bball@hubbell.ucr.edu (alvaro monge) (08/13/90)
I had a few questions about the HP DeskWriter: 1 -- Is it an Inkjet printer, or what? 2 -- Does it come with its own driver? a. if yes, how good is it (i.e. compatibility) b. if no, then how do I get my hands on a driver 3 -- How good is this printer, since this is one printer I can actually afford that seems comparable to a laser printer (is it??) 4 -- Can any of you that use this printer tell me how you like it, or dislike it. 5 -- What is the "BEST" price that I can get it for and where and also what is the guarantee on the printer (year, 2 ???) Thanks in advance. Al (bball@ucrmath.ucr.edu)
meldal@bach.Stanford.EDU (Sigurd Meldal) (08/13/90)
I have just researched the DeskWriter a bit, and can answer some of the questions posted: In article <8120@ucrmath.ucr.edu> bball@hubbell.ucr.edu (alvaro monge) writes: > > 1 -- Is it an Inkjet printer, or what? It is. > 2 -- Does it come with its own driver? > a. if yes, how good is it (i.e. compatibility) It comes with its own driver. > 3 -- How good is this printer, since this is one printer I can > actually afford that seems comparable to a > laser printer (is it??) I have not purchased one yet (I will though, see below), but a few hours of testing one leads me to the conclusion that it is worth its price to me. To get an acceptable version, I will add Adobe Type manager, the Adobe Plus Pack of fonts and the SuperLaserSpool software to my configuration. The ATM stuff in order to get reasonable font compatibility with postscript output, the spooler in order to (you guessed it) spool. The Apple supplied backgrounder does not work with the DeskWriter. In that configuration it is a memory hog, which can be alleviated with either lots of real memory (more than two MBytes seem necessary) or by using Virtual (the latter will slow things down a bit, I guess). The output is quite good looking, at least for text and PICT graphics. Postscript is a no-no, of course (unless you buy a RIP like Freedom of the Press). The ink is watersoluble, and may cause the paper to warp a bit wherever you have areas of solid black (because of the water). The output in "faster" mode (150 dpi) is also quite acceptable. It is not fast, but fast enough - 1 ppm claimed in "best" mode, 2 ppm in "faster" mode. The duty cycle of the printer is a claimed 60 000 pages, with 25 pages per day max on the average and an absolute maximum of 50 pages in any one day. It has a separate external power supply, and the move to a different power situation (e.g. I shall move to Europe soon) entails only the purchase of another little power box (Fry's claims to price them at ca. $60). > 5 -- What is the "BEST" price that I can get it for? Things are in transition. HP has just announced a $200 price cut, and I think this is for a new model which does not have the AppleTalk interface - i.e. the cheaper model runs off the modem or printer port and is usable for a single machine only. All mail order companies that I have ckecked are still selling the previous model, at the old price (the best being $829, I seem to recall). The only place I know of which carries the new model right now is ComputerWare in Palo Alto, CA (I can dig up their phone number if you need it - drop me a note tomorrow). They're selling it for $695 + shipping (plus tax if you live in California). I shall probably wait till the mail order companies get on-line (because of the tax). The warranty was a number of years, but I forget... Best regards, Sigurd-- Hard mail: ERL 456 | Internet: meldal@anna.stanford.edu Computer Systems Lab.| Stanford University | BitNet: meldal%anna.stanford.edu@forsythe.bitnet Stanford CA 94305 | Uucp: ...decwrl!glacier!shasta!anna!meldal USA | phone: +1 415 723 6027 fax: +1 415 725 7398
jprice@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu (John Price) (08/13/90)
In article <8120@ucrmath.ucr.edu>, bball@hubbell.ucr.edu (alvaro monge) writes: >I had a few questions about the HP DeskWriter: > 1 -- Is it an Inkjet printer, or what? Good question. The specs in the manual say it's a "thermal inkjet" printer. However, it cautions you against using paper designed for thermal or inkjet printers. Go figure. > 2 -- Does it come with its own driver? Yup. Works great. > 3 -- How good is this printer, since this is one printer I can I find it has what I'll call "near-laser quality." By this, I mean that while the resolution is the same, the quality isn't quite as good as most laser printers. I suspect the pixels are slightly larger than those on a laser printer, due to the paper absorbing the ink. > 4 -- Can any of you that use this printer tell me how you like it, or > dislike it. See #2 above. > 5 -- What is the "BEST" price that I can get it for and where and also > what is the guarantee on the printer (year, 2 ???) I got mine, including everything I needed to get up and running, for $650. This was, however, at a university discount price, so you might not be able to get that price. I don't remember how long the warranty is. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- John Price | Internet: jprice@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu 5-145 Knudsen Hall | BITNET: price@uclaph UCLA Dept. of Physics | DECnet: uclapp::jprice Los Angeles, CA 90024-1547 | YellNet: 213-825-2259 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Where there is no solution, there is no problem.
lorner@csuchico.edu (Lance Orner) (08/13/90)
In article <0093B195.04E49880@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu> jprice@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu (John Price) writes: >In article <8120@ucrmath.ucr.edu>, bball@hubbell.ucr.edu (alvaro monge) writes: >>I had a few questions about the HP DeskWriter: >> 1 -- Is it an Inkjet printer, or what? > Good question. The specs in the manual say it's a "thermal inkjet" >printer. However, it cautions you against using paper designed for thermal >or inkjet printers. Go figure. I belive the term "thermal inkjet" means that the print-head uses heat to force the ink out of the ink well and onto the paper. A thermal printer uses heat to create the markings on the pages, not ink, and special paper is required that will respond to this head. >> 3 -- How good is this printer, since this is one printer I can > I find it has what I'll call "near-laser quality." By this, I mean >that while the resolution is the same, the quality isn't quite as good as >most laser printers. I suspect the pixels are slightly larger than those >on a laser printer, due to the paper absorbing the ink. I have a DeskJet, not a DeskWriter, although the printer is almost identical. I agree that the print doesn't look exactly like a laser printer, I don't know if I'd go so far as to degrade it down to "near-letter quality." With good quality paper, and ATM, this printer can _ery_ good quality that looks great. But the quality of the print has to do in large part to the paper you use. I've noticed that on some papers, the ink will "run" more, causing the edges to be less distinct. Good paper can really help, if not solve, this problem. This, and the fact that it is a lot cheaper than a laser printer, is the reason I'd recomend one. -- --Lance M. Orner | Without the software to run the California St. Univ., Chico | hardware, you get _nowhere_! lorner@cscihp.csuchico.edu | --unknown cartoon
jprice@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu (John Price) (08/13/90)
In article <1990Aug13.054832.26261@csuchico.edu>, lorner@csuchico.edu (Lance Orner) writes: >In article <0093B195.04E49880@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu> jprice@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu (John Price) writes: >>> 3 -- How good is this printer, since this is one printer I can >> I find it has what I'll call "near-laser quality." By this, I mean ^^^^^ > >I have a DeskJet, not a DeskWriter, although the printer is almost identical. >I agree that the print doesn't look exactly like a laser printer, I don't know >if I'd go so far as to degrade it down to "near-letter quality." ^^^^^^ Neither would I. That's why I didn't. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- John Price | Internet: jprice@uclapp.physics.ucla.edu 5-145 Knudsen Hall | BITNET: price@uclaph UCLA Dept. of Physics | DECnet: uclapp::jprice Los Angeles, CA 90024-1547 | YellNet: 213-825-2259 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Where there is no solution, there is no problem.
neff@hpvcfs1.HP.COM (Dave Neff) (08/13/90)
> Things are in transition. HP has just announced a $200 price cut, and > I think this is for a new model which does not have the AppleTalk > interface - i.e. the cheaper model runs off the modem or printer port > and is usable for a single machine only. ... The DeskWriter with AppleTalk has replaced the serial only DeskWriter. The price reduction was regarding the DeskWriter with Appletalk (also does serial of course), which now has a suggested list of $995. Street prices should fall corresponding to this price reduction. I would expect below $700 street prices to be common. The Warrantee on DeskWriter is 1 year. The above paragraph is fact, now I will enter personal opinion mode: Personally, I wouldn't buy ATM for use with the DeskWriter. The outline fonts that come with the DeskWriter driver are fine, and with system 7 coming up, and its built in support for outline fonts, I wouldn't spend any extra money for an interim solution (personal opinion of course). Now if you have no intention of upgrading to system 7, or if you already have access to Adobe fonts, or for some reason absolutely need font outlines identical to PostScript, these may be reasons for getting ATM. But in general, I would just use the standard fonts that come with the DeskWriter until all these "font wars" settle out. If you have a couple hundred extra dollars, you might do better spending it on extra RAM so you can run system 7 and its outline fonts, rather than buying fonts in what may be an interim solution. ATM is a fine product, giving outline font capabilities to printers that otherwise would have no such support. But outline fonts come "for free" with the DeskWriter so I would save my money and wait for system 7. Dave Neff neff@hpvcfs1.hp.com
anjrs1@acad2.anc.alaska.edu (SWENSEN JESSE R) (08/14/90)
In article <8120@ucrmath.ucr.edu>, bball@hubbell.ucr.edu (alvaro monge) writes... > >I had a few questions about the HP DeskWriter: > > 1 -- Is it an Inkjet printer, or what? > Yes, the Deskwriter is an Inkjet printer. > 2 -- Does it come with its own driver? > a. if yes, how good is it (i.e. compatibility) > b. if no, then how do I get my hands on a driver > Yes. The driver is one of the best I have seen. It is a easy to use as a LaserWriter or ImageWriter driver. I have not found any thing incompatible. > 3 -- How good is this printer, since this is one printer I can > actually afford that seems comparable to a laser > printer (is it??) > For the price, it can't be beat. It is NOT as good as a laser (the water soluble ink makes the charaters blead on the edges.) but only if you really look hard. > 4 -- Can any of you that use this printer tell me how you > like it, or dislike it. > I really, really like it. Having worked for a dealer (in a former life) and trying to get third party printers to work, this one is a breeze. Just plug it in and go. I even comes with outline fonts (times, helvetica, courier and symbol). I use it with Adobe Type Manager on an SE/30. Any adobe font prints at 300dpi. > 5 -- What is the "BEST" price that I can get it for and where and also > what is the guarantee on the printer (year, 2 ???) > I recieved an ad {"Offer limited to Schools, Colleges and Universities(including staff and faculty)"} from Cedar Computer Center, Inc. 12158 Lackland Rd, Suite J St. Louis, MO. 63146 (314) 469-5400 The price the quote is $560 with a 3 year warranty. (offer valid till 8/31/90). This is the best price I have seen....... Good luck! Jesse Swensen Standard disclaimers apply. Also, I am not associated or have any connection with Ceder Computer Center, Inc.
Drako@cup.portal.com (Chris Del Grande) (08/14/90)
In article 14137.3.2048.4, lorner@csuchico.edu (Lance Orner) writes regarding the HP DeskWriter: >But the quality of the print has to do in large part to the paper you use. >I've noticed that on some papers, the ink will "run" more, causing the edges >to be less distinct. Good paper can really help, if not solve, this problem I just purchased a DeskWriter yesterday, and so far I am very impressed. In order to maximize output clarity I would be interested in learning just what the best type of paper for use with this printer is. Has anybody done adequate to extensive testing and found a suitable paper? I purchased photocopier paper, bond quality, and it seems to work great, but any recommendations would be welcomed. Thanks! Drako@cup.portal.com _Chris Del Grande___________________________________________________________
powsner@csb1.nlm.nih.gov (Seth M Powsner) (08/15/90)
I'll put in a vote for Neenah Bond 25% Cotton Fiber White Cockle Finish
#02700 (Sub 20 Basis 10M M Weight). My boss stumbled on it by accident
for his DeskJet. I believe it's make by Kimberly Clark Corp of
Neehah, WI 54956. From our experience it bleeds so little that you can
distinguish every dot.
(Disclaimer-- totally a personal opinion; no financial interest at stake)
Seth Powsner powsner@qm.ycc.yale.edu
powsner@yalemed.bitnetkibo@pawl.rpi.edu (James 'Kibo' Parry) (08/15/90)
In article <32786@cup.portal.com> Drako@cup.portal.com (Chris Del Grande) writes: >In article 14137.3.2048.4, lorner@csuchico.edu (Lance Orner) writes regarding >the HP DeskWriter: >>But the quality of the print has to do in large part to the paper you use. >>I've noticed that on some papers, the ink will "run" more, causing the edges >>to be less distinct. Good paper can really help, if not solve, this problem > I just purchased a DeskWriter yesterday, and so far I am very >impressed. In order to maximize output clarity I would be interested in >learning just what the best type of paper for use with this printer is. >Has anybody done adequate to extensive testing and found a suitable paper? >I purchased photocopier paper, bond quality, and it seems to work great, >but any recommendations would be welcomed. Thanks! I've had several brands of paper in my DeskJet (which uses the same ink cartridges as the DeskWriter) and here are some notes: 1.) Don't get anything intended specifically for copiers or laser printers, because these papers are often coated with something (wax?) that the ink won't soak into. The same goes for "inkjet" paper. 2.) Price isn't really correlated to print quality. The papers that I like the best are all in the "standard office typing paper" category--they typically are marked something like "20 lb. bond paper, for typing, plain paper copiers, etc." Some of my favorites are: Hammermill 20lb. Bond, Boise Cascade, Hammermill Tidal DP, and Ampad Colorgraphic (the Ampad prints the sharpest.) Strathmore Legacy turned out to be a bad choice because it "spiders" a lot for some reason. I suggest that when you buy paper, do printer tests (front of one sheet and back of another, be sure to label them--the package will usually claim one side of the paper to be the "front", some papers seem to work better on one side or the other in the DeskJet but not all) and then save them along with the label from your package of paper. I have a folder full of these samples and it makes a handy reference. The papers I liked above usually go for $4-$7 in discount office supplies stores around here (Upstate New York) or $5-$15 in and around Boston--when I find a brand I like for a reasonable price I buy several reams. Hope these suggestions/opinions come in handy... -- james "kibo" parry, 138 birch lane, scotia, ny 12302 <-- close to schenectady. kibo@pawl.rpi.edu _________________________________________________ kibo%pawl.rpi.edu@rpi.edu / Kibology / Anything I say is my opinion, userfe0n@rpitsmts.bitnet / is better! / and is the opposite of Xibo's.
stevem@hpvcfs1.HP.COM (Steve Miller) (08/15/90)
>I'll put in a vote for Neenah Bond 25% Cotton Fiber White Cockle Finish >#02700 (Sub 20 Basis 10M M Weight). My boss stumbled on it by accident... I've also have very good experiences with Neenah bond 25% Cotton. I don't know exactly what sub-catagory of Neenah bond it was, but I found it produced very crisp sharp text. Also note that paper that is very white produces good contrast giving better print quality. Neenah bond provides this good contrast. Gilbert bond generally gives good results, but recently I've had batches of paper where exactly every third sheed of paper gives slightly inferior quality output (the text is lighter, not quite black). I've heard that when paper is manufactured, it is cut and stacked in a fashion that could result in every third, or fourth sheet being from a different part of the roll which may have different qualities. Several types of less expensive copier paper can also give good results. I use Western CopyMate High Speed Red Label copier paper (White, long Grain, Sub 20 blah blah blah). I haven't done extensive testing on copier paper so I don't know which is the best. Note: Make sure to print on the correct side of the paper for best results. On some papers it doesn't matter, on others, the differece is dramatic. Steven Miller Vancouver Division Hewlett Packard These opinions are my own and don't reflect HP's endorsement of any particular brand of paper. These are just my personal experiences.
stevem@hpvcfs1.HP.COM (Steve Miller) (08/16/90)
>It is not fast, but fast enough - 1 ppm claimed in "best" mode, 2 >ppm in "faster" mode. Average throughput from real world testing from the time OK is hit to the time the page falls into the output tray. Mac II: 1.6 ppm (pages per minute) in "best" mode Mac SE: 1.0 ppm in "best" mode This was the result of 40 pages of documents from Word, MacDraw II, PageMaker, etc.. Some of the documents were single page and some multipage documents covering a range of document complexities. As a comparison, the ImageWriter achieved only about 0.4 ppm while the LaserWriter IINT got 2.3 ppm. >The duty cycle of the printer is a claimed 60 000 pages, with 25 pages >per day max on the average and an absolute maximum of 50 pages in any >one day. There is no absolute maximum daily usage for DeskWriter. It's not like the printer is going to self-desctuct if you print more than XXX pages in a certain period of time. >Things are in transition. HP has just announced a $200 price cut, and >I think this is for a new model which does not have the AppleTalk >interface - i.e. the cheaper model runs off the modem or printer port >and is usable for a single machine only. The price reduction is for the DeskWriter WITH AppleTalk, there aren't two versions of the DeskWriter being sold. The DeskWriter now lists for $995, and at MacWorld I saw outlets selling them for under $640. Steven Miller Vancouver Division Hewlett Packard
nolan@tssi.UUCP (Michael Nolan) (08/21/90)
IMHO, the DeskWriter is the best printer around for the money, and ATM is what makes it such a bargain. Since I started using ATM and type 1 fonts started becoming available on BBSs, I've gotten ten times the usage, and had twice the fun doing it. You don't need a hundred fonts, but it's sure nice to know they're out there if you need them. Give me a fancy script font, a couple of flowery or gothic ones, and I'm happy. If Adobe's prices bother you, there are shareware fonts out there for $5-$15, and FontBank has 250 fonts for $295, just a little bit more than a buck each! (These are display fonts, not very good below 18 point, but fine for headlines.) When System 7 finally arrives, and when it has all the bells and whistles Apple promises, I'll be happy to reevaluate my use of ATM. In the mean time, for under $60 street price, ATM makes a good printer (DeskWriter) into a GREAT printer. Mike Nolan