines are so starkly
drawn. I think we "hardliners" see so many statements that say outright
or imply wholesale hearizing Deaf people that we do what is natural
to any people who are or perceive themselves as being forced to be
something they are not. We resist with considerable force. I will be
the first to say that animosity is not the answer, but we are humans
; whether we are "hardliners" or not-we are human. And ever have humans
been a contrary lot. I guess that's why we need angels, super heroes,
thumbs to suck and homemade biscuits.
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Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!300!14!James.Womack
Internet: James.Womack@f14.n300.z1.fidonet.orgTim.Smith@f429.n275.z1.fidonet.org (Tim Smith) (05/30/91)
Index Number: 15834
[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]
I agree wholly with what you said.. Anything I say in support of ASL and
agannist the oralistic method, I will always be branded a "hardliner.."
It is indeed ironic for me to hear people calling me a hardliner.. for
I am SUCH a flexible guy...
BUT!
What I FIGHT aganist is the "Cramming so called facts down the deafie's
throat about how they SHOULD do things."
Things are NOT "One way or the other"
So, when I sound EXTREME in my views towards ASL and aganist the
oralistic method, I am simply trying to balance things out.
Hence the "Fight fire with fire" Philosphy...
I am willing to compromise with just about anything- but as long as
opinions are crammed down MY throat, they won';t get "Mr. Nice Guy"
treatment from ME.
Tim
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Internet: Tim.Smith@f429.n275.z1.fidonet.orgJames.Womack@f14.n300.z1.fidonet.org (James Womack) (05/30/91)
Index Number: 15847
[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]
I "hear" you, Tim and agree. I too would rather not turn on afterburners.
The fact is the oral and mainstreaming camp does have people who despite
lip service to the contrary; do indeed gun down the beliefs of the
other side. Then when the other side draws a line and says come no
farther; the opposing camp cries "FOUL!"
One nice thing is that in my job at the local community college, I
have had the privilege of discussing the same ASL and mainstreaming
issues with members of the opposing camp on very friendly terms. I
am proud to say that their honesty and truly listening tomore than
just themselves making noises led to my shifting my ideas about certain
things. I am just as proud to say that these same people also shifted.
It shows the two sides can really communicate if there is a desire
to do so in the first place. Ilearned from them and theylearned from
me. As a consequence, one mainstreaming school engaged ina teacher
exchange program to promote better understanding between residential
and mainstreaming programs. No lip service, just honesty and willingness
to see that there was more than one side of an issue. And no being
glad to see residential schools being shut down because they saw the
value of Deaf togetherness; especially in the early years and for certain
teenagers who needed to develop a sense of self. I am proud to have
associated with these members of the opposite camp. They are the real
flexible people on their side of the fence.
I wish the true inflexibles who label folks like you and I inflexible
and Deaf Apartheits, etc could be like these good folks at Pueblo and
other schools I know here. Hang in there. Stick to your goods and just
ne honest and fair. There are lots of good guys out there who truly
understand what this is all about. They are from all corners of the
field.
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Internet: James.Womack@f14.n300.z1.fidonet.orgTim.Smith@f429.n275.z1.fidonet.org (Tim Smith) (06/17/91)
Index Number: 16064
[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]
I agree with you.. The inflexibility of some people here really get
to me.. I KNOW that I sound inflexible sometimes... But sometimes, you
just got to fight fire with fire, you dig?
Like I said, I love ASL, and I love English just as much, or perhaps
MORE!
But I see when something is not working right.
And I want to do something about it.
I am willing to compromise- What I am for, is NOT total segreation of
the deaf and hearing- but for eachother just to accept eachother.
The attitude I get in Mainstream is "It's not Okay to be deaf. Try your
damnest to be as close to being hearing as you can."
And the problem with residential schools is that there isn't much
contact with the hearing majority of the world.
What I desparately want is a compromise of the two- to merge the two...
And that's where the Bi-cultural, Bi-lingustic education comes inn.
Teach them ASL first and then English! Let them know it's OKAY to be
deaf! Nothing to be ashamed of!
Get the best of BOTH worlds!
You and I, James, have an advantage!
We can dip into BOTH worlds to get the best benfits!
Isn't it great?!
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Internet: Tim.Smith@f429.n275.z1.fidonet.org