[comp.unix.aix] Report bugs to IBM

3003jalp@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Applied Magnetics) (08/18/90)

In article <3197@awdprime.UUCP> jeffe@sandino.austin.ibm.com (Peter Jeffe 512.823.4091) writes:

>  [ Report your bugs to IBM, they'll get fixed. ]

OK, I'll report them through channels...  but the many layers of
bureaucracy within IBM can oppose stupendous inertial forces.  The
parallel path through Usenet is irreplaceable.

Lest this be perceived as a flame, here is the talisman:  >>  :-)   <<
Whatever happens at IBM Austin, STAY ON THE NET!  We need you.

Disclaimer: the usual...
--P. Asselin, R&D, Applied Magnetics

flatau@handel.CS.ColoState.Edu (flatau) (08/18/90)

I couldn't agree more. We need IBM guys to answer our questions
and have them on the network in addition to "Software defect support"
group. This opinion was strongly voiced during the
"AIX is UNIX" seminar at Colorado State University.
Several users mentioned this during
the seminar of Rober Q. Cordell II (he is a manager of
Compiler Development group at Austin Texas).
This was organized by our local (university) IBM support group.
I am glad to report that he was very sympathetic to the idea,
but he mentioned that IBM have internal (lawyers) problems of full
access to the Internet and these are only very recently being resolved.
But, he even inquired if we would like to have
access to the anonymous FTP login at IBM  with AIX examples,
and "IBM Link"  type reports (this during the private conversation).
He was aware about AIX bashing on the net and need for
the fast IBM response to user software problems. 


Some gossip from this seminar:

1. They work on FORTRAN 90
2. They work on parallel FORTRAN
3. The upgrade to AIX 3.1 is coming in the fall
4. The AIX 3.2 sometimes within 6 months
5. Some rumor about IBM9000 ?!
6. There is a chance that IBM will distribute GNU Emacs again, 
 evidently the whole problem is related to 50 lines of code.
7. They, at Austin, wear jeans! Imagine that.

dcm@toysrus.uucp (dcm) (08/20/90)

In article <6136@hub.ucsb.edu> 3003jalp@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Applied Magnetics) writes:
>In article <3197@awdprime.UUCP> jeffe@sandino.austin.ibm.com (Peter Jeffe 512.823.4091) writes:
>
>>  [ Report your bugs to IBM, they'll get fixed. ]
>
>OK, I'll report them through channels...  but the many layers of
>bureaucracy within IBM can oppose stupendous inertial forces.  The
>parallel path through Usenet is irreplaceable.
>
>Lest this be perceived as a flame, here is the talisman:  >>  :-)   <<
>Whatever happens at IBM Austin, STAY ON THE NET!  We need you.
>
>Disclaimer: the usual...
>--P. Asselin, R&D, Applied Magnetics


	Whatever you do, don't rely on Usenet postings to get bugs fixed!

	If customers go through the normal channels, bugs are guaranteed to
	be fixed ASAP.  Customer-reported bugs are the #1 priority right now.
	Internally reported bugs are #2 (depending, of course, on the bug).

		Craig
--------
	Craig Miller, contractor @ IBM AWD, Austin  (I don't speak for IBM)
	UUCP: ..!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!ibmaus!auschs!toysrus.austin.ibm.com!dcm

	"Just because it works doesn't means it's right, stupid!"
	"You should never install code you do not understand."
	"If you knowningly install broken code, you should be shot.  Period."
	"Programmers have to be accountable for their code."

root@dialog.stgt.sub.org (Christian Motz) (08/21/90)

In article <6136@hub.ucsb.edu> 3003jalp@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Applied Magnetics) writes:
>In article <3197@awdprime.UUCP> jeffe@sandino.austin.ibm.com (Peter Jeffe 512.823.4091) writes:
>
>>  [ Report your bugs to IBM, they'll get fixed. ]
>
>OK, I'll report them through channels...  but the many layers of
>bureaucracy within IBM can oppose stupendous inertial forces.  The
>parallel path through Usenet is irreplaceable.

Hear hear! Reporting a bug to IBM and getting it fixed by them can  be
a very frustrating,  tiresome,  not  to  mention  lengthy  process.  I
might illustrate that using one of the problems I  had  at  work  some
time ago.
   Every time I used Distributed Services message queues on our RT PC,
things would break after a certain amount of time,  i. e.  the  system
would come down with a panic and a kernel dump.
   No problem, I thought, I'll  just  call  my  friendly  IBM  support
people, and have them open up a problem record for  me.  This  I  did,
and, knowing that they would be needing it, sent the  kernel  dump  to
them even before they specifically requested it, thus saving some time
in the process.
   Then the fun started. They called back, basically to ask  me " what
did you do to provoke this" -- which, of course, is the wrong question
to ask. After all, it isn't *MY* fault that the kernel  dumps,  or  is
it?. It took some time  to  explain  to  them  that  the  machine  was
crashing completely, with only the panic message displayed.
   Five minutes later, they started  again. " What  kind  of  messages
indicate that you have a problem?" was the question. At that  point  I
was close to the boiling point -- after all, I had just  explained  to
them what had happened, and if they would have the slightest idea what
UN*X is all about, they would have gotten the point.
   A couple of phone calls later, they finally seemed to have an  idea
what I was talking about -- but now they acted as  if  they  couldn' t
believe there was a problem. They obviously wanted to get it confirmed
by someone of their own company. Thus, they sent me two SE's that  did
nothing else but watch while I reproduced the problem. Only  then  did
they believe that the problem really existed.
   Meanwhile, they had received the tape with  the  kernel  dump ( and
were very surprised that I had sent that on my  own  initiative),  but
they needed more (of course --  I  had  expected  that,  and  there' s
nothing wrong with it). Ok, I said, give me a modem number, I'll  send
it to you. They almost said "what's a modem?" ;-) --  naturally,  they
didn't have one.
   Ok, I said,  if  you  could  find  me  someone  at  Austin  with  a
Trailblazer, I'll send it to them directly (since IBM Germany would do
this anyway with all the stuff they got), regardless of the  DM  50,--
or so in transatlantic phone charges this would result in. "Uhm,  I' m
not sure we can do this ..." was the reply.
   All in all, this cost two days -- and remember, this was  only  the
fight with IBM Germany. I do not doubt that IBM has some great  people
at AWD in Austin and Palo Alto; as a matter of fact, I know  it  since
we have them here on the net. But as long as IBM  does  not  have  the
people for proper UN*X support, we need the contact to the development
people, and we need it *BAD*.

>Lest this be perceived as a flame, here is the talisman:  >>  :-)   <<
>Whatever happens at IBM Austin, STAY ON THE NET!  We need you.

Amen! Ooops -- forgot for a second that I am an atheist ... ;-)


Overheard at an AIX V 3 Installation Workshop:

Question from Participant: Will IBM Germany hook up to USENET sometime
soon? Answer from IBM Representative: What's "USENET" ... ?

--
Christian Motz                                root@dialog.stgt.sub.org

root@dialog.stgt.sub.org (Christian Motz) (08/24/90)

It has been brought to my attention  that  my  previous  article  with
regard   to   the   subject   (2427@dialog.stgt.sub.org)   might    be
misinterpreted by some people as a  personal  attack  on  the  support
people of IBM Germany. Actually, this was  not  my  intention  when  I
wrote the article. As a matter of fact,  it  is  directed  at  a  much
higher level than that -- management.
   After all, the procedures used for reporting bugs and getting  them
fixed are not made up by the people who actually provide  the  service
to you. They do have to adhere to the procedures devised by management
-- unfortunately. I have been assured that IBM is  trying  to  improve
its service and, with regard to the relatively short time that IBM has
been involved with UN*X, I will give them the benefit of the doubt.  I
would also at  this  point  like  to  thank  Mr.  Spielmann  from  IBM
Germany's support crew for pointing out to me that my original article
could be easily misunderstood.

--
Christian Motz                                root@dialog.stgt.sub.org