jmorton@euler.Berkeley.EDU (John Morton) (09/23/89)
Every few days when starting rn I am hit with a series of new newsgroup queries, e.g. "rec.veeblefetzer Do you wish to add? [yn]" There are over a hundred of these, mostly local newsgroups set up for various classes. I have typed "n" to these same newsgroups many times over the last year, but the query returns about once a week to bug me. I am a frequent newsreader, so I know that rn is not just putting me up to date intelligently. One person has suggested saying "y" to them all, putting them at the end of my .newsrc, then unsubscribing. This would seem tedious and unnecessary. The unwanted query occurs more or less at random. It is somewhat more likely to happen if I have been gone awhile, but sometimes occurs 2 or 3 logins in a row. Ideas? "Down John Morton M.E. Machine Shop Down in the basement jmorton@euler.berkeley.edu Etcheverry Hall We hear the sound of machines..." Univ. of Calif.
epsilon@wet.UUCP (Eric P. Scott) (09/24/89)
In article <17528@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> jmorton@euler.berkeley.edu (John Morton) writes: >Every few days when starting rn I am hit with a series of new >newsgroup queries, e.g. "rec.veeblefetzer Do you wish to add? [yn]" >There are over a hundred of these, mostly local newsgroups set up >for various classes. I have typed "n" to these same newsgroups >many times over the last year, but the query returns about once >a week to bug me. Sorry, but this is the way it's supposed to be. The only time you want to answer "n" is when the newsgroup is obviously bogus (which shouldn't happen if your news administrator is even semi- competent). Just unsubscribe to anything you don't want to read, and it won't bother you. -=EPS=-
wcs) (09/25/89)
In article <586@wet.UUCP> epsilon@wet.UUCP (Eric P. Scott) writes:
]The only time you want to answer "n" is when the newsgroup is obviously bogus
](which shouldn't happen if your news administrator is even semi-competent).
IMHO, I was a rather competent news administrator (my machine has
since retired), but bogus newsgroups would get created there anyway. Why?
Because I ran one of the few systems in the known universe that
didn't use the MANUALLY option - my machine would accept any
newgroup and rmgroup requests that came across the network, because
I considered it to be better policy to accept incoming control
messages than to have to do it all by hand. Part of my motivation
was the Great Newsgroup Renaming, part of it was a heavy travel
schedule, and part of it was admittedly to avoid reading all the
mail about how alt.weemba.stupid had been created and destroyed
six times that day. But part of it was a hold-over to the early
days when netnews was a cooperative venture, where anybody could
create a newsgroup when they wanted to, and things worked ok.
Netnews works because people are willing to work together, and
people are willing to tolerate occasional silly behavior from other
people without turning into flame wars. A little patience and
constructive cooperation from both users and administrators goes a
long way toward keeping the net working well. When news volume
reached 1 Megabyte/day, a lot of people started predicting the
Immanent Death of USENET.
But it's still here, because of a lot of hard work from a lot of
people, both administrators like Gene Spafford and Rick Adams
and software-writers like Larry Wall (author of rn).
Who knows? Maybe you could be next!
Bill
--
# Bill Stewart, AT&T Bell Labs 4M312 Holmdel NJ 201-949-0705 ho95c.att.com!wcs
# also found at 201-271-4712 tarpon.att.com!wcs Somerset 4C423 Corp. Park 3
# More Colombians die from American tobacco than Americans from Colombian coke.clewis@eci386.uucp (Chris Lewis) (09/26/89)
In article <17528@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> jmorton@euler.berkeley.edu (John Morton) writes: >Every few days when starting rn I am hit with a series of new >newsgroup queries, e.g. "rec.veeblefetzer Do you wish to add? [yn]" >There are over a hundred of these, mostly local newsgroups set up >for various classes. I have typed "n" to these same newsgroups >many times over the last year, but the query returns about once >a week to bug me. One of the minor nits with rn is the fact that "Do you wish to add?" questions isn't "subscribing to a newsgroup", but is rather "should it be mentioned in .newsrc?" Rn simply compares the size of the active file to what it used to be, and if it's changed, starts looking groups in .newsrc that aren't in active and vice-versa. Hence, if you reply "n" to the "Do you wish to add?" message, the newsgroup will not be put in your .newsrc, but the very next time a new newsgroup comes along causing rn to search again, you will be asked again for the same newsgroup plus the one that triggered the search *this* time. Ideally, rn should automatically insert *all* new newsgroups in .newsrc, and then ask if you wish to subscribe (ala ":" or "!" in .newsrc). Until rn is fixed... *always* reply "y", and unsubscribe if you ever get prompted to read the newsgroup. S'not hard for the first part - hit space twice. The second? Just say "u". -- Chris Lewis, R.H. Lathwell & Associates: Elegant Communications Inc. UUCP: {uunet!mnetor, utcsri!utzoo}!lsuc!eci386!clewis Phone: (416)-595-5425
epsilon@wet.UUCP (Eric P. Scott) (09/26/89)
In article <4173@cbnewsh.ATT.COM> wcs@cbnewsh.ATT.COM (Bill Stewart 201-949-0705 ho95c.att.com!wcs) writes: >IMHO, I was a rather competent news administrator (my machine has >since retired), but bogus newsgroups would get created there anyway. Why? >Because I ran one of the few systems in the known universe that >didn't use the MANUALLY option - my machine would accept any >newgroup and rmgroup requests that came across the network, because >I considered it to be better policy to accept incoming control >messages than to have to do it all by hand. ... > ... But part of it was a hold-over to the early >days when netnews was a cooperative venture, where anybody could >create a newsgroup when they wanted to, and things worked ok. Those days are gone. Do you believe in majority rule? Well over 50% of the newgroups that hit my site are BOGUS. People try to unmoderate moderated groups, C News goes apesh*t, alt groups come and go within the span of a few hours, even a few "let's see what happens if I deliberately try to create a bogus newsgroup(!)" come through. It's much easier to drop the losers and grant the few legitimate ones... especially when inews mails me a shell script to do it. It's really not a lot of effort. The only "problem" is when a newgroup goes out and is immediately followed by "Hi, this is the first message to this group and it's really important that you read what's here." Those go straight into junk. And it's no doubt happening on a lot of sites. C'mon guys, I know how excited you are to finally have soc.culture.jedr after weeks of discussion and voting. Another day or two to allow the group to actually get created won't kill you. -=EPS=-
msc@cbnewsc.ATT.COM (michael.s.cross) (10/03/89)
In article <1989Sep25.213655.21377@eci386.uucp> clewis@eci386.UUCP (Chris Lewis) writes: >Ideally, rn should automatically insert *all* new newsgroups in .newsrc, and >then ask if you wish to subscribe (ala ":" or "!" in .newsrc). > >Until rn is fixed... *always* reply "y", and unsubscribe if you ever get >prompted to read the newsgroup. S'not hard for the first part - hit space >twice. The second? Just say "u". This, of course, leaves you with a huge .newsrc file (which can't be edited). Our version of 'rn' still marks crossposted articles read, even if the other newsgroup is unsubscribed to. (ex: article in rec.music.misc is read. The article was crossposted to alt.rock-n-roll, so that number is marked as read. Unfortunatly, I unsubscribed to alt.rock-n-roll, but 'rn' doesn't look to see if there is a ":" or a "!" on the newsgroup line.) After about a week of marking one article here, another article there, the line gets over 512 characters long, and our 'vi' editor barfs because of "line too long". Another problem with leaving all the lines in the .newsrc file appears when you have a News-server machine and are limited to 300 blocks of storage ... one or two KILL files and you're out of room. Mike (is someone collecting 'rn' bugs???) -- Michael S. Cross (msc@ihc.att.com) (312)-982-2018 AT&T Bell Laboratories, 5555 Touhy Ave., Skokie, IL 60077 ________________________To Live is to risk Dying______________________________
wcs) (10/04/89)
In article <3599@cbnewsc.ATT.COM> msc@cbnewsc.ATT.COM (michael.s.cross,sk,) writes:
]This, of course, leaves you with a huge .newsrc file (which can't be edited).
]Our version of 'rn' still marks crossposted articles read, even if the other
]newsgroup is unsubscribed to. (ex: article in rec.music.misc is read. The
]article was crossposted to alt.rock-n-roll, so that number is marked as read.
]Unfortunatly, I unsubscribed to alt.rock-n-roll, but 'rn' doesn't look to see
]if there is a ":" or a "!" on the newsgroup line.) After about a week of
]marking one article here, another article there, the line gets over 512
]characters long, and our 'vi' editor barfs because of "line too long".
Depending on your reading patterns, this may happen to you,
but there are several easy workarounds:
1) Use emacs instead of vi :-).
2) Edit your .newsrc more frequently, so the lines don't get too long.
3) Use sed to trim long lines:
sed 's/! 1.....*[,-]/! 1-/' .newsrc >.newsrc.new
]Another problem with leaving all the lines in the .newsrc file appears when
]you have a News-server machine and are limited to 300 blocks of storage ...
]one or two KILL files and you're out of room.
(This is a local problem)
Make sure you don't have a lot of .article.* and letter.*
files around using up space (do ls -a to see them.)
One problem is that each directory and KILL file uses up at
least one block - 500 KILL files would require at least 1000
blocks total space, if you really read that many newsgroups.
--
# Bill Stewart, AT&T Bell Labs 4M312 Holmdel NJ 201-949-0705 ho95c.att.com!wcs
# also found at 201-271-4712 tarpon.att.com!wcs Somerset 4C423 Corp. Park 3
# More Colombians die from American tobacco than Americans from Colombian coke.r4@cbnews.ATT.COM (richard.r.grady..jr) (10/04/89)
In article <4470@cbnewsh.ATT.COM> wcs@cbnewsh.ATT.COM (Bill Stewart 201-949-0705 ho95c.att.com!wcs) writes: >In article <3599@cbnewsc.ATT.COM> msc@cbnewsc.ATT.COM (michael.s.cross,sk,) writes: >] [...] >]Another problem with leaving all the lines in the .newsrc file appears when >]you have a News-server machine and are limited to 300 blocks of storage ... >]one or two KILL files and you're out of room. > (This is a local problem) > Make sure you don't have a lot of .article.* and letter.* > files around using up space (do ls -a to see them.) To clean out old files of this sort, I put the following command in my Unix .profile file. find $HOME \( -name .article.[1-9]\* -o -name .letter.[1-9]\* \ -o -name dead.art\* -o -name dead.let\* \) \ -mtime +7 -exec rm -f {} \; & (The "-mtime +7" specifies "last mod time was more than 7 days ago". You may want to adjust the number. The trailing "&" runs the command in the background, while .profile finishes and I start up "rn". ) -- Dick Grady r_r_grady@att.com ...!att!mvuxd!r4