CHARLES.BOOS@f200.n226.z1.FIDONET.ORG (CHARLES BOOS) (09/18/90)
I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I have heard
that the power supply for the plus hasn't been updated since well before
the 528 was introduced resulting in an increased risk of burning out the
power supply. I have already had to replace my power supply once because
of this burnout and I am worried that 4Mb would be too much of a strain on
my current unit. Also, I was considering a portrait monitor(with
accelerator card) and I am worried about the power supply still. Does
anyone have a similar configuration and if you do what problems do you
note? Let me know as I can get the SIMM's and the monitor relatively
cheap but I don't need recurring repair bills and down time. Thanks.
Charlie
--
CHARLES BOOS via cmhGate - Net 226 fido<=>uucp gateway Col, OH
UUCP: ...!osu-cis!n8emr!cmhgate!200!CHARLES.BOOS
INET: CHARLES.BOOS@f200.n226.z1.FIDONET.ORGAdam.Frix@p2.f200.n226.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Adam Frix) (09/19/90)
CHARLES BOOS writes in a message on 17 Sep 90: CB> I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I CB> have heard that the power supply for the plus hasn't been updated CB> since well before the 528 was introduced resulting in an increased CB> risk of burning out the power supply. I have already had to CB> replace my power supply once because of this burnout and I am CB> worried that 4Mb would be too much of a strain on my current CB> unit. Also, I was considering a portrait monitor(with accelerator CB> card) and I am worried about the power supply still. Does anyone CB> have a similar configuration and if you do what problems do CB> you note? Let me know as I can get the SIMM's and the monitor CB> relatively cheap but I don't need recurring repair bills and CB> down time. Thanks. ... I have 4 megs in my Plus, and have had no problems. I've used a Kensington System Saver Mac since I bought the machine two years ago, and I also leave the machine on all the time to alleviate the power and thermal stresses on the analog board (don't know if it _really_ helps, but that's how I do it anyway). Word has it that: a) yes, the Plus analog board _has_ been beefed up since its introduction (when it was basically the same as a 128K analog board), and b) newer, bigger RAM chips actually draw less power than the ones Apple installed at the factory. So power draw and heat would be less. I hope someone can confirm the above. And the opinion I've gotten from what I've read is, don't accelerate--just buy a newer, faster machine. Accelerators don't always work like you'd think they should. For example, the TSI accelerator boards don't work with Jasmine hard drives. Little niggling things like that will bother you forever. Just buy an LC or whatever. --Adam-- -- Adam Frix via cmhGate - Net 226 fido<=>uucp gateway Col, OH UUCP: ...!osu-cis!n8emr!cmhgate!200.2!Adam.Frix INET: Adam.Frix@p2.f200.n226.z1.FIDONET.ORG
lex@philica.ica.philips.nl (Lex van Sonderen) (09/20/90)
In article <71349.26F6CEFC@cmhgate.FIDONET.ORG> CHARLES BOOS writes: >I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I have heard I installed 4Mb in my Plus one year ago and had only problems since. It had a internal 20Mb HD for 3 years, which draws power from the Mac and without a fan! It was very reliable (no complaints whatsoever) until I upgraded to 4Mb when problems started: the Mac becomes very hot, suddenly stops working, does not start-up until cooled down. It usually restarts when it tries to access the floppy, so when it needs extra power. Removing the back of the housing solves all this, which suggests that extra cooling would solve it. I have now removed the HD and try to work with a 4Mb Plus, but it has only slightly improved (a sudden restart after 2 hours instead of 30 min). I will try a fan now and if that fails I'll buy another machine. Lex van Sonderen lex@philica.philips.com
dave@PRC.Unisys.COM (David Lee Matuszek) (09/21/90)
In article <71349.26F6CEFC@cmhgate.FIDONET.ORG> CHARLES.BOOS@f200.n226.z1.FIDONET.ORG (CHARLES BOOS) writes: >I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I have heard >that the power supply for the plus hasn't been updated since well before >the 528 was introduced resulting in an increased risk of burning out the >power supply. I have already had to replace my power supply once because >of this burnout and I am worried that 4Mb would be too much of a strain on >my current unit. Also, I was considering a portrait monitor(with >accelerator card) and I am worried about the power supply still. Does >anyone have a similar configuration and if you do what problems do you >note? Let me know as I can get the SIMM's and the monitor relatively >cheap but I don't need recurring repair bills and down time. Thanks. > > Charlie ------------ Clip and Save ------------ Clip and Save ------------ The power supplies on the 128K Macs were worthless; the power supplies on the Mac Pluses has been improved to almost marginal. I've had a Mac for six years and have had the power supply replaced three times so far; I understand this is about average. So go ahead and upgrade--you'll be glad you did, when System 7 comes out--and your power supply is going to burn out again, whether you upgrade or not. For power supply burnout, you can have a brand new marginal power supply installed by your Apple dealer for about $145 parts, $40-80 labor. Or you can upgrade the power supply yourself, much more cheaply, and get a decent quality power supply in the bargain. Here's what you need: An upgrade/repair kit for Plus/512K/128K analog board, $51, from Soft Solutions 907 River Road, Suite #98 Eugene, OR 97404 Phone 503/461/1136 Fax 503/461/2005 The kit has the flyback transformer and various capacitors and things, but it doesn't have instructions. For those you need "Macintosh Repair & Upgrade Secrets" by Larry Pina ($35 at Walden Books, $27 from MacWarehouse, 1-800-ALL-MACS). You also need: a soldering pencil and a multimeter, both available cheaply from Radio Shack; and a torx wrench and case cracker (which you need anyway to install 4MB RAM), available from MacWarehouse for, I think, $8). This repair/upgrade is said to be easy, requiring little more than the ability to use a soldering pencil. It doesn't take an EE or other hardware-type person. I admit haven't tried it myself, since I found out about it AFTER my last $220 repair, but I did talk a friend into going this route when his power supply died last month, and it went well for him. If you are not a do-it-yourselfer, Soft Solutions will do the upgrade for you, for a flat fee of $115, and they claim a 72-hour turnaround. Other places can be found to do this even more cheaply, I believe, but you have to do some hunting. Summary: Don't take it to Apple. Save this article because sooner or later you'll want these addresses and phone numbers. -- Disclaimer: I'm just a user. What do I know? -- -- Dave Matuszek (dave@prc.unisys.com) -- Unisys Corp. / Paoli Research Center / PO Box 517 / Paoli PA 19301 -- Any resemblance between my opinions and those of my employer is improbable. < You can put a mouse on an IBM. And you can put a radio on a motorcycle. >
minich@d.cs.okstate.edu (Robert Minich) (09/21/90)
|>I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I have heard |>that the power supply for the plus hasn't been updated since well before |>the 528 was introduced resulting in an increased risk of burning out the |>power supply. I have already had to replace my power supply once because |>of this burnout and I am worried that 4Mb would be too much of a strain on |>my current unit. Also, I was considering a portrait monitor(with |>accelerator card) and I am worried about the power supply still. Does |>anyone have a similar configuration and if you do what problems do you |>note? Let me know as I can get the SIMM's and the monitor relatively |> Charlie | ------------ Clip and Save ------------ Clip and Save ------------ | | The power supplies on the 128K Macs were worthless; the power supplies | on the Mac Pluses has been improved to almost marginal. I've had a | Mac for six years and have had the power supply replaced three times | so far; I understand this is about average. So go ahead and | upgrade--you'll be glad you did, when System 7 comes out--and your | power supply is going to burn out again, whether you upgrade or not. | | For power supply burnout, you can have a brand new marginal power | supply installed by your Apple dealer for about $145 parts, $40-80 | labor. Or you can upgrade the power supply yourself, much more | cheaply, and get a decent quality power supply in the bargain. Here's Just to add another data point: I have an original Mac that has morphed into a 2048KE + SCSI yet the power supply hasn't failed yet. The only preventative action has been to install a fan inside the case (done when it went to a Fat Mac) but it doesn't appear to do a good job of cooling. It's just your average Radio Shack fan attatched to the inside of the case (in "front" of the upper left vent slats) with all-purpose porpoise goop. It doesn't really do much to blow air _out_ of the case but rather seems to create currents inside it. I assume a MacFanny (or whatever it is that fits into the carrying handle) would do a much better job. After attatching the Dove upgrade, I _did_ make sure the voltage coming out of the analog stuff was within the specified range (in the upgrade instructions.) Could this be significant... Now remember that upgrading a Plus *REPLACES* (usually) the SIMMs you have with ones that are likely less power hungry. Mine has additional chips... Just to give a perspective of how crowded the internals are, the Dove 512->2MB upgrade is a board roughly the size of the mother board populated with RAM chips that attatches to the mother board to make a sandwich like arrrangement. Then you add the SCSI board which attatches in the ROM sockets and takes up MORE space. Yet it goes on... Am I just really really lucky??? If my power supply should ever die, I'd be the first to seek out a third party kit to do it myself. But is the high failure rate of Plus analog boards just cruddy circuit design (it must at least be partially) or lack of circulation in the case? -- |_ /| | Robert Minich | |\'o.O' | Oklahoma State University| A fanatic is one who sticks to |=(___)= | minich@a.cs.okstate.edu | his guns -- whether they are | U | - Ackphtth | loaded or not.
brindle (Jack Brindle) (09/22/90)
In article <15050@burdvax.PRC.Unisys.COM> dave@PRC.Unisys.COM (David Lee Matuszek) writes: > >The power supplies on the 128K Macs were worthless; the power supplies >on the Mac Pluses has been improved to almost marginal. I've had a >Mac for six years and have had the power supply replaced three times >so far; I understand this is about average. So go ahead and Interesting. My original Macintosh has been upgraded to the 512KE level. I bought in in early February 1984. It still has the original clock battery (still keeping correct time). It also has its original, unmodified, power supply board. I understand from talking with many people that this is not all that unusual. It appears that a few bad apples (sorry :-)) caused a lot of publicity. In fairness, however, I have worked on my Plus and 512K machines to make sure their power supplies did not fail. Both started to show the wobbles. Beefing up the connections to the yoke connectors took care of the problem. The very early 128K Macs apparently had good power supplies. Apparently some problems were introduced with the usual cost reductions. Why else would later Macs show problems that the early Macs do not? I hope my current IIci gives me as few problems as the original 128K! - Jack Brindle
jimb@silvlis.com (Jim Budler) (09/22/90)
In article <1990Sep20.223007.24779@d.cs.okstate.edu> minich@d.cs.okstate.edu (Robert Minich) writes: >|>I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I have heard >|>that the power supply for the plus hasn't been updated since well before [...] >|>power supply. I have already had to replace my power supply once because >|>of this burnout and I am worried that 4Mb would be too much of a strain on [...] >| ------------ Clip and Save ------------ Clip and Save ------------ >| >| The power supplies on the 128K Macs were worthless; the power supplies >| on the Mac Pluses has been improved to almost marginal. I've had a >| Mac for six years and have had the power supply replaced three times >| so far; I understand this is about average. So go ahead and I have a 6 year old Mac 128 --> Mac 512 --> Mac 512ke --> MacRescue 4meg. >| For power supply burnout, you can have a brand new marginal power >| supply installed by your Apple dealer for about $145 parts, $40-80 >| labor. Or you can upgrade the power supply yourself, much more >| cheaply, and get a decent quality power supply in the bargain. Here's Probably *very* true, but maybe not necessary with a little preventative maintenance. >into the carrying handle) would do a much better job. After attatching the >Dove upgrade, I _did_ make sure the voltage coming out of the analog stuff >was within the specified range (in the upgrade instructions.) Could this be Exactly. My preventative maintenance point #1. My 128 --> 512 and 512 --> 512ke upgrades were performed by an dealer that I *know* has an extremely well qualified service staff (Computer Plus, Sunnyvale, CA) who I am confident does such checks, and who also ran burn-in memory checks after the upgrades. > If my power supply should ever die, I'd be the first to seek out a third >party kit to do it myself. But is the high failure rate of Plus analog >boards just cruddy circuit design (it must at least be partially) or lack >of circulation in the case? You bet, me too. >-- >|_ /| | Robert Minich | My preventative tip #2: The pins on the analog board into which the harness plugs are known to develop cold solder joints over time. If you know how to solder reflow all these solder joints to eliminate the cold solder joints. The pins on the CPU board for the same wiring harnes have the same potential. Do it there also. The pins connecting the flyback transformer to the analog board also. Preventative tip #3: The wiring harness connecting the analog board to the CPU board uses crimp connectors. I found these to have become loose. Use a pointed object to depress the clip holding the crimp connector in the plastic shell. Carefully remove the crimp connector and recrimp or solder it. Do this one crimp connector at a time to avoid losing the proper order. Check and fix both ends. After you put it all back together, *check the voltage again*. I had a half-volt difference between the 5 volts on the CPU board and the 5 volts on the analog board before doing this resoldering! Not after. I had an annoying *flicker* at the top of my screen before doing this. Gone now. My 2 cents. Good Luck, jim -- Jim Budler jimb@silvlis.com +1.408.991.6115 Silvar-Lisco, Inc. 703 E. Evelyn Ave. Sunnyvale, Ca. 94086
davisson@milton.u.washington.edu (Gordon Davisson) (09/22/90)
In article <71349.26F6CEFC@cmhgate.FIDONET.ORG> CHARLES.BOOS@f200.n226.z1.FIDONET.ORG (CHARLES BOOS) writes: >I am thinking of installing 4 Mb of RAM into my mac + but I have heard >that the power supply for the plus hasn't been updated since well before >the 528 was introduced resulting in an increased risk of burning out the >power supply. I have already had to replace my power supply once because >of this burnout and I am worried that 4Mb would be too much of a strain on >my current unit. The Mac Plus power supply has its flakinesses, but it's not nearly as bad as its reputation suggests. Most "power supply failures" are actually video failures, but since the video circuitry is on the power supply board, the power supply gets blamed. Even if the 1MB SIMMs used a little more power, which they don't, the supply has some capacity in reserve. >Also, I was considering a portrait monitor(with >accelerator card) and I am worried about the power supply still. Does >anyone have a similar configuration and if you do what problems do you >note? Let me know as I can get the SIMM's and the monitor relatively >cheap but I don't need recurring repair bills and down time. Thanks. This will use significantly more power, but most such setups come with an auxiliary power supply to run the extra logic. -- Gordon Davisson Westwind Computing (206) 632-8141 4518 University Way NE, Suite 313, Seattle WA 98105
davisson@milton.u.washington.edu (Gordon Davisson) (09/22/90)
In article <670@philica.ica.philips.nl> lex@leest.ica.philips.nl (Lex van Sonderen) writes: >I installed 4Mb in my Plus one year ago and had only problems since. >It had a internal 20Mb HD for 3 years, which draws power from the Mac >and without a fan! It was very reliable (no complaints whatsoever) until >I upgraded to 4Mb when problems started: the Mac becomes very hot, suddenly >stops working, does not start-up until cooled down. It usually restarts >when it tries to access the floppy, so when it needs extra power. >Removing the back of the housing solves all this, which suggests that >extra cooling would solve it. >I have now removed the HD and try to work with a 4Mb Plus, but it has only >slightly improved (a sudden restart after 2 hours instead of 30 min). Sounds to me like you have a bad connection on the cable that carries power to the motherboard. The most likely suspect is the +5V line (the blue wire in the cable that runs from the middle of the analog to the motherboard, in position 6 where the polarizing gap is position 2). Probably the contacts have corroded and/or lost their spring. There's no need to replace the mac because of a problem like this; if you can't fix it yourself and don't know any local component-level repair shops, send it to Soft Solutions (call 503-461-1136). -- Gordon Davisson Westwind Computing (206) 632-8141 4518 University Way NE, Suite 313, Seattle WA 98105