mlloyd@maths.tcd.ie (Michael Lloyd) (02/01/90)
Hi. This is a request for opinions and/or experiences which would be of use to me in advising my administrators on what to spend our (v. small) research grants on. The kinds of things I am talking about are Shared Volume systems, Networking hardware and the like. We are a small research group (in Statistics), using a collection of 4 MacIIs of various flavours, a couple of Pluses and an SE. Recently, we added an AppleShare system, with a 100Mb shared hard disk and a 45Mb removable drive, all serviced by a Plus (yes, a Plus). This is slow, small, and inefficient. We are also connected into a simple building-wide AppleTalk network, so that every Mac in each office can talk to the secretarial LaserWriter. We have no zones or bridging, and the network is out there at the limit of the physical and logical ability of AppleTalk. This may be resolved when we get our own LaserWriter for the Research Lab. So: what are the weak points we can work on? Obviously, bridging is a good idea, but how about EtherNet as a replacement for the smaller (research) network? Is this appreciably faster? For that matter, can we ever expect international e-mail to work, and at what (approximate) cost? How about an SE/30 as a server? I take it that its internal drive is also available, making a very handy large temp folder... Is it a waste of money putting this on the (apparently) very slow AppleShare system? I can't really discuss our budget options in detail - it's a case of pleading for as much as we want, making a case on cost-effectiveness. For this reason, the decision on buying more speed or much more space (say a 300Mb or 600Mb drive) must rest with us, but all your opinions are welcome. Many thanks for reading this far. Now, if you feel you can add some comment, PLEASE E_MAIL, as I may never have time to read the net :-( :-( Mike. Mike Lloyd, Dept of Statistics, | Trinity College, Dublin, | "COGITO, ERGO CHICO & ZEPPO" Ireland. | Tonio K. (mlloyd@maths.tcd.ie) |
jwright@cs.iastate.edu (Jim Wright) (02/02/90)
To: mlloyd@maths.tcd.ie [ The net was quite helpful when I was first considering AppleShare. ] [ Consider this a thank you and a summary. ] In a posting to comp.sys.mac.hardware you wrote: | So: what are the weak points we can work on? Obviously, bridging is a good | idea, but how about EtherNet as a replacement for the smaller (research) | network? Is this appreciably faster? For that matter, can we ever expect | international e-mail to work, and at what (approximate) cost? I have just about completed the specification, purchase and installation of a new Appleshare network. I am very pleased with the results. The lab I did this for is a fairly small chemistry lab. We now have 2 SE/30s, 1 IIcx, and 2 Pluses all served by a II. The II has a CDC MacWren 170MB drive, as well as a 45MB removable (that's never removed). I have the Pluses on LocalTalk with the LaserWriter, and everything else on Ethernet. To join the two, I use a Shiva EtherGate. The system is very fast--I am quite happy to put all applications on the file server and only use the local hard drives to hold the System Folder. If the system folders weren't about 3MB, I might do away with local hard drives completely. Ethernet. In my opinion this is what makes the network usable. I have run the system with LocalTalk while waiting for a screwup in delivering the Ethernet cards to be resolved. LocalTalk stinks. I have been using cards from Asante. I can't compare them to any other Ethernet cards, but I'm quite pleased with the performance. I also have a SCSI-to-Ethernet box that I'm going to hook up to one of the Pluses. Right now I'm still waiting for an update of the software for it so can't report on how well it works. If you're interested, write back sometime next week. Bridging. I am very happy with the EtherGate. You can have up to three connections active at once. One connection is to Ethernet, thick or thin. The second and third connections can each be to either a serial device or a LocalTalk net. So you can bridge two nets and share a modem or a plotter, or you can bridge three nets. Shiva's technical support has been good. I got old software, and they helped me download and install new software. They also told me that they have significant educational discounts (after I had already bought it). I use this to bridge the Ethernet to the LocalTalk, and to allow any computer on the net to use the modem. You may want to have Ethernet for workstations and server, a LocalTalk to the "outside", and a LocalTalk for inside the department (your own LaserWriter, or the Pluses). Another option is to hook a modem up to the EtherGate and allow dial in connections to the network. I was able to dial in to the Shiva network and mount their volumes on my computer. I then just dragged a copy of the updated software over to my local machine. So this really does work, but I wouldn't want to regularly use it with anything less than a 9600bps connection. Hard Drives. The space you need obviously depends on how you operate. The 170MB drive seems a good compromise between big enough and too much to backup. If you do get Ethernet, plan on putting *everything* on the file server. It really is wonderful. In my opinion, the hard drive is the last place you want to cut corners. I've had great experience with CDC drives. (Yes I know Seagate bought Imprimis, but they'll always be CDC to me. :-) E-Mail. I haven't worried at all about this. One thing I don't have to consider is connecting Unix workstations to the net. Although connections to Unix and MSDOS may be coming up soon. | How about an SE/30 as a server? I take it that its internal drive is also | available, making a very handy large temp folder... Is it a waste of money | putting this on the (apparently) very slow AppleShare system? I wouldn't do this. Even with Ethernet, an SE/30 is probably more power than you need in the server. But I think anything less than a II is too little. I would suggest getting a II__ without a keyboard or monitor, then putting an old II into service as the server and using the keyboard and monitor with the new computer. You should get a cheap 1-bit video card to drop into the II (using the [presumably] color card in the new II__) just in case. This way it is easy to hook up to the server in the rare occasion that you have to. For day to day network administration, I use Timbuktu on a workstation and on the server. I can then control the server without needing a direct connection. (In the above, fill in IIx, IIcx or IIci for II__ as you see fit.) | I can't really discuss our budget options in detail - it's a case of pleading | for as much as we want, making a case on cost-effectiveness. For this | reason, the decision on buying more speed or much more space (say a 300Mb | or 600Mb drive) must rest with us, but all your opinions are welcome. Same way here. When I stepped in, the lab computers consisted of a 512K connected to an ImageWriter and a II connected to a LaserWriter. We've come a long way in about 9 months. I did a lot of studying before making my proposal. I basically said that they should either do it right to start with, or else save their money and not do anything at all. A half solution would be worse than nothing. Everybody has been extremely pleased with the results. | Mike Lloyd, Dept of Statistics, | | Trinity College, Dublin, | "COGITO, ERGO CHICO & ZEPPO" | Ireland. | Tonio K. | (mlloyd@maths.tcd.ie) | -- Jim Wright jwright@cs.iastate.edu