coleman@sundae10.DAB.GE.COM (Richard Coleman) (05/23/91)
Well, I got my first reserve ride this weekend. I thought I would bare my soul for some net-wisdom. I have 16 jumps (8 using hand-deploy). I was using a different rig than what I had been using in the past, and it had the pilot chute in a *slightly* different place than what I had been using. For some reason (probably stupidity) I did not do any practice rip-cord pulls on this jump. Well, guess what, when it was pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. I tried 3 times, then popped the reserve (my first time doing this). Boy was I in for a surprise. It came out so hard, it about knocked me out. Now, I have to go to the chiropractor every day for the next 2 weeks because of whiplash. It's funny how something as simple as finding your ripcord can become a problem when you can't spare the time to think about it. Has anybody else every had this problem? Of course, from now on, I will make sure to do practice ripcord pulls. I now understand why they make you do so many of these during AFF training!! -- Richard Coleman GE Aerospace Simulation & Control Systems Dept. coleman@sunny.dab.ge.com
robbins@ecs.umass.edu (05/23/91)
In article <1991May22.195426.17798@ge-dab.GE.COM>, coleman@sundae10.DAB.GE.COM (Richard Coleman) writes: > Well, I got my first reserve ride this weekend. I thought I would > bare my soul for some net-wisdom. I have 16 jumps (8 using hand-deploy). > I was using a different rig than what I had been using in the past, and > it had the pilot chute in a *slightly* different place than what I had > been using. For some reason (probably stupidity) I did not do any > practice rip-cord pulls on this jump. Well, guess what, when it was > pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. This sounds like another case I encountered at Turners Falls in Ma. That case didnt have a happy ending. Mitch was using a "new" used rig. He also was pulling on a piece of webbing. Pulled on it all the way to the ground.... The point for instructors: Teach them to LOOK at evrything they touch. Dummy rip cord pulls? LOOK Reach Pull. Practice emergencies in the harness in the classroom... LOOK at cutaway reach for cutaway LOOK for reserve rip cord reach for reserve rip cord. Oh well, Its always good to hear about people who live to learn! Fun Jumping Steve I tried 3 times, then popped > the reserve (my first time doing this). Boy was I in for a surprise. > It came out so hard, it about knocked me out. Now, I have to go to > the chiropractor every day for the next 2 weeks because of whiplash. > It's funny how something as simple as finding your ripcord can become > a problem when you can't spare the time to think about it. Has anybody > else every had this problem? Of course, from now on, I will make sure > to do practice ripcord pulls. I now understand why they make you do > so many of these during AFF training!! > -- > Richard Coleman > GE Aerospace > Simulation & Control Systems Dept. > coleman@sunny.dab.ge.com
larry@hpfelg.HP.COM (Larry Chapman X3117) (05/23/91)
> Nntp-Posting-Host: sundae10.dab.ge.com > > Well, I got my first reserve ride this weekend. I thought I would > bare my soul for some net-wisdom. I have 16 jumps (8 using hand-deploy). > I was using a different rig than what I had been using in the past, and > it had the pilot chute in a *slightly* different place than what I had > been using. For some reason (probably stupidity) I did not do any > practice rip-cord pulls on this jump. Man oh man, at our DZ you get grilled like a fish in a wharf eatery when you "borrow" someone else's gear. This is especially true of someone with so few jumps. If I were you I'd go to the DZ operators and suggest they implement a bit more supervision. I've seen experienced jumpers grope for quite some time on "strange" gear even when they did practice on the ground. I good rule of thumb is to pull a grand higher whenever there's any risk of pulltime "brainlock" for whatever reason. > Well, guess what, when it was > pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. I tried 3 times, then popped > the reserve (my first time doing this). Boy was I in for a surprise. > It came out so hard, it about knocked me out. Now, I have to go to > the chiropractor every day for the next 2 weeks because of whiplash. Reserves opening at terminal can be vicious. But boy does a quick opening feel "good" at 1000'!! -- LSC
cjackson@adobe.COM (Curtis Jackson) (05/24/91)
In article <1991May22.195426.17798@ge-dab.GE.COM> coleman@sunny.dab.ge.com (Richard Coleman) writes: }It's funny how something as simple as finding your ripcord can become }a problem when you can't spare the time to think about it. Has anybody }else every had this problem? Of course, from now on, I will make sure }to do practice ripcord pulls. I now understand why they make you do }so many of these during AFF training!! Indeed. I haven't jumped in a while, but I always did some practice pulls before each jump and always had a trick or two in case I couldn't find the thing. I used one such trick once. I was jumping with thick gloves, and come pull time I couldn't see my handle and couldn't seem to find it. I was pulling high anyway so I gave it three somewhat leisurely tries while glancing at the altimeter. I then took some advice I'd once got from an instructor -- I slapped the outside of my thigh with my hand, slid the hand up my thigh to my waist, and the handle slipped right into the palm of my hand. A trick like that one can save you a reserve ride and repack. -- Curtis Jackson @ Adobe Systems in Mountain View, CA (415-962-4905) Internet: cjackson@adobe.com uucp: ...!{apple|decwrl|sun}!adobe!cjackson --- The big print giveth, and the small print taketh away.
bleck@ai.mit.edu (Olaf Bleck) (05/24/91)
In article <1991May22.195426.17798@ge-dab.GE.COM>, coleman@sundae10.DAB.GE.COM (Richard Coleman) writes: |> Well, I got my first reserve ride this weekend. |> I was using a different rig than what I had been using in the past; |> it had the pilot chute in a *slightly* different place than what I had |> been using. For some reason (probably stupidity) I did not do any |> practice rip-cord pulls on this jump. Well, guess what, when it was |> pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. I tried 3 times, then popped |> the reserve (my first time doing this). Ha! Welcome to the club! What you didn't do was ****LOOK**** at your pilot chute!!! I've had two reserve rides, in my 50 jumps to date, the first one on my first throwout, and the second on jump 36, the first serious RW jump I did this season. On the first one, I actually induced a horseshoe, because I got my thumb under the bridal and pulled--the pilot chute stayed in the pocket until I cut away, when it ripped out. The second one was just like above! Felt around for a bit, then with both hands, then the silver handle. It was not fun, and the more I think about it, the more it scares me. Anyway, with the student gear I used, the ripcord was always really easy to find, if you looked or not, which lead to my bad habit. With the pilot chute, who knows were it's going to be--often it's out of the pocket a few inches flapping in the breeze around on your side. LOOK until you really see it, and keep looking until you've pulled it out. -Olaf
joep@Stardent.COM (Joe Peterson) (05/24/91)
> practice rip-cord pulls on this jump. Well, guess what, when it was > pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. I tried 3 times, then popped > the reserve (my first time doing this). Boy was I in for a surprise. > It came out so hard, it about knocked me out. Now, I have to go to > the chiropractor every day for the next 2 weeks because of whiplash. > It's funny how something as simple as finding your ripcord can become > a problem when you can't spare the time to think about it. Has anybody > else every had this problem? Of course, from now on, I will make sure In having this experience, you, of course, are not at all alone! I know several people personally to whom this has happened (including myself!). When it was time for me to look for my first rig (around 20 jumps, recently off status), I tried several used rigs. On one of my first throw-out jumps, the rig I was trying was a little small for me, causing the handle to ride up a little high on my hip. Another problem was that the pilot chute had been folded a little long for the pocket, so there was an inch or two of slack between the handle and the pocket. I was also wearing gloves (not thick ones, mind you). All of these factors can, and did, result in my first reserve ride! It is truly a terrible feeling not to feel or see that nice little orange handle! My terminal reserve opening really did not seem that bad, but then again, my adrenaline must have been at an all-time high. There are several things to be learned here: 1) Always be careful when jumping an unfamiliar rig. Do lots of practice pulls on the ground (even lying on your stomach), especially if throw-outs are new to you. Throw-outs have a "mushier" feel than ripcords, and they can move around more. 2) Be careful when wearing gloves. I only wear them when I really need them, because you can't feel things nearly as well. If you do wear them, make sure your tactile sense is adequate. 3) Folding the pilot chute and positioning the handle well is important. I like the handle to feel like it won't move around much during freefall. When you get up in the plane on jump run, check the handle's position and push the pilot chute back into the pocket if necessary. But make sure you are not just pushing down the slack near the pocket opening (this will work its way free in freefall!). I find it is best if you cannot pull the handle up without moving the entire pilot chute. 4) It IS very possible to have a "lost handle" with a throw-out! Some people tell you that "lost handles" are only a problem with pull-outs. NOT TRUE! Anybody else out there have any other helpful suggestions? I hope mine help! Joe Peterson C-20351 Stardent Computer, Inc.
esj@gnarley.eng.ufl.edu (Eric S. Johnson) (05/24/91)
In article <1991May22.195426.17798@ge-dab.GE.COM> coleman@sunny.dab.ge.com (Richard Coleman) writes: >Well, I got my first reserve ride this weekend. ... >I was using a different rig than what I had been using in the past, and >it had the pilot chute in a *slightly* different place than what I had >been using. ... Well, guess what, when it was >pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. I tried 3 times, then popped >the reserve This must be more common then I would have thought. Back in march I watched a friend (and recent AFF graduate) dump a reserve somewhere under 1000'. She was using rented gear and had the exact same problem you did, she couldn't find the throw out. It scared the shit out of everyone who was watching. She was pretty shaken up too. The rig had a altimeter mounted on the harness right above the cutaway, and this blocked her view of the throw out pocket. And she spent to much time trying to find it. The moral is to be familer with the gear you are using. Know by feel where your throw out, cutaway, and reserve handles are. Ej a-12472 P.S. Two weeks ago, same friend had a hard time getting the throw out out of the pocket.. (again rented gear, but different rented gear) Didn't muck around this time. After two unsuccessfull pulls she dumped the reserve. Had it open nearly before I had my main open ;-) A lesson learned I would say.
jerrys@mobby.umiacs.umd.edu (Jerry Sobieski) (05/25/91)
In article <1991May22.195426.17798@ge-dab.GE.COM> coleman@sunny.dab.ge.com (Richard Coleman) writes: >Well, I got my first reserve ride this weekend. ... >I was using a different rig than what I had been using in the past, and >it had the pilot chute in a *slightly* different place than what I had >been using. ... Well, guess what, when it was >pull time I couldn't find my ripcord. I tried 3 times, then popped >the reserve A couple thoughts here... There is an old saying; "You always go in on borrowed gear". It seems there are two things going on in these descriptions of reserve rides: First, as mentioned before, is the lackidazical (sp?) pull sequence. As a student or a novice, I really cannot stress this more: You must Look, then reach and pull. Students are less accustomed to where all these handles are than experienced jumpers. And this is further complicated by the fact that they will probably jump several different rigs in their 1st 50 jumps (even student rigs vary considerably from one manufacturer to the next). Secondly, is the "borrowed gear" problem. Jumping unfamiliar gear is a prime way to get into trouble. This may even be more important than the first issue of looking- particularly as you progress and become more reliant on handles being in a certain spot and on specific deployment systems. To witt: the Racer pull-out deployment pud is attached in such a way that you can not physically see it unless you take the rig off and look from behind. The jumper simply finds the right-lower corner of the container, and by doing so has located the pud completely by feel. A pull-out system verses a throw-out system is also a complicator. Placement of puds/throwouts has become a bit more regular in the last few years which is good. Make sure you are familiar with the deployment system you're renting/borrowing, its not enough to just "know where the handle is". Some student rigs come in either dual action cutaway systems or single-point operation systems, i.e. the former has a conventional cutaway handle and a seperate reserve handle, the latter has one single handle that performs both the cutaway and then the reserve deployment. Jumpers just off student status should be particularly mindful of these types of considerations if they find themselves jumping rental gear at some new DZ. As more schools transition to sport student gear (with square mains *and* square reserves), there are some students/novices that may never have been trained on round canopies. Don't assume your reserve is a square. Its a hell-of-a-time to find out as it opens. Always ask when you borrow/rent gear whats in it, even if it is a nice new student Vector. Complacency kills. I'm outta here...gotta go do 3 days of 20 way... Blue Skies - hope everyone has a good M-day weekend! Jerry -- Domain: jerrys@umiacs.umd.edu Jerry Sobieski UUCP: uunet!mimsy!jerrys UMIACS - Univ. of Maryland Phone: (301)405-6735 College Park, Md 20742
brent@terra.Eng.Sun.COM (Brent Callaghan) (05/28/91)
In article <13806.283bc58c@ecs.umass.edu>, robbins@ecs.umass.edu writes: > This sounds like another case I encountered at Turners Falls in Ma. > That case didnt have a happy ending. Mitch was using a "new" used > rig. He also was pulling on a piece of webbing. Pulled on it all > the way to the ground.... > > > The point for instructors: Teach them to LOOK at evrything they touch. > Dummy rip cord pulls? LOOK Reach Pull. > Practice emergencies in the harness in the classroom... LOOK at cutaway > reach for cutaway LOOK for reserve rip cord reach for reserve > rip cord. Yup, it's incredible how common this is. In the days of Capewell releases it was common to hear of skydivers pulling on the open Capewell cover instead of the blast handle. Then with 3 rings folks started pulling on the big ring of the 3 ring (the one that stays with the harness) instead of the mini-ripcord handle. I've seen it in suspended harness training too - students grappling without looking and sometimes missing the ripcord handle completely. -- Made in New Zealand --> Brent Callaghan @ Sun Microsystems Email: brent@Eng.Sun.COM phone: (415) 336 1051
SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.FIDONET.ORG (SKYDIVE) (05/29/91)
Reply-to: Dave.Appel@p30.f30.n231.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Appel)
Fido-To: curtis jackson
In a message to Skydive <25 May 91 18:20> uiucuxc!adobe.com!cjackso wrote:
ui> From uiucuxc!convex.mitek.com!matt
ui> From: uiucuxc!adobe.com!cjackson (Curtis Jackson)
ui> To: ehsnet.fidonet.org!skydive
ui> Date: 23 May 91 21:32:50 GMT
ui> Indeed. I haven't jumped in a while, but I always did some practice
ui> pulls before each jump and always had a trick or two in case I couldn't
ui> find the thing. I used one such trick once. I was jumping with
ui> thick gloves, and come pull time I couldn't see my handle and couldn't
ui> seem to find it. I was pulling high anyway so I gave it three
ui> somewhat leisurely tries while glancing at the altimeter. I then
ui> took some advice I'd once got from an instructor -- I slapped the
ui> outside of my thigh with my hand, slid the hand up my thigh to my
ui> waist, and the handle slipped right into the palm of my hand.
I have heard the same thing from very experienced jumpers.
--- XRS!% 4.10
--- eecp 1.45 LM2
* Origin: The Drop Zone, Dave Appel, 1:231/30.30 (Quick 1:231/30.30)
--
SKYDIVE - via FidoNet node 1:233/13 (ehsnet.fidonet.org)tneale@aeras.uucp (Tom Neale) (05/31/91)
In article <1991May24.131353.29231@eng.ufl.edu> esj@gnarley.eng.ufl.edu (Eric S. Johnson) writes: >Two weeks ago, same friend had a hard time getting the throw out >out of the pocket.. (again rented gear, but different rented gear) >Didn't muck around this time. After two unsuccessfull pulls she dumped >the reserve. Had it open nearly before I had my main open ;-) Allow me to re-post an article from September of 1988 along the same lines...The jump numbers have increased since then. ---- My wife, Ann, had her first reserve ride weekend before last. It was a total. No fun. She's got 33 jumps and started and graduated from the AFF course at Skydance this summer after 8 jumps, only repeated level 7 once. In case you couldn't tell I'm very proud of her! Ann hadn't jumped for 4 weeks because of the wedding and honeymoon and had made only one jump so far that day. She still feels a bit uneasy about packing her rig by herself and prefers some supervision. Oh yeah, she has a Talon with loaner canopies, a Raven 2 main (too big but good for a start) and a Hobbit reserve. I was very busy with some 16-24 ways that day and had very little time to assist her with packing. In fact while she packing just before the reserve ride I had to run to the plane and hardly said Bye! (guilt, guilt, guilt). Well as it turns out she had a question about how to fold the pilot chute for her rig and asked it of someone else. The response she got was not what she had used in the past but it went in the pocket OK. Can you see it coming, yet? Anyway, to make a short story long, at 2500' she reached back for the pilot chute handle, found it and tugged. It wouldn't come out, she made her choice and dumped the Hobbit instead. When I next saw her on the ground she had a gold Hobbit wrapped around her arms instead of a brown Raven and I immediately knew there had been a problem. She explained it all and then I tugged on the pilot chute. It stuck, but a good hard yank brought it out. It looked like this: O <-- handle | <-- long skinny section | ( @ ) <-- wad of material at the bottom --- She said that she had a plan in her mind that if it didn't come out on the first pull she'd use her reserve. She stuck to the plan. She also said that she remembered the story I had told her about Jeannie McCoombs and how she died. Jeannie was chided about using a reserve because of a stuck pilot chute. The next time it happened Jeannie spent the rest of her life trying to get it free. Ann also said how the decision to use the reserve was all calm and businesslike, no panic, no problem, just do it. And best of all the Hobbit was a "zippy" canopy and she likes it very much. Everyone who talked to her about it applauded her decision. She had absolutley made the right choice and was glad to see her decision reinforced Yes, I did show her the right way the fold the pilot chute for her rig. Moral(s) of the story: 1. When in doubt, whip it out (your reserve that is). He (or she) who hesitates loses, big. 2. If someone asks you about how to pack gear that you are not thoroughly familiar with decline to answer and please refer them to a rigger or at least someone uses the same type of gear. 3. Never give anyone a hard time about choosing to ride a perfectly good reserve down. They made the choice, not you, and they are still alive to tell you about it. -- Blue skies, | ...sun!aeras!tneale | | in flight: N2103Q | Entropy isn't what it used Tom Neale | in freefall: D8049 | to be. | via the ether: WA1YUB |