[alt.sources.wanted] Nuclear Detonation Model Wanted.

c8902477@cc.newcastle.edu.au (Bernard Schmitz) (04/09/91)

Hello,

I don't know if this is the right place to ask but I will anyway...

I'm not actually looking for source (it would be nice!) but I need some formulas
to model the effects of a nuclear detonation.  Not the global effects of
hundreds of them, but only the short term local effects of one or two. There was
an article in BYTE years ago that gave stuff like radation doseage and EMP
range, but what I really need is something that will tell me things like the
size of the fireball created depending on the megatonnage and the expansion rate
of the fireball.  I don't know if there is such a formula but if anyone knows
anything about it could you mail me?

Thanks...

--
Bernard Schmitz                             c8902477@cc.newcastle.edu.au

tgades@skadi.physics.stolaf.edu (Anthony M Gades) (04/11/91)

In article <-283049997@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com> gstanfld@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com (Gill Stanfield) writes:
>I think you should just turn your computer off and kiss your *ss goodbye.
>That should be an accurate model of the local effects of a nuke!
>
>:-)



Holy smokes, what a brain child this guy must be.  One of these people
who think that it is better to live in ignorance.

I think that a simulation would be very interesting, and one might 
learn some physics.  

It is too bad that such a request immediately draws such comments as
the one above, as they help no person that I know.



good job bonehead.

tgades


-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------
  _________                         Tony Gades St. Olaf College,
      /                       /     Northfield, MN  55057 
     /                       /      tel (507)-663-2725 

gstanfld@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com (Gill Stanfield) (04/11/91)

I think you should just turn your computer off and kiss your *ss goodbye.
That should be an accurate model of the local effects of a nuke!

:-)

mskuhn@faui09.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Markus Kuhn) (04/14/91)

Just look at

A. Robson: A computer method for predicting fall-out levels (p. 411)
in IAEA Peaceful Nuclear Explosions III, Vienna 1974.

Hope this helps.

Markus

--
Markus Kuhn, Computer Science student -- University of Erlangen, Germany
E-mail: G=Markus;S=Kuhn;OU1=rrze;OU2=cnve;P=uni-erlangen;A=dbp;C=de

mikes@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu (Michael Squires) (04/15/91)

The Office of Civil Defense published a book called "Nuclear  Weapons Effects".
It was used in CD training classes.  It contains equations and nomographs that
will let you determine how quickly an air, land, or water burst will demolish
various structures.  GE published a little booklet in the '60's (the may still
do it) that contained a nuclear weapons effects slide rule, plus similar tables.

In terms of computer software the most famous isprobably the SIR NEM model
(Strategic International Relations Nuclear Exchange Model) created by the
Agency for Interscience Methodology in Chicago in the 70's which was run
by ACDA and by the Joint Strategic Targeting Planning Staff.  Another model
still apparently in use is the Arsenal Exchange Model which was less
disaggregated.  (This is current as of 1980, the last time I spent much
time in this area..)  The sources for SIR NEM were available from ACDA
at one time, with all the comments removed (except for the JSTPS line
numbers!).

An interesting aside:  when I recompiled a version of AEM that I know was used
during the SALT I talks I was interested to find 13 FORTRAN errors missed by
the more primitive compilers of the early 70's (CDC 3600 FTN).  These were
all uninitialized variables.  Now, about that 100% reliability you promised....
-- 

Mike Squires (mikes@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu)     812 855 3974 (w) 812 333 6564 (h)
mikes@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu          546 N Park Ridge Rd., Bloomington, IN 47408
Under construction: mikes@sir-alan.cica.indiana.edu

amigo@milton.u.washington.edu (The Friend) (04/15/91)

tgades@skadi.physics.stolaf.edu (Anthony M Gades) writes:

>In article <-283049997@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com> gstanfld@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com (Gill Stanfield) writes:


>Holy smokes, what a brain child this guy must be.  One of these people
>who think that it is better to live in ignorance.

>I think that a simulation would be very interesting, and one might 
>learn some physics.  

>It is too bad that such a request immediately draws such comments as
>the one above, as they help no person that I know.

     I've seen many charts, graphs, etc. on the subject of nuclear
devistation, detonation, etc. These feature the details of time lag, 
distance cloud travels, temperatures, height of cloud, etc. Really interesting
from the standpoint of learning how incredible nuclear bombs can be. I'd
think the best place to look would be the ol' library (why not?). Though the
math involved is going to be a pain.. the resulting data is neat (especially
when brought to common-terms). By far this is all going to take a lot of work
[research]... seems like anything to do with details on nuclear subjects is
 hard to find. As to finding a computer program directly to do the modeling..
GOOD LUCK. I think the research & design-it-yourself method will prove more  
valuable (especially in terms of what you learn).
     Just entering X and saying Y happens isn't going to mean a lot..
-- 
--------------------------------------///------------------------------------ 
     Scott Rowin                     ///  amigo@milton.u.washington.edu
     ***********                    /// 
- SPACE OPEN FOR LEASE -       \-\_///    Amigas really do it better...

gstanfld@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com (Gill Stanfield) (04/16/91)

}In article <-283049997@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com> gstanfld@hpcupt1.cup.hp.com (Gill Sta
}nfield) writes:
}>I think you should just turn your computer off and kiss your *ss goodbye.
}>That should be an accurate model of the local effects of a nuke!
}>
}>:-)

}Holy smokes, what a brain child this guy must be.  One of these people
}who think that it is better to live in ignorance.

My apologies to Tony Gades and all other people who took my comment as a waste of
their disc space;
I only meant it in humor (hence, the ":-)")...

Please don't interpret my levity as a sign of ignorance or the desire to live in
ignorance.  Actually, I think it *would* be pretty interesting to see a model of
this stuff. I have discussed such simulations with people working at
Livermore and testing areas in New Mexico, but am unaware of the specifics names of
such simulations.  It appears that other people have posted some information that
will be worthwhile to Bernard Schmitz and others reading this notes group.

}I think that a simulation would be very interesting, and one might
}learn some physics.
}It is too bad that such a request immediately draws such comments as
}the one above, as they help no person that I know.

Perhaps one might learn to take life a little less seriously, Tony.

Regards,

gill