hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com (12/05/89)
Dear Behnam Sadeghi, I'd like to apologize to you for the length of these articles. However, the nature of the question you had raised was such that it required an in-depth discussion of various Islamic Scriptures and Traditions. I hope that I have addressed your question to your satisfaction. Let us discuss the question you had raised. You had mentioned: >I am confused about some point in the Bahai faith and hope that you >may be able to clear it up. > I learned from a posting by Mr. (or Ms.?) Mcguire that according >to the Bahai faith Prophet Mohammad was the messanger of God sent >for *his time*. And I suspect that in your faith Bahaullah is >considered a new prophet. The past two sentenses-if they are correct- >are what create the confusion in my mind. > If Prophet Mohammad was a messenger of God, then we should accept >that his statement were true. He specifically stated that the Quran >is revealation from God and that is also stated in the Quran itself. >The Quran, however, calls Mohammad "Khatamon Nabieen" literally means >"The Seal of the Prophets." Furthermore, there are quite some narrations >from Mohammad himself where he says that he is the last prophet. Es- >pecially, during his last pilgrimage to Mecca, in front of a huge >multitude, he declared that he is the last prophet and that no prophet will >come after him. So many people witnessed the speech on the Last Pilgrimage >and reported it that there can not be too much doubt as to its >authenticity. > What I am wondering about is how are the above mentioned facts >reconciled with the Bahai beliefs mentioned earlier? The only way >of reconciling the two that I can think of would be to adopt the >attitude that Islam has towards the current Christian and Judaist >scriptures; namely, these books contain some truth but there have been >corrupted or tempered with through time and consequently they cannot >be held to be the absolute words of God. Is this the attitude that the >Bahai faith adopts towards Islam? Know my friend that the secret of reconciliation between the traditions you are thinking of, in supporting the finality of Prophet Muhammad, and the Faith of Islam, and the teachings of the Baha'i Faith on progressive revelation, resides in the re-examination of the Muslim Scripture and traditions. Baha'is do by no means suggest that the verses of the Holy Qur'an have been corrupted by the Muslims. Baha'is believe that some of the verses of the Qur'an have been taken literally by Muslims, and as a result certain understandings of various theological concepts have evolved throughout the past fourteen centuries which are not in conformity with other teachings of Muhammad, and those of the Imams. The highly metaphorical nature of the Scripture often becomes a very challenging issue for the believers to determine the truest meaning behind every verse of the Qur'an. Remember the well known Tradition, where His Honor Muhammad says: "We say one word, and by it We mean seventy and two things." There are manifold meaning associated with each verse of the Qur'an. And an ocean of wisdom is laid hidden within each one of those meanings. Yet, if one's approach to the verses of the scripture tends to be literal, and if one's perception of those verses becomes limited to their words, then one is susceptible to failure in understanding the inner significance of the metaphors, at the price of the outer appearance of the sentences. One is prone to slip into the pitfall of literalism, when one's faith becomes founded on imitation and one's religion becomes an inherited necessity in one's life, rather than an independently investigated reality. Jalalu'ddin-i Rumi' the renown Persian poet in his book Mathnawi addresses this concept of blind approach to the Scripture as follows: "The Sage of Ghazna (*) told the mystic story To his veiled hearers, in an allegory: If those who err see naught in the Qur'an But only words, it's not to wonder on; Of all the sun's fire, lighting up the sky Only the warmth can reach a blind man's eye." (*) Referring to another Sufi poet Sana'i. In the Holy Qur'an 2:24 Muhammad, through the tongue of Revelation says: "Many will He (i.e. God) mislead by such parables (i.e. metaphors) and many guide: but none will He mislead thereby except the wicked..." Remember the saying of the Qur'an: 'Have they eyes, but they see not, have they ears, but they hear not, have they minds but they understand not....'. The state of the scriptural literalists must be considered within the context of this verse. I'd like to emphasize that I am not, God forbid, saying this in a sarcastic way. My sole purpose is to point out to a natural pitfall which forms with time in any religion. Baha'u'llah addresses the Qur'anic concept of the "Seal of the Prophets", as follows: `Likewise, in this day, thou hast heard the people impute similar charges to this Revelation (i.e. referring to the Revelation of Qa'im), saying: "He hath compiled these words from the words of old;" or "these words are spurious." Vain and haughty are their sayings, low their estate and station. After the denials and denunciations which they uttered, (i.e. referring to Jews and Christians), they protested saying: "No independent Prophet, according to our Scriptures, should arise after Moses and Jesus to abolish the Law of the Divine Revelation. Nay, he that is to be made manifest (i.e. the Promised One) must needs fulfill the Law." Thereupon this verse, indicative of all the divine themes, and testifying to the truth that the flow of the grace of the All-Merciful can never cease, was revealed (i.e. by Muhammad): "And Joseph came to you aforetime with clear tokens, but ye ceased not to doubt of the message with which He came to you, until, when He died, ye said, `God will by no means rise up a Messenger after Him.' Thus God misleadeth him who is the transgressor the doubter." [Qur'an 40-34] Therefore, understand from this verse and know of a certainty that the people in every age, clinging to a verse of the Book, have uttered such vain and absurd sayings, contending that no Prophet should again be made manifest to the world. Even as the Christian divines who, holding fast to the verses of the Gospel...have sought to explain that the law of the Gospel shall at no time be annulled, and that no independent Prophet shall again be made manifest, unless He confirmeth the Law of the Gospel. Most of the people have become afflicted with the same spiritual disease. Even as thou witness how the people of the Qur'an, like unto the people of the old, have allowed the word "Seal of the Prophets" to veil their eyes. And yet, they themselves testify to this verse: "None knoweth the interpretation thereof but God and they that are well-grounded in knowledge." [Qur'an 3:7]' Book of Certitude p. 212-213 Part I of VI Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com Tel#508-568-6925
hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com (12/05/89)
Continuation from part II: Let us now examine the opinions of various Muslim theologians, from both Shi'ah and Sunni backgrounds, on the meaning of the term Khatam'u-Nabieen.I will first focus on this, from a Shi'ah perspective since, the individual who raised this question is a Shi'ah Muslim, then I will discuss the Sunni view as well as some other views: Mulla Fatth-i-Kashani, who is one of the highly respected Shi'ah scholars, in his commentary on Manhaj-ul-Sadegheen, addresses the concept of Khatam'u-Nabieen as follows: "Muhammad's fear became a reality, after He married Zei'nab. After marriage, the idolaters, and His enemies started criticizing Him, and accusing Him of hypocrisy. They'd say, Muhammad teaches His followers that it is unlawful for a father to marry his son's divorced wife, while He has married Zayd's wife. -Zayd was purchased by Muhammad and freed to live as a free man, and Muhammad had adopted him as His son. Arabs of the time of Jahliah, considered one's adopted son as the real son. This is why they started to accuse Muhammad of hypocrisy.- As a result of this criticism, God revealed to Muhammad, Peace be upon Him!, as reflected in the Su'rih of the Confederates, that, Muhammad is not the father of any man (i.e. any male offsprings) among you (since, no surviving male offsprings remained after He passed away). As a result, the law of not marrying the divorced wife of a son would not apply to Muhammad. Furthermore, God calls Muhammad an Apostle of God, in that same verse, (suggesting that He was the spiritual father of all Arabs, and Zayd was simply an Arab with no blood relationship to Him). Moreover, the verse identifies Muhammad as the seal of the prophets, that is to say, since He did not have any surviving male offsprings to inherit prophethood from Him, thus, prophethood was sealed with Him. That is to say, no prophets shall appear after Him... All of Muhammad's male offsprings died in early childhood, prior to Muhammad's own passing, thus, this verse of the Qur'an came into fulfillment." In the same book [i.e. his commentary on Manhaj-ul-Sadegheen], Mulla Fatth-i- Kashani, offers a tradition attributed to Muhammad, where He says: "I am Muhammad, and I am Ahmad and I am that resurrector, through Whom God shall resurrect His people. And I am the last, after Me there shall be no other prophet." Also, he offers another tradition, in the same book, where, Muhammad the Messenger of God tells Ali, Peace be upon Him!: "If it was allowed that after me there be another prophet, that would have been you, and no one but you." Allamih Jallal-u-Din Soivotti in Jami-ul-Saghir quotes Ayeshih (one of the wives of Prophet Muhammad), who had quoted Muhammad saying: "No prophet shall appear after Me, but Omar-ibn-Khattab." [For the information of the non-Muslim readers, Omar was one of Muhammad's son-in-laws, who agreed to become the 2nd Khalif after Abu-Bakr]. [Clearly, the concept of no Nabi, or prophet, appearing after Muhammad must have been associated with His immediate successorship, and had nothing to do with coming of future Messengers from God. Otherwise, why would Muhammad want to discuss Omar's -the second Khalif's- name in this tradition]. Many of the Shi'ah commentators believe in a literal meaning of the term Khatam- u-Nabieen (Seal of the Prophets, after Whom no other Messengers of God shall come), however, there are other commentators who believe differently: Sheikh Sadoogh, another highly respected Shi'ah scholar/theologian argues in his book, Ekmaal-al-Din vol I: "All the Messengers of God who appeared prior to Muhammad, were succeeded by a Nabi (i.e. a prophet). Adam was a Rasool (Messenger of God), and His successor was Shais the Nabi (Seth the prophet). Noah was a Messenger of God and His successor was Saam the Nabi (Shem the prophet). Abraham, Moses, Jesus and David (peace be upon Them!), were also God's Messengers, Whose successors were Isaac, Jashua, Simon (St. Peter) and Solomon Who were all prophets. However, the successors of Muhammad, Rasool-Allah (the Messenger of God), were not called Nabis (prophets). They were referred to as Imams. Therefore, Ali was not a Nabi, Hasan was not a Nabi, Hossein was not a Nabi, etc...., since, with the Manifestation of Muhammad, the usage of the term Nabi was abandoned (i.e. He was Khatam-u-Nabieen), and ended. As Muhammad was greater than the previous Messengers, so were His appointed successors (i.e. Imams) were greater than Nabis (prophets)." This commentary of Sheikh Sadoogh appears to clearly reason out the inner significance of traditions such as: "Seal of the prophets", "There will be no prophets after me....". Among other Shi'ah sources there is a Hadith (tradition) recorded by Ibn-i-Shahr Ashoob in his book, "Managhib". The very same Hadith can also be found in vol IX of Bahar-ul-Anvar of Allamih Majlesi. This Hadith is from Imam Ali, (Peace be upon Him!), where He discusses the meaning of the term Khatam-u-Nabieen. After describing the ascendancy of His own station, Ali says: "...Anyone who disagrees with me, has disagreed with God, and in arrogance has surpassed all others. No prophet has achieved the station of prophethood except through the Khatam of Nabovvat (i.e. literally meaning prophethood) he received from Muhammad. And Khatam is a ring. Only after receiving the Khatam (ring) of Nabovvat, one can be called a prophet. This is why Muhammad has been called Khatam'u-Nabieen in the Qur'an....." Then He says: "Muhammad is the Seyyed (master) of the Nabieen (prophets), and I am the Seyyed and master of the Vaseein (guardians and successors). Clearly Ali's explanation of Khatam'u-Nabeein is drastically different than the meaning the literalist Muslims have given to it. There does not appear to be any implications whatsoever about cessation of revelation after His Holiness Muhammad. Part III of VI Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com Tel#508-568-6925
hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com (12/05/89)
Continuation from part V: Now, let us examine the validity of this view about the meaning of the Day of Resurrection, based on the traditions of Muhammad and those of the Imams. In his commentary on Manhaj-ul-Sadegheen, Mulla Fatth-i- Kashani, offers a tradition attributed to Muhammad, where He says: "I am Muhammad, and I am Ahmad and I am that resurrector, through Whom God shall resurrect His people...." This quote appear to suggest that the appearance of Muhammad corresponded to the Day of Resurrection for "His people", "God's people", or "the people of the Book", (Christians and Jews). Allamih Majlesi, in his book Bahar'ul-Anvar Vol 13 page 50 mentions a tradition from Imam Sadigh: "Moffadil said, that I asked Imam Sadigh that why has there not been a date established for the appearance of the Qa'im? He said; since, the manifestation of Qa'im is that same "hour" and "resurrection" recorded in the Qur'an, whose knowledge is with God, and no one but God can unveil it." That is to say, according to Imam Sadigh the Day of the appearance of the Qa'im corresponds with the Day of Resurrection for the followers of Islam. I hope that the two quotations given above validate the absurdity of the popular belief about the Day of Resurrection. Moreover, I hope that it has become apparent that both Islam, and the Qur'an are to remain intact UNTIL the Day of the appearance of the Promised Qa'im of the House of Muhammad. Then apparently it is up to the Qa'im to determine whether Muslims are to follow the Qur'an, or the Book He is going to reveal. Now that it has been established that the "Day of Resurrection" is indeed the Day of the appearance of the Qa'im, let us see when is this Day of Resurrection? In the Su'rih of Al-Sujdih (Adoration):4 we find God revealing to His Holiness Muhammad: "From the Heaven to the earth He governeth all things: hereafter shall they come up to Him on a day whose length shall be a thousand of such years as ye reckon." This quotation establishes a timeline of ONE THOUSAND YEARS for the dispensation of Islam. As you can see, that the verse quoted above suggests; "...hereafter shall they come up to Him (i.e. God)....", which explicitly refers to the time that they will arise before their God, or the time they will be resurrected. Thus the quote given above, suggests: "....hereafter shall they BE RESURRECTED on a day whose length shall be a thousand of such years as ye reckon." . Notice how clearly Sadigh, that essence of knowledge identifies the day of resurrection with the appearance of Qa'im, in the tradition of Mofaddil quoted above, without directly referring to the one thousand years timeline for the appearance of the twelfth Imam, per Al-Sujdih (Adoration):4. Moreover, according to another Tradition; Mufaddil asked Imam Sadigh saying: "'What of the signs of His (i.e. Qa'im's) manifestation, O my master?' He replied: 'In the year sixty (i.e. 1260 A.H.), His Cause (i.e. religion) shall be made manifest, and His name shall be proclaimed.'". Reference to the year sixty, is an allegorical way to describe 1260 A.H., which is exactly 1000 years (which according to Adoration:4 is the day of the coming of the Qa'im) after 260 A.H., which is the year of the passing of Imam Hasan-i- Asghari, the 11th Imam of the House of the Prophet. The Ba'b addresses this timeline explicitly in His Book, Baya'n, as follows: "....And from the moment when the Tree of Baya'n [i.e. The Ba'b is referring to Himself] appeared until it disappeareth is the Resurrection of the Apostle of God, as is divinely foretold in the Qur'an; the beginning of which was when two hours and eleven minutes had passed on the eve of the fifth of Jamadiyu'l-Avval, 1260 A.H. [May 22 1844 A.D.], which is the year 1270 of the Declaration of the Mission of Muhammad. This was the beginning of the Day of Resurrection of the Qur'an, and until the disappearance of the Tree of divine Reality is the Resurrection of the Qur'an." [The Persian Baya'n II:7] The concept of the 1260 years have also been mentioned in the Book of Daniel (Old Testament), and the Book of Revelation (New Testament). Interestingly enough, the Promised Qa'im of Shiet Islam, or the Promised Mihdi of Sunni Islam is the same Messenger awaited by Jews (i.e. Elijah), and by Christians (i.e. the return of John the Baptist), who is going to appear and pave the way for the appearance of Christ, the Glory of God. There are other traditions from the Imams of the Faith, which explicitly refers to the Qa'im or Mihdi, as a law-giver, and an author of a new religion. Perhaps the following few quotations will shed some light on this issue, which has been the cause of much confusion among the majority of Muslims throughout the past millennium. According to a Tradition recorded in the volume 13 of Bahar'ul-Anvar of Majlesi: "In our Qa'im there shall be four signs from four Prophets. Moses, Jesus, Joseph and Muhammad. The sign from Moses, is fear and expectation; from Jesus, that which was spoken of Him; from Joseph, imprisonment and dissimulation; from Muhammad, the Revelation of a Book similar to the Qur'an." Furthermore, in the Tradition of Arba'in it is recorded: "Out of Bani-Hashim there shall come forth a Youth Who shall reveal new laws. He shall summon the people unto Him, but none will heed His call. Most of His enemies will be the divines (i.e. the religious leaders). His bidding they will not obey, but will protest saying: 'This is contrary to that which hath been handed down unto us by the Imams of the Faith." Moreover, Imam Sadiq is recorded to have said: "There shall appear a Youth from Bani-Hashim, Who will bid the people plight fealty unto Him. His Book will be a new Book, unto which He shall summon the people to pledge their faith. Stern is His Revelation unto the Arab. If ye hear it about Him, hasten unto Him." Considering all the traditions and verses quoted above one can either implicitly or explicitly conclude the following: 1- The term Khatam'u-Nabieen has several inner meanings, non of which suggest cessation of Revelation from God 2- Islam is not everlasting, but it has a special term and time; 3- Islam and the Qur'an are valid until the Day of Resurrection; 4- The day of resurrection is the time of the appearance of the Qa'im or the 12th Imam; 5- The day of resurrection is established to happen in 1000 years. 6- Therefore the day of the appearance of the Qa'im is within 1000 years from some point in the Islamic dispensation (i.e. 260 A.H. year of the passing of the 11th Imam.) 7- The Qa'im will have His own religion. 8- The Qa'im will have His own Book. 9- The Qa'im of the House of Muhammad is the Promised One of the Jews, and Christians as well. Might this be a fresh outlook for the pure in heart, to re-evaluate their faith and polish off the corrosion of dogmatism from their beliefs, and replace the inherited views with mindful ones, which are based on independent investigation of truth. I beg the Lord to illumine our hearts, and inspire our minds to be fair in our judgments. I would like to close this discussion by the following verse of the Holy Qur'an: "O Believers: If any evil-doer come to you with news, clear it up at once [i.e. determine its truth or falsity], lest through ignorance ye harm others, and speedily have to repent of what ye have done." [Hujaraat-49:6] Part VI of VI Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com Tel#508-568-6925
hakim%bigq.enet.dec.com@oxy.edu (12/05/89)
Continuation from part I: Muhammad, (Peace be upon Him!), has been referred to as Khatam'u-Nabieen in the Qur'an: "Muhammad is not the father of any man among you, but he is the Apostle of God, and the seal of the prophets: and God knoweth all things." [The Confederates: 39] This has been interpreted by many among Muslims to mean that Revelation from God ended with Muhammad's Revelation, and the door of God's mercy towards mankind was closed for ever. Interestingly enough, Muslims are not the only people who hold such belief. Historically Jews and Christians have based on their Scriptures maintained the belief that their religions is the final religion, and their code of law is the last set of revealed law from God. Jews will argue that they are required by Exodus 31:16-17 to keep the Sabbath as an eternal covenant: "Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the Sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual Covenant. It is a sign between Me (i.e. God) and the children of Israel." Both Jesus and Muhammad broke the Sabbath. Does this mean that they were wrong? Or, God forbid, they were false prophets? Jesus has been referred to in the Book of Revelation 1:11, as Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last. Likewise He is recorded to have said in Luke 21:33; "Heaven and earth shall pass away: but My words shall not pass away." As a result Christians, have based on these verses believe that the revelation of Jesus is the final revelation from God. If Jesus was to be the Last, why did Muhammad appear after Him? If the words of Jesus were not to be changed, then why did Muhammad reveal the Qur'an? Are we to side with Jews, Christians or Muslims in their belief? Is the concept of finality of religion real, or, is there perhaps another explanation for these verses found in the Holy Books of the past! Baha'u'llah addresses this issue as follows: `....For this reason, hath the Point of Baya'n [i.e. a title of The Ba'b, the Qa'im, or Mihdi of the House of Muhammad, the Forerunner of Baha'u'llah].... likened the Manifestations of God [i.e. Messengers of God] unto the sun which, though it rise from the "Beginning that hath no beginning" until the "End that knoweth no end," is none the less the same sun. Now, wert thou to say, that this sun is the former sun, thou speakest the truth; and if thou sayest that this sun is the "return" of that sun, thou also speakest the truth. Likewise, from this statement it is made evident that the term "last" is applicable to the "first," and the term "first" applicable to the "last;" inasmuch as both the "first" and the "last" have risen to proclaim the same Faith. Notwithstanding the obviousness of this theme, in the eyes of those that have quaffed the wine of knowledge and certitude, yet how many are those who, through failure to understand its meaning, have allowed the term "Seal of the Prophets" to obscure their understanding,and deprive them of the grace of all His manifold bounties! Hath not Muhammad, Himself, declared: "I am all the Prophets?" Hath He not said...: "I am Adam, Noah, Moses, and Jesus?" Why should Muhammad, that immortal Beauty, Who hath said: "I am the first Adam" be incapable of saying also: "I am the last Adam"? For even as He regarded Himself to be the "First of the Prophets" -That is Adam- in like manner, the "Seal of the Prophets" is also applicable unto that Divine Beauty. It is admittedly obvious that being the "First of the Prophets," He likewise is their "Seal". Iqan, Book of Certitude p. 161-162 The following verse of the Holy Qur'an appears to support this point as well: "Say ye: `We believe in God, and that which hath been sent down to us, and that which hath been sent down to Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the tribes: and that which hath been given to Moses, and to Jesus, and that which was given to the Prophets from their Lord. No difference do we make between any of them." Al'Baghara-2:130 There must be a deeper meaning to the term Khatam'u-Nabieen than its apparent meaning (i.e. the Author of last Revelation from God). Before I start to discuss the various views on the meaning of Khatam'u-Nabieen, I'd like to discuss the various classifications of prophets from the perspective of Islam. The Muslim Scripture classifies the intermediaries between man and God into three groups: 1- Nabi = Prophet: Who is a messenger, Who does not have an independent Book. A very good example of that are the Prophets of Israel like Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel, etc..... They all promulgated the Mosaic Law, without adding any new laws, or abrogating the past laws. 2- Rasool = Apostle: Who is a messenger, who has a Book, thus, He can abrogate the previous laws, but, He comes only to bring the Laws of God for His own tribe or nation. Like Hud and Salih. 3- Peighambar-e-OllolAzm = A universal Apostle, or a major Manifestation of God: Who is a messenger, Who has a Book, (i.e. thus can abrogate the laws of past religions) and His message is not specific to one tribe or one nation, but the whole world. Examples of this, according to the Muslim Scripture are: Jesus, Moses, and Muhammad. Unquestionably, both Shi'ahs and Sunnis believe that Muhammad, Peace be upon Him, was a messenger of the third category. That is to say, He had a Book, and His revelation was not specific to the people of Arabia, as we can clearly see. The question which one might ask is then: Why is His Holiness Muhammad referred to in the Qur'an as the Seal of the Nabieen (prophets), and not the Seal of the OllolAzm Messengers (UNIVERSAL Messengers of God with independent Books)? Clearly, He was more than a Nabi. In fact, He was more than a Rasool too, (since He did not come just for the Arab nation), so, what is the reason behind this specific but peculiar form of reference to a Peighambar-e-OllolAzm? Are there other ways one can understand the term Khatam'u-Nabieen, which does not implicate Muhammad to have been a Nabi? Let us examine the term "Khatam'u-Nabieen" and see what are the possible meanings one can associate with it, moreover, what are the implications of using each meaning. The term "Nabi", means Prophet, as discussed above. So "Nabieen", which is the plural form of "Nabi" means Prophets. But, depending on how the opening term is read "KhatEm" or "KhatAm", the literal meaning of the word can change. The former, "Khatem" means: "One who ends.", while the term "Khatam" means "Ornament". The term "Khatam" is also a name for a ring of seal, which was in use by the Arabs, during Muhammad's lifetime. Many people had in the past, such a ring on their finger, by which they sealed a letter. Therefore, the term Khatam'u-Nabieen, could mean: the Ornament of Prophets, or the Ornament among Prophets; the Seal of the Prophets. And the term Khatem'u-Nabieen means: One who ends Prophets, one who ends Prophethood. How this term has been used and must be used, according to Muslim theologians, will be the subject of the next reply. Part II of VI Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com Tel#508-568-6925
HAKIM%decwrl.dec.com (12/05/89)
Continuation from part IV: Now that the term "Khatam'u-Nabieen" has been discussed in full, let us discuss two of the Islamic Traditions which appear to imply that Islam is an everlasting religion, and the Qur'an is an everlasting Book of Laws. His Holiness Muhammad, is recorded to have said: "There will be no Book after my Book (the Holy Qur'an), and, there will be no religion after my religion (Islam) until the day of resurrection." Moreover, He is recorded to have said in another occasion: "Whatever was made lawful by Me (i.e. Muhammad) shall remain lawful until the day of resurrection, and whatever was made unlawful by Me shall remain unlawful until the day of resurrection." Clearly these two Traditions explicitly discuss the common belief of finality as discussed above. Nevertheless, one must always go beyond the apparent in order to determine the underlying reality. Having this in mind, let us examine these two traditions based on the verses of the Holy Qur'an, and, other traditions from Prophet Muhammad and the Holy Imams, and test the validity of such belief. In my opinion the verses of the Holy Qur'an do not appear to support finality of Islam. The following verses will perhaps address this: "Every people has its set term. And when their time is come, they shall not retard it an hour; and they shall not advance it." [A'raf-7:33] "Neither too soon, nor too late, shall a people reach its appointed time." [Mominun, The Believers-23:43] "To each term its Book. What He pleaseth will God abrogate or confirm: for with Him is the source of Revelation." [Ra'd, Thunder-13:38] Non of the past religions, and nations have been exempted from the Will of God, which has so clearly been established in the verses of the Qur'an, then, one could rightfully ask; Why should Islam be exempted from it? Let us examine these traditions and see what pearl lies hidden under in their shell of the words: In these two traditions His Holiness Muhammad says, that there shall be no other religion after His own, and there shall be no other Book after Qur'an, yet, He maintains a requirement and a condition: until the day of resurrection, implying that at, and after resurrection, there can be other Books and other religions. Naturally one would question: What is meant by the term "Day of Resurrection"? The meaning usually given to the "Day of Resurrection" by the people of the Book (Jews, Christians and Muslims) is a day in which all the dead shall literally rise and leave their sepulchers, become alive in order to be judged by God. Each religion appears to paint somewhat a different picture about the details of this event, and how it will come about. Nevertheless, they all agree that physically dead shall become alive on that day. I will not attempt to recount the beliefs of various people about the Day of Resurrection, however, I would like to say that such belief is based on a very literalistic approach to Scripture, which is against the teachings of the Messengers of God, and the Imams of religion, beside being an absurd thought among mindful believers. Allow me to discuss alternative ways of understanding the meaning of the "Day of Resurrection". His Holiness The Ba'b addresses the meaning of the "Day of Resurrection" in the Persian Baya'n as follows: "The substance of this chapter is this that what was intended by the Day of Resurrection is the Day of the appearance of the Tree of divine Reality, but it is not seen that any one of the followers of Shi'ih Islam hath understood the meaning of the Day of Resurrection; rather they have fanatically imagined a thing which with God hath no reality. In the estimation of God and according to the usage of such as are initiated into the divine mysteries, what is meant by the Day of Resurrection is this, that from the time of the appearance of Him Who is the Tree of divine Reality, at whatever period and under whatever name, until the moment of His disappearance, is the Day of Resurrection. For example, from the inception of the mission of Jesus -may peace be upon Him- till the day of His ascension was the Resurrection of Moses. For during that period the Revelation of God shone forth through the appearance of that divine Reality [i.e. Jesus], Who rewarded by His Word everyone who believed in Moses, [i.e. was a true believer within the Mosaic law], and punished by His Word everyone who did not believe [i.e. was not a true believer -was a believer by name only-]; inasmuch as God's Testimony for that Day was that which He had solemnly affirmed in the Gospel. And from the inception of the Revelation of the Apostle of God -may the blessings of God be upon Him- till the day of His ascension was the Resurrection of Jesus [i.e. Day of Resurrection for the followers of Jesus] -peace be upon Him- wherein the Tree of divine Reality appeared in the person of Muhammad, rewarding by His Word everyone who was a believer in Jesus, and punishing by His Word everyone who was not a believer in Him. And from the moment when the Tree of Baya'n [i.e. The Ba'b is referring to Himself] appeared until it disappeareth is the Resurrection of the Apostle of God, as is divinely foretold in the Qur'an.....The stage of perfection of everything is reached when its resurrection occureth. The perfection of the religion of Islam was consummated at the beginning of this Revelation until its setting, the fruits of the Tree of Islam, whatever they are, will become apparent. The Resurrection of the Baya'n [i.e. the Holy Book revealed by The Ba'b, The Qa'im of the House of the Prophet.] will occur at the time of the appearance of Him Whom God shall make manifest [i.e. The Return of Christ, the Glory of God, Baha'u'llah]. For today the Baya'n is in the stage of seed; at the beginning of the manifestation of Him Whom God shall make manifest its ultimate perfection will become apparent. He [Him Whom God shall make manifest] is made manifest in order to gather the fruits of the trees He [i.e. The Ba'b] hath planted; even as the Revelation of the Qa'im [He Who ariseth] -an allusion to Himself-, a descendant of Muhammad -may the blessings of God rest upon Him- is exactly like unto the Revelation of the Apostle of God Himself [Muhammad]. He appeareth not, save for the purpose of gathering the fruits of Islam from the Qur'anic verses which He [Muhammad] hath sown in the hearts of men. The fruits of Islam cannot be gathered except through allegiance unto Him [the Qa'im], and by believing in Him...yet unjustly have they consigned Him to the Mountain of Maku." The Persian Baya'n II:7 Baha'i Scripture And Baha'u'llah elaborates further on this explanation as follows: "These Prophets and chosen Ones of God are the recipients and revealers of all the unchangeable attributes and names of God. They are the mirrors that truly and faithfully reflect the light of God. Whatsoever is applicable to them is in reality applicable to God, Himself, Who is both the Visible and the Invisible. The knowledge of Him Who is the Origin of of all things (i.e God) and attainment unto Him, are impossible save through knowledge of, and attainment unto, these luminous Beings who proceed from the Sun of Truth. By attaining, therefore, to the presence of these holy Luminaries, the "Presence of God" Himself is attained. From their knowledge, the knowledge of God is revealed, and from the light of their countenance, the splendour of the Face of God is made manifest. Through the manifold attributes of these Essences of Detachment, Who are both the first and the last, the seen and the hidden, it is made evident that He Who is the Sun of Truth is "the First and the Last, the Seen, and the Hidden. [Qur'an 57:3]." Likewise the other lofty names and exalted attributes of God. Therefore, whosoever, and in whatever Dispensation, hath recognized and attained unto the presence of these glorious, these resplendent and most excellent Luminaries, hath verily attained unto the "Presence of God" Himself, and entered the city of eternal and immortal life. Attainment unto such presence is possible only in the Day of Resurrection, which is the Day of the rise of God Himself through His all-embracing Revelation. This is the meaning of the "Day of Resurrection," spoken of in all the scriptures, and announced unto all people. Reflect, can a more precious, a mightier, and more glorious day than this be conceived, so that man should willingly forego its grace, and deprive himself of its bounties, which like unto vernal showers are raining from the heaven of mercy upon all mankind? ...Have they not heard the well-known tradition: "When the Qa'im riseth, that day is the Day of Resurrection?" In like manner, the Imams, those unquenchable lights of divine guidance, have interpreted the verse: "What can such expect but that God should come down to them overshadowed with clouds," [Qur'an 2:210]- a sign which they have unquestionably regarded as one of the features of the Day of Resurrection- as referring to Qa'im and His manifestation. Strive therefore, O my brother, to grasp the meaning of "Resurrection," and cleans thine ears from the idle sayings of these rejected people. Shouldst thou step into the realm of complete detachment, thou wilt readily testify that no day is mightier than this Day, and that no resurrection more awful than this Resurrection can ever be conceived." Baha'u'llah -Iqan p. 142-144 Baha'i Scripture Part V of VI Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com Tel#508-568-6925
hakim%bigq.enet.dec.com@rice.edu (12/05/89)
Continuation from part III: Allamih Majlesi in Bahar'ul-Anvar Vol 13, p.323 mentions one of the discourses of Imam Ali. In that discourse Ali says: "I am the Commander of the faithful. I am the King among the pious..... I am the Khatam'u-Vasieen [which can be either taken as "The Seal of the guardians and successors", or, as "The Ornament of the Guardians and successors".] and the heir of the prophets and the representative of the God of the worlds." This tradition of Imam Ali is a very interesting. One must be fair in one's judgment. If we are to take, in this tradition, the term "Khatam" as "the Seal", "the ender", "one who completes", then one is obliged to accept that Ali was "the seal of the guardians, and successors", after Muhammad, Who is the Seal of the prophets. Yet, Shi'ahs believe that after Muhammad there was supposed to be twelve Imams, only the first of Whom was Ali. So, assuming that the term Khatam in Khatam'u-Vasieen must have a similar meaning to the term Khatam in Khatam'u- Nabieen, then one is to question why were there more Imams after Ali. How are we to reconcile the existence of the other Imams, Who came after Ali, based on this interpretation? Let this be food for thought for the possessors of pure heart and open mind. Let us now examine the meaning of the term Khatam'u-Nabieen from the perspective of Sunni scholars and theologians, so that the seekers of truth obtain a wider spectrum of views for their judgment: Allamih Ahmad Hamedi-al-Mohammad, a well-known Sunni Theologian discusses the term Khatam'u-Nabieen in his book, Tebyaan-va-Borhan, based on a commentary of Fat'hol-Ghadeer by Hafiz Mohhades-i-Shokani who says: "All the Ghoraba use KhatEm, while Athim use KhatAm. KhatEm in Khatem'u-Nabeein means the Ender of Prophets, or the Seal of Prophets, while, KhatAm in Khatam' u-Nabeein means ring and ornament. In essence Muhammad, the Messenger of God, was the Ring or Ornament of (i.e. among) the Prophets, due to His exalted station compared to other Prophets." The same book quotes from Dorr'ul-Mansoor of Allamih Jallal'u-Din Soivotti, who quotes Ayeshih, the wife of Muhammad, who said: "Say KhatAm-u-Nabeein (i.e. The Ring or Ornament of the Prophets), and never say no prophets shall come after Him (i.e. Muhammad)". One can find the same references in the commentary of Kashaaf, by Zamakhshari, who says: "Muhammad, the Messenger of God, was called Khatam'u-Nabieen, since, He did not have any male offsprings to inherit prophethood from Him." He goes on and presents a Hadith from Prophet Muhammad who says about His deceased son Abraham (from Marieh, the Egyptian wife of Muhammad): "If my son Abraham was alive, he would have been a Nabi (i.e. He would have become a Nabi after Me.)". However, all of Muhammad's male offsprings die in early childhood, thus, the verse of the Qur'an: "Muhammad is not the father of any man among you...." comes into fulfillment, and Muhammad become Khatam'u-Nabieen, according to the same verse." Abo'l-Bagha, another trusted Sunni source discusses this issue in his book, "Mofeed", from the same angle, which I will not quote here in order to prevent excessive repetition of the same idea. It is apparent from what has been mentioned at length, that both Shi'ah and Sunni sources agree that: 1- There is a more profound meaning associated with the title Khatam'u-Nabieen; 2- Finality of Muhammad's revelation is not implied by this term, mentioned in the Qur'an, the Confederates: 39. Let me close this note with the view of Abol-Fadail-i Golpayegani, a prominent Baha'i scholar, from a Muslim background, who, in his book Fara'id addresses the question of Khatam'u-Nabieen as follows: "No wonder if the learned of Islam too, argue against the renewal of revelation from God [i.e. like their predecessors, Jews and Christians, who are firmly convinced that their respective religions are the final revelation from God.], based on such references as: Khatam'u-Nabeein, or such traditions as: "There shall be no prophet after me....", and by doing so become subjected to a test of faith; and join their predecessors [i.e. Jews and Christians]. Not realizing that the purpose of Muhammad in using the term Khatam'u-Nabeein was to suggest the progress of the Islamic nation, and unveil the ascendancy of the station of the Imams in comparison to the prophets of Israel. It is clear to those who are familiar with the Scriptures of the past, who are aware of the events which are associated with the historical events of the nations of antiquity that the prophets of Israel, such as Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel, Ezekiel, Zechariah, etc... one and all prophesied about the future events according to dreams and visions. And they interpreted their vision or dream as a revelation from God. As a result, the book of these prophets became known as the vision of Isaiah, vision of Daniel, vision of Jeremiah, and vision of Ezekiel. By the same token, if we are to examine this issue from a Christian perspective, the Revelation of St. John is in essence the Dream of John. As a result the term Nabi (i.e. prophet) was given to the ones who prophesied based on visions, or dreams. This usage was solidified during the Jewish and Christians dispensations. However, after the appearance of Prophet Muhammad (Khatam'ul-Anbia), the ender of the prophetic cycle, the era of revelation from God "through the medium of dreams and visions" was ended and a new era of "revelation through direct inspiration" was started. Thus, the fulfillment of the tradition; "There will be no prophets after me..." came about." Fara'id, p. 311 Parts of sections III & IV have either been cited or paraphrased, after my own inadequate English translation, from "Ghamoos-i-Iqan" (The Encyclopedia to the Book of Certitude), by A. Eshragh-Khavari, Baha'i Publishing Trust of Iran. Finality of Islam and the Qur'an, will be discussed in the next reply. Part IV of VI Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com Tel#508-568-6925
araja@m2.csc.ti.com (Ali Raja) (12/07/89)
In article <3388@brazos.Rice.edu> hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com writes: >One is prone to slip into the pitfall of literalism, when one's faith becomes >founded on imitation and one's religion becomes an inherited necessity in one's >life, rather than an independently investigated reality. Jalalu'ddin-iRumi' >[rest deleted] This seem to be a cogent argument at first glance. Let me try to restate and see what you mean. What you seem to be arguing is that a statement can be interpreted in various contexts, and there are many different contexts to intepret a statement in. This seem fine to me; consider that extreme literalism is just another context with which to attempt analysis. >The highly metaphorical nature of the Scripture often becomes a very challenging >issue for the believers to determine the truest meaning behind every verse of >the Qur'an. There is no indication that the Scripture is so highly metaphorical that it can not be interpreted by a human being with ordinary human intelligence. >Remember the well known Tradition, where His Honor Muhammad says: >"We say one word, and by it We mean seventy and two things." There are manifold >meaning associated with each verse of the Qur'an. And an ocean of wisdom is >laid hidden within each one of those meanings I think that you are falling into the same trap that you warned us about; of literalist interpretations. When he meant that phrase, he did not obviously intend it to be interpreted to mean that way for EACH and EVERY phrase that he said. I am willing to warrant that many of the verses in the Quran are obvious.. To misquote somewhat "This is a plain Scripture". Your statements here seem to be little other than circumstantial evidence to prove your main points. >I'd like to emphasize that I am not, God forbid, saying this in a sarcastic way. >My sole purpose is to point out to a natural pitfall which forms with time in >any religion. The ways to deal with the "natural pitfall" is make absolutely sure that the original text of the Scriptures does not change, neither does the meaning of the words that the Scripture is written in change. In this fashion the Scriptures can interpreted by each and every generation of scholars to the benefit of the society. >After the denials and denunciations which they uttered, (i.e. referring to Jews >and Christians), they protested saying: "No independent Prophet, according to >our Scriptures, should arise after Moses and Jesus to abolish the Law of the >Divine Revelation. Nay, he that is to be made manifest (i.e. the Promised One) >must needs fulfill the Law." Thereupon this verse, indicative of all the divine >themes, and testifying to the truth that the flow of the grace of the >All-Merciful can never cease, was revealed (i.e. by Muhammad): "And Joseph came >to you aforetime with clear tokens, but ye ceased not to doubt of the message >with which He came to you, until, when He died, ye said, `God will by no means >rise up a Messenger after Him.' Thus God misleadeth him who is the transgressor >the doubter." [Qur'an 40-34] Therefore, understand from this verse and know of >a certainty that the people in every age, clinging to a verse of the Book, have >uttered such vain and absurd sayings, contending that no Prophet should again >be made manifest to the world. Even as the Christian divines who, holding fast >to the verses of the Gospel...have sought to explain that the law of the Gospel >shall at no time be annulled, and that no independent Prophet shall again be >made manifest, unless He confirmeth the Law of the Gospel. Most of the people >have become afflicted with the same spiritual disease. In other words, anyone who does not accept that there has to be a successor to Mohammed has become afflicted to with a spiritual disease? :-). You are trying to draw this parallel - the Prophets are similar to each other, eg. Mohammed and Joseph are similar to each other. Now, if someone says that there is no successor to the Prophet, then he is lying. A Muslim listener will accept this fact. But, then you try to draw an analogy between people who do not accept Mohammad's successors and people who do not accept Joseph's successors. Your analogy falls apart here. There is no reason to make this extrapolation. >Even as thou witness how the people of the Qur'an, like unto the people of the >old, have allowed the word "Seal of the Prophets" to veil their eyes. And yet, >they themselves testify to this verse: "None knoweth the interpretation thereof >but God and they that are well-grounded in knowledge." [Qur'an 3:7]' True enough. But, with all due respect, there is no indication that people who accept Bahai'ullah are well-grounded in knowledge and those who do not accept him are not. Neither is the converse true. As such, I fail to see the relevance of your above posting.
araja@m2.csc.ti.com (Ali Raja) (12/07/89)
>This has been interpreted by many among Muslims to mean that Revelation from >God ended with Muhammad's Revelation, and the door of God's mercy towards >mankind was closed for ever. Not so. Your analogy was incorrect. The Succession of Prophethood can be viewed as a lesson given to Mankind. With Mohammad, the lesson has been completed. The statement that Muhammad is the Mercy of God towards mankind shows that the messge that he brought will be considered completely valid for the rest of eternity, not the opposite, as you would aver. >Both Jesus and Muhammad broke the Sabbath. Does this mean that they were wrong? >Or, God forbid, they were false prophets? They knew which laws to follow, since they were lawgivers in their own right. Plain and simple. [I have skipped over many of your following quotations from Scripture] >"Say ye: `We believe in God, and that which hath been sent down to us, and that > which hath been sent down to Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the > tribes: and that which hath been given to Moses, and to Jesus, and that which > was given to the Prophets from their Lord. No difference do we make between > any of them." Al'Baghara-2:130 This does not mean that it is necessary for the Muslim to accept Baha'ullah, nor is it necessary for the Muslim to accept that the saying of Jesus in the Bible are literal truth. Given this, there is no need to reconcile the statements of "lastness" made by Jesus. >There must be a deeper meaning to the term Khatam'u-Nabieen than its apparent >meaning (i.e. the Author of last Revelation from God). Even this does not necessarily follow. Jesus did not claim that he was the "Katam'u-Nabieen". He probably used a phrase in Aramaic that I do not know. If I was to accept that the statement that you quoted was correct, it would not logically imply that the lack of literalist interpretation has to be extended in the case of Muhammed. [rest deleted]
araja@m2.csc.ti.com (Ali Raja) (12/07/89)
>Let us now examine the opinions of various Muslim theologians, from both Shi'ah >and Sunni backgrounds, on the meaning of the term Khatam'u-Nabieen. The term "Katam'u-Nabieen" means the "Khatm" of the "Nabieen". "Khatm" is "end" and "Nabieen" is "prophets". As I said in my previous article, you are falling into the same trap that you warned us about - you took the warning you quoted in <3388@brazos.Rice.edu>: #Remember the well known Tradition, where His Honor Muhammad says: #"We say one word, and by it We mean seventy and two things." This warning, you have taken TOO literally, attempting to find hidden meanings in eve the most straightforward terms. A certain word or phrase does not become divine just because a Prophet or the God uttered it - it is still that collections of sounds and meanings, just as comprehensible to human beings. >[Clearly, the concept of no Nabi, or prophet, appearing after Muhammad must >have been associated with His immediate successorship, and had nothing to do >with coming of future Messengers from God. Otherwise, why would Muhammad want >to discuss Omar's -the second Khalif's- name in this tradition]. This comes clear out of the blue. I can see absolutely no way to derive this conclusion from what you have stated. Aside from your insisting on capitalizing the "H" in "Him", which I personally dislike, you yourself cite the tradition, which I will take at face value: >"No prophet shall appear after Me, but Omar-ibn-Khattab." If one takes that Bahia'ullah (sp?) is a Prophet as a premise then your above argument is valid. But one cannot prove that he is a Prophet by using your above argument. A implies B does not, and never has meant that B implies A. Pure and simple. >Many of the Shi'ah commentators believe in a literal meaning of the term Khatam- >u-Nabieen (Seal of the Prophets, after Whom no other Messengers of God shall >come), For the rather good reason that there is no support to NOT take it literally. Usually, the Prophet MEANT what he SAID. >"All the Messengers of God who appeared prior to Muhammad, were succeeded by a >Nabi (i.e. a prophet). Adam was a Rasool (Messenger of God), and His successor >was Shais the Nabi (Seth the prophet). Noah was a Messenger of God and His >successor was Saam the Nabi (Shem the prophet). Abraham, Moses, Jesus and David >(peace be upon Them!), were also God's Messengers, Whose successors were Isaac, >Jashua, Simon (St. Peter) and Solomon Who were all prophets. However, the >successors of Muhammad, Rasool-Allah (the Messenger of God), were not called >Nabis (prophets). They were referred to as Imams. Therefore, Ali was not a >Nabi, Hasan was not a Nabi, Hossein was not a Nabi, etc...., since, with the >Manifestation of Muhammad, the usage of the term Nabi was abandoned (i.e. He >was Khatam-u-Nabieen), and ended. As Muhammad was greater than the previous >Messengers, so were His appointed successors (i.e. Imams) were greater than >Nabis (prophets)." Offhand, I would say that he was arguing this point so as to elevate the status of Ali. I notice that he was a Shi'ah scholar/theologian. Such an exercise in verbiage is not far from the traditions of some sects amongst the Shia. >This commentary of Sheikh Sadoogh appears to clearly reason out the inner >significance of traditions such as: "Seal of the prophets", "There will be no >prophets after me....". This commentary of Sheikh Sadoogh appears to clearly be intended to prove that Ali was at least as great as many of the Prophets before him and does not carry any especial weight. #"...Anyone who disagrees with me, has disagreed with God, and in arrogance has # surpassed all others. No prophet has achieved the station of prophethood except # through the Khatam of Nabovvat (i.e. literally meaning prophethood) he received # from Muhammad. And Khatam is a ring. Only after receiving the Khatam (ring) of # Nabovvat, one can be called a prophet. This is why Muhammad has been called # Khatam'u-Nabieen in the Qur'an....." Then He says: "Muhammad is the Seyyed # (master) of the Nabieen (prophets), and I am the Seyyed and master of the # Vaseein (guardians and successors). >Clearly Ali's explanation of Khatam'u-Nabeein is drastically different than the >meaning the literalist Muslims have given to it. There does not appear to be >any implications whatsoever about cessation of revelation after His Holiness >Muhammad. Nowhere in the Hadith that you have cited does Ali claim that either he, or any of HIS successors will ever recieve a revelation. Thus, your "clearly" seems to me to be about as clear as jar of fresh water from the Boston harbour. The only possible weight that might have been given to your argument is throught the statement of Sheikh Sadoogh; however, to use it, you will have to assert that someone supposedly "greater" than a Prophet would also receive revelation. And you would also have to give a logical reason to support Sheikh Sadoogh's assertions in the first place.
araja@m2.csc.ti.com (Ali Raja) (12/07/89)
>In his commentary on Manhaj-ul-Sadegheen, Mulla Fatth-i- Kashani, offers a >tradition attributed to Muhammad, where He says: >"I am Muhammad, and I am Ahmad and I am that resurrector, through Whom God > shall resurrect His people...." Is this to be found in Bukhari or Muslim? No matter. I will accept it as valid for this conversation. >This quote appear to suggest that the appearance of Muhammad corresponded to >the Day of Resurrection for "His people", "God's people", or "the people of the >Book", (Christians and Jews). Not necessarily so - it could also mean that it refers to the Day of Judgement, when each people will be resurrected to follow their own Prophet. >That is to say, according to Imam Sadigh the Day of the appearance of the Qa'im >corresponds with the Day of Resurrection for the followers of Islam. First, you have to prove that the Muslims will have a Day of Resurrection in the fashion that you state. >I hope that the two quotations given above validate the absurdity of the popular >belief about the Day of Resurrection. I do not see why you would want an absurdity to be validated. To be quite honest, I have no idea how you proved the above; it just seems like a statement out of thin air, without anything to support it. >Moreover, I hope that it has become >apparent that both Islam, and the Qur'an are to remain intact UNTIL the Day of the appearance of the Promised Qa'im of the House of Muhammad. This is indeed apparent. The rest of what is apparent is that they are to remain intact AFTER the Day of the appearance of the "Promised Qa'im" as well - I have also missed where you said that the Qa'im was promised. >Then apparently >it is up to the Qa'im to determine whether Muslims are to follow the Qur'an, or >the Book He is going to reveal. No argument. You are quite welcome to your belief here. But it is just that - a belief. I have not seen any proof at all. >[proof of the Qa'im appearing just as he was promised deleted] You have not proved that the Qa'im coming was predicted, in the first place. >There are other traditions from the Imams of the Faith, which explicitly refers >to the Qa'im or Mihdi, as a law-giver, and an author of a new religion. There is no indication that the Mihdi will be an author of a new religion. >Perhaps >the following few quotations will shed some light on this issue, which has been >the cause of much confusion among the majority of Muslims throughout the past >millennium. I am confused because I disagree with you and ask for proof? This does not make sense. >"In our Qa'im there shall be four signs from four Prophets. Moses, Jesus, Joseph > and Muhammad. The sign from Moses, is fear and expectation; from Jesus, that > which was spoken of Him; from Joseph, imprisonment and dissimulation; from > Muhammad, the Revelation of a Book similar to the Qur'an." >According to a Tradition recorded in the volume 13 of Bahar'ul-Anvar of >Majlesi: The tradition that you give up - is it in Bukhari or Muslim or any of the known and accepted Hadith? OR are you trying to pull a Martillo? >Moreover, Imam Sadiq is recorded to have said: Is this a Sunna Hadith? >1- The term Khatam'u-Nabieen has several inner meanings, non of which suggest > cessation of Revelation from God Not proved at all. >2- Islam is not everlasting, but it has a special term and time; Not provable from the sources you cite. >3- Islam and the Qur'an are valid until the Day of Resurrection; The day of Resurrection is not necessarily the one you imply it to be. >4- The day of resurrection is the time of the appearance of the Qa'im or the > 12th Imam; Not proved at all. >5- The day of resurrection is established to happen in 1000 years. The sources you cited are not necessarily acceptable or complete. >6- Therefore the day of the appearance of the Qa'im is within 1000 years from > some point in the Islamic dispensation (i.e. 260 A.H. year of the passing of > the 11th Imam.) Possibly. If you want to choose an arbitrary event and designate it predicted after the fact. >7- The Qa'im will have His own religion. >8- The Qa'im will have His own Book. Ditto as above. >9- The Qa'im of the House of Muhammad is the Promised One of the Jews,and > Christians as well. No proof exists that Mohammed will have a Qa'im. >I beg the Lord to illumine our hearts, and inspire our minds to be >fair in our judgments. I would like to close this discussion by the following >verse of the Holy Qur'an: Fair enough. But I would be much happier if you would just admit that you are giving us nothing but your opinions and your own faith, and not facts that can be derived from acceptable Muslim sources.
hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com (12/15/89)
Continuation from part I: Furthermore, you have disagreed with my statement: >>I'd like to emphasize that I am not, God forbid, saying this in a sarcastic way. >>My sole purpose is to point out to a natural pitfall which forms with time in >>any religion. And have suggested; >The ways to deal with the "natural pitfall" is make absolutely sure that >the original text of the Scriptures does not change, neither does the >meaning of the words that the Scripture is written in change. In this >fashion the Scriptures can interpreted by each and every generation >of scholars to the benefit of the society. Such optimism is, from a spiritual perspective very dangerous. Since it does not allow room for misinterpretation of an uncorrupted text to satisfy one's selfish goals and desires. Since, misinterpretation of Scripture is not a matter of linguistics, cultural evolution or the corruption of the physical Text alone. Misinterpretation of Scripture is rather mainly a question of human nature. Please allow me to quote Ali-ibn Abu Talib in regards to your optimistic suggestion, given above and see if this approach is a safe one for a Muslim. Please understand that my goal in quoting this saying is not sarcasm, but to point out to a flaw in your approach. His Excellency Ali says: "Verily, a time will come upon you [i.e. Muslims] wherein nothing will be more concealed than the truth, nothing more manifest than falsehood, and nothing more than lies about God and His Apostle [i.e. Muhammad]. The people of that time will possess no commodity more difficult to sell than the Book when it is correctly recited, or one more in demand when its passages are misinterpreted. There will be throughout all lands nothing more detested than good deeds, or more renowned than evil ones. The reciters of the Qur'an will have cast it away, and those who memorize it will have deliberately erased it from their minds. The book and its disciples will, on that day, be ostracized and outcast, two friends together on the road, to whom no one will offer shelter. The Book and its disciples will be, in that age, among the people and yet neither among them nor with them. For error is incompatible with guidance. Even though the Book and its disciples might come together, the people would agree to keep separate [i.e. Muslims will be disunited among themselves.]. They would disperse from the community -as if they were the leaders of the Qur'an rather than it being their leader. Nothing will remain of it [i.e. The Qur'an] among them save the name; they will know nothing of it save its calligraphy and script. Before, they had not made an example of the righteous by maiming them, or called their sincerity towards God a lie, or punished good deeds with the penalties for crimes. They who preceded you perished because they went on hoping for too long and their allotted terms expired. Then the Promised One [i.e. Mihdi or the Lord of the Age or the Qa'im] descended, by whom excuses are rejected and upon whom repentance has no effect, and with whom are the calamity and the affliction." Imam Ali "Nahj-ul-Balagha" [The Path of Eloquence] printed by Hajj Sayyed Ali-Nagi Faydu'l-Islami, 6 vols, Tehran, Iran, Oftab press 1326 A.H. vol 3:438 English trans. cit. Miracles and Metaphors Abu'l-Fadl-i Golpayegani, p. 135 Kalimat Press USA This saying of Ali is based on a well-known Tradition of Prophet Muhammad, where He says: "A time will come upon my community when nothing will remain of Islam among them save the name, or of the Qur'an save its script. They will call others to faith but will be the most remote of peoples from it. Their mosques will be filled to capacity, but desolate of any guidance. The jurisprudents of that time will be the most wicked beneath the sky; they will be the cause of the tribulations and these will rebound them." ibid. Now, I will not attempt to prove whether this time has come or not. Let the pure in heart among Muslims to judge for themselves, but, for the sake of argument let us say that such time must eventually come about. You suggest that if we keep the words of the Scripture and their meanings intact, ">In this fashion the Scriptures can interpreted by each and every generation of scholars to the benefit of the society." Yet, it is clear that the saying of the Prophet of God must come to pass. What is the point of reconciliation between what you say and what Prophet Muhammad and Imam Ali have suggested? Why should such a plain Scripture be treated by the Muslims in such a way? >>After the denials and denunciations which they uttered, (i.e. referring to Jews >>and Christians), they protested saying: "No independent Prophet, according to >>our Scriptures, should arise after Moses and Jesus to abolish the Law of the >>Divine Revelation. Nay, he that is to be made manifest (i.e. the Promised One) >>must needs fulfill the Law." Thereupon this verse, indicative of all the divine >>themes, and testifying to the truth that the flow of the grace of the >>All-Merciful can never cease, was revealed (i.e. by Muhammad): "And Joseph came >>to you aforetime with clear tokens, but ye ceased not to doubt of the message >>with which He came to you, until, when He died, ye said, `God will by no means >>rise up a Messenger after Him.' Thus God misleadeth him who is the transgressor >>the doubter." [Qur'an 40-34] Therefore, understand from this verse and know of >>a certainty that the people in every age, clinging to a verse of the Book, have >>uttered such vain and absurd sayings, contending that no Prophet should again >>be made manifest to the world. Even as the Christian divines who, holding fast >>to the verses of the Gospel...have sought to explain that the law of the Gospel >>shall at no time be annulled, and that no independent Prophet shall again be >>made manifest, unless He confirmeth the Law of the Gospel. Most of the people >>have become afflicted with the same spiritual disease. >In other words, anyone who does not accept that there has to be a >successor to Mohammed has become afflicted to with a spiritual >disease? :-). Yes. This is not my saying. This is the Word of God spoken for this age through Baha'u'llah's revelation. >You are trying to draw this parallel - the Prophets are similar to each >other, eg. Mohammed and Joseph are similar to each other. Now, if >someone says that there is no successor to the Prophet, then he is >lying. A Muslim listener will accept this fact. But, then you try >to draw an analogy between people who do not accept Mohammad's successors >and people who do not accept Joseph's successors. Your analogy falls >apart here. There is no reason to make this extrapolation. I am not sure if I follow your reasoning here. I respectfully request that you reread the quotation I have presented. A close look at the Qur'an clearly shows that Prophet Muhammad has in many occasions used the same parallels in comparing the previous revelation to that of His own, and the behavior of the past generations to the behavior of His contemporaries. >>Even as thou witness how the people of the Qur'an, like unto the people of the >>old, have allowed the word "Seal of the Prophets" to veil their eyes. And yet, >>they themselves testify to this verse: "None knoweth the interpretation thereof >>but God and they that are well-grounded in knowledge." [Qur'an 3:7]' >True enough. But, with all due respect, there is no indication >that people who accept Bahai'ullah are well-grounded in knowledge and >those who do not accept him are not. Neither is the converse true. >As such, I fail to see the relevance of your above posting. I am not sure if you have understood the underlying purpose of this quote, or the verse of the Qur'an used in it. The Holy verse: "None knoweth the interpretation thereof but God and they that are well-grounded in knowledge." [Qur'an 3:7]; in my opinion speaks of the mentality of a believer who think that he/she knows every thing that there is to know about the Qur'an. This verse reminds the followers that there are always others who are more knowledgeable than him/her. Moreover, the verse admonishes the arrogant among the believers that ultimately none but God is fully aware of the fullest meaning of every verse of the Qur'an. To recapitulate; this verse reminds the believer to always remain humble, and meet other views with an open mind. I hope this has clarified some of the misunderstandings. My goal in posting these articles has been to simply answer a sincere question which was being repeatedly asked by several Muslim friends through private communication. My goal is neither to prove you wrong, nor to shake your faith, by evangelizing mine. As a result, I will not attempt to reply to the point of view you have presented in your other replies to this topic. I respect your opinion presented there, and believe that you are entitled to your view as much as I am to mine. Part II of II P.S. I'd like to thank Mr. Camm Maguire, for his critical inputs and helpful suggestions in composing this reply. Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com
hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com (12/15/89)
Ali Raja has offered an opposite point of view to my original posting: >>One is prone to slip into the pitfall of literalism, when one's faith becomes >>founded on imitation and one's religion becomes an inherited necessity in one's >>life, rather than an independently investigated reality. Jalalu'ddin-iRumi' >>[rest deleted] and said in his reply: >This seem to be a cogent argument at first glance. Let me try to >restate and see what you mean. What you seem to be arguing is that >a statement can be interpreted in various contexts, and there are >many different contexts to intepret a statement in. This seem fine >to me; Indeed I have suggested in my article that a statement can be interpreted in different contexts. Yet, I am not sure if you have fully understood the point I am trying to make here, since your statement given above does not address the the point raised in my argument. What I have said here is that there are people who are born into a given religion, and die within that given religion, without ever understanding what they have believed in, and why they believe in it [people with blind faith]. This inherited beliefs define a narrow window through which the faithful followers will look at the world. There are also the literalists, who see the truth in the outward appearance of what they read. Literalism is another human approach to religion which is a subset of blind faith, and it too offers a narrow outlook to the person. To both groups, there is only one way to understand the Scripture, outside of which nothing else can exist. >consider that extreme literalism is just another context >with which to attempt analysis. I am not discrediting literalism as a POSSIBLE approach, I am rejecting literalism as the ONLY approach. To a person whose approach to religion is independent investigation of truth, this is an obligation to also consider the literal value of the Scripture. I am not sure if the literalists are going to give other interpretations a chance. >>The highly metaphorical nature of the Scripture often becomes a very challenging >>issue for the believers to determine the truest meaning behind every verse of >>the Qur'an. >There is no indication that the Scripture is so highly metaphorical that >it can not be interpreted by a human being with ordinary human > intelligence. I am by no means suggesting that Scripture can not be interpreted by human beings of ordinary intelligence. The point I am trying to make is that, if the Scripture is capable of being interpreted, then it is metaphorical. Let us say that the Scripture is indeed not metaphorical. If this the case, one might ask, why is it then that there are so many schools of thought within a given religion? If Scripture is such a plain truth, then what I understand of a given verse of the Scripture, you must confirm, and what you see as truth, I must submit to. Yet, we all differ in our opinions and understandings. In fact you differ with another Muslim, and both of you differ with the third coreligionist. My friend, every cause can be studied through its effects. Considering the existence of the various schools of thought as an effect, then one can assign the metaphorical nature of the Scripture, as a possible cause for such degree of diversity in religion. Please allow me to share with you two quote from the Bible about the nature of the Scripture. Haply this can support the idea under discussion: "All this Jesus said to the crowds in parables; indeed he said nothing to them without parables." Matt 13 "I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter what has been hidden since the foundation of the world." Ps. 78:2 The next question which might be raised for the seeker is that why should the Word of God be presented to mankind in a language of metaphors and parables? Perhaps the following explanation will clarify the issue for you: "...human knowledge is of two kinds. One is the knowledge of things perceptible to the senses-that is to say, things which the eye, or ear, or smell, or taste or touch can perceive, which are called objective or sensible. So the sun, because it can be seen... and in the same way sounds are sensible because the ear hear them; perfumes are sensible because they can be inhaled and the sense of smell perceives them,... The other kind of human knowledge is intellectual that is to say, it is the reality of the intellect; it has no outward form and no place and is not perceptible to the senses... So love is a mental reality and not sensible; for this reality the ear does not hear, the eye does not see, the smell does not perceive the taste does not discern, the touch does not feel... In explaining these intellectual realities, one is obliged to express them by sensible figures because in exterior existence there is nothing that is not material... For example, grief and happiness are intellectual things; when you wish to express those spiritual qualities you say:" My heart is oppressed; my heart is dilated, 'though the heart of man is neither oppressed nor dilated... Another example: you say, 'such an individual made great progress,' though he is remaining in the same place; or again, "such a one's position was exalted,' although, like everyone else, he walks upon the earth. This exaltation and this progress are spiritual states and intellectual realities,... So the symbol of knowledge is light, and of ignorance, darkness; but reflect, is knowledge sensible light, or ignorance sensible darkness? No, they are merely symbols... Then it is evident that the dove which ascended upon Christ was not a material dove, but it was a spiritual state, which, that it might be comprehensible, was expressed by a sensible figure. Thus in the Old Testament it is said that God appeared as a pillar of fire: this does not signify the material form; it is an intellectual reality which is expressed by a sensible image." Abdu'l-Baha', Some Answered Questions Understanding and agreement on the true meaning of the Scripture can only come about through a humble and prayerful attitude displayed by all believers. Yet, selfish interests could often cloud the believers' vision, and as a result disagreement, hatred and division come about. >>Remember the well known Tradition, where His Honor Muhammad says: >>"We say one word, and by it We mean seventy and two things." There are manifold >>meaning associated with each verse of the Qur'an. And an ocean of wisdom is >>laid hidden within each one of those meanings >I think that you are falling into the same trap that you warned us >about; of literalist interpretations. When he meant that phrase, he >did not obviously intend it to be interpreted to mean that way for EACH >and EVERY phrase that he said. I am willing to warrant that many of >the verses in the Quran are obvious.. To misquote somewhat "This is a >plain Scripture". Yes indeed. The Book testifies to this truth: "A Book whose verses (signs) are made plain-An Arabic Qur'an, for men of knowledge." [The Made Plain: 2]. Yet, one cannot discredit the warning: "It is thus that God hath sealed up the hearts of those who are devoid of knowledge." [Houd:59] A close examination of the Holy Qur'an suggests that it is composed of Laws of God, warnings and prophecies, and mostly stories of the past events (through which Prophet Muhammad proves the truth of His own revelation, and admonishes His followers of not following the path of error as the people before them did. The laws are clearly very straightforward (I will not discuss the disagreement among different sects of Islam in regards to the application of these laws, regardless of these laws being very plain.). This will leave us with more than three quarter of the book which is either story, prophecy or warning, the language of which is nothing but parables and metaphors: "And now have we set before men in this Qur'an, every kind of parable..." [Houd:58], and; "Many will He (i.e. God) mislead by such parables (i.e. metaphors) and many guide: but none will He mislead thereby except the wicked..." [2:24] Be fair my friend! Would you say that this major part of the Book is plain? Would you say that it is plain enough for those about whom the Book says: "Hearts have they with which they understand not, and eyes have they with which they see not!" [Qur'an 7:178] >Your statements here seem to be little other than >circumstantial evidence to prove your main points. I respect your point of view. Part I of II Regards, Kamran Hakim hakim@bigq.dec.com
araja@m2.csc.ti.com (12/15/89)
>Indeed I have suggested in my article that a statement can be interpreted in >different contexts. Yet, I am not sure if you have fully understood the point I >am trying to make here, since your statement given above does not address the >the point raised in my argument. What I meant to say was that your long lecture about different types of interpretations etc. was not very pertinent. All you needed to do was to state it very simply and shortly, and not in a long-winded fashion. As such, the arguments that you give seemed to me to be only intended to put the reader in the frame of mind to accept YOUR particular inter- pretations as being the only correct ones. >What I have said here is that there are people >who are born into a given religion, and die within that given religion, without >ever understanding what they have believed in, and why they believe in it >[people with blind faith]. Is your article a discussion on religious beliefs, or were you intending to write one on the sociology of religion? I agree that what you have said above is true. But it only becomes pertinent if you intend to imply that the readers are such a people. Do you make such an assertion? Please let me know. >This inherited beliefs define a narrow window >through which the faithful followers will look at the world. Wrong thing to say. What you mean is that "... these particular faithful ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ followers...", not just all faithful followers. I consider myself to be a faithful follower, yet I've studied many other religions extensively. When I was an undergraduate in college, I was a religious studies major for a while. Your remark is not applicable to almost any learned Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Jew, whatever... >There are also the >literalists, who see the truth in the outward appearance of what they read. >Literalism is another human approach to religion which is a subset of blind >faith, and it too offers a narrow outlook to the person. To both groups, there >is only one way to understand the Scripture, outside of which nothing else can >exist. And in many cases literalism can be the correct approach. >I am not discrediting literalism as a POSSIBLE approach, I am rejecting >literalism as the ONLY approach. To a person whose approach to religion is >independent investigation of truth, this is an obligation to also consider the >literal value of the Scripture. I am not sure if the literalists are going to >give other interpretations a chance. Is there really such a thing as an absolute literalist? When I studied the Scriptures, I tried to analyze both their literal and allegorical meanings. I doubt that there is any one person who is willing to be so narrow-minded as to take just a literalist's approach. In the cases that you cited, however, the literalist's approach seemed to be the most reasonable one to take. It might be appropriate for me to suggest that you take Occam's razor into account in these matters. >I am by no means suggesting that Scripture can not be interpreted by human >beings of ordinary intelligence. The point I am trying to make is that, if >the Scripture is capable of being interpreted, then it is metaphorical. I disagree. Let us consider your arguments: >Let us say that the Scripture is indeed not metaphorical. If this the case, one >might ask, why is it then that there are so many schools of thought within a >given religion? Because people insist on treating it as metaphorical, for one. People such as yourself. >If Scripture is such a plain truth, then what I understand of >a given verse of the Scripture, you must confirm, and what you see as truth, I >must submit to. Yet, we all differ in our opinions and understandings. In fact >you differ with another Muslim, and both of you differ with the third >coreligionist. :-). I do not differ on them on matters that I and they choose to define as major matters. This is why we agree that we three are all Muslims, despite the fact that we disagree on minor matters. >My friend, every cause can be studied through its effects. >Considering the existence of the various schools of thought as an effect, then >one can assign the metaphorical nature of the Scripture, as a possible cause >for such degree of diversity in religion. Then let us invent a scale which calibrates these differences. For all these schools, the differences occur only in the minor matters. In major matters, for example, the finality of the Prophethood, the major schools do NOT differ. Thus, even by your own argument, the allegedly metaphorical nature of scripture does not imply that Mohammed was not the last message. >Please allow me to share with you two quote from the Bible about the nature of >the Scripture. Haply this can support the idea under discussion: > >"All this Jesus said to the crowds in parables; indeed he said nothing to them > without parables." Matt 13 > >"I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter what has been hidden since the > foundation of the world." Ps. 78:2 > >The next question which might be raised for the seeker is that why should the >Word of God be presented to mankind in a language of metaphors and parables? Quite simply, the above is metaphorical in nature as well. So it is only true in certain circumstances. So much for that objection... >Perhaps the following explanation will clarify the issue for you: No need. I do not consider myself to be confused. I do not think I need clarification. >.................Thus in the Old Testament it is said that God >appeared as a pillar of fire: this does not signify the material form; it is an >intellectual reality which is expressed by a sensible image." An assertion without support. Also not very relevant. >Understanding and agreement on the true meaning of the Scripture can only come >about through a humble and prayerful attitude displayed by all believers. Yet, >selfish interests could often cloud the believers' vision, and as a result >disagreement, hatred and division come about. True enough. But not very relevant. Unless you wish me to adopt a humble attitude and an "open" mind so that you can fill it with your own opinions. Neither is about to happen. Sorry. >Yes indeed. The Book testifies to this truth: "A Book whose verses (signs) are >made plain-An Arabic Qur'an, for men of knowledge." [The Made Plain: 2]. Yet, >one cannot discredit the warning: "It is thus that God hath sealed up the hearts >of those who are devoid of knowledge." [Houd:59] And? Please make a tie between the above quotation. Am I a person who heart God has sealed and am devoid of knowledge? Or what? >Be fair my friend! Would you say that this major part of the Book is plain? >Would you say that it is plain enough for those about whom the Book says: >"Hearts have they with which they understand not, and eyes have they with which >they see not!" [Qur'an 7:178] An interesting question. But then, would you care to point any fingers at anyone and say that this verse is applicable to them? Like myself, for example? No? I didna think so. Aside from the points that you have raised above, and assuming that they are all correct about metaphorical interpretation, you also have to give a plausible reason as to why your own metaphorical arguments are better than the ones generally accepted by most Muslims. me>Your statements here seem to be little other than me>circumstantial evidence to prove your main points. >I respect your point of view. And I yours. There the matter rests.