csbrkaac@ARIEL.UNM.EDU (Lazlo Nibble) (07/07/89)
Comments are requested on the CD-boot "Kate Bush Live At Hammersmith", which
appears to contain the audio track from the concert video plus three bonus
tracks (RUtH, This Woman's Work, and one other if I remember right). Is
the sound dubbed off the new digital-remastered laserdisc of the Hammersmith
video? $39 or so seems to be the asking price, and I *did* like the music
of the concert video, so if the sound is a clear and solid I will probably
pick it up . . . but should I?
Hmmm.
Lazlo (csbrkaac@ariel.unm.edu)
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"I'll check on that," muttered Lazlo, who was barely visible through the
greyish haze issuing from his 'frop-filled pipe. "Now bend over."tim@toad.COM (Tim Maroney) (07/08/89)
In article <8907070824.AA17181@ariel.unm.edu> Lazlo wrote: >Comments are requested on the CD-boot "Kate Bush Live At Hammersmith", which >appears to contain the audio track from the concert video plus three bonus >tracks (RUtH, This Woman's Work, and one other if I remember right). Is >the sound dubbed off the new digital-remastered laserdisc of the Hammersmith >video? $39 or so seems to be the asking price, and I *did* like the music >of the concert video, so if the sound is a clear and solid I will probably >pick it up . . . but should I? I think you already know how I feel about knowingly buying a bootleg, so I'll leave that issue alone. My question is, is this a bootleg? I have what appears to be a legitimate import edition of this CD. It claims to be from "Neutral Zone, Digital Recordings, 140 Rue de Rennes, 75006 Paris France". The identifying mark on the spine and on the disk is "NZCD 89010". It has the usual "Compact Disc Digital Audio" logo that seems to appear on almost all compact discs, as well as an AAD marking and a notice that "All rights of the producer and of the owner of the work reproduced reserved. Unauthorized copying, hiring, lending, public performance and broadcasting of this record prohibited." The insert and back cover contain high quality graphics, specifically pictures of KT, which appear to have been reproduced from negatives. There is not a hint of amateurism or knock-off about the whole package. I haven't seen any other CD bootlegs, but the LP bootlegs I've seen were generally pretty shoddy in packaging and bore no traceable identifying marks. I believe this is a legitimate CD edition of the old "Kate Bush Live" LP, with three bonus tracks. They are, as mentioned, live 1988 recordings of "Running Up That Hill" and "Breathing", and a 1988 studio version of "This Woman's Work". If there is a bootleg edition, it is probably a knock-off of this. On this edition, the sound is quite clear throughout. I don't know what quality it would have on a bootleg. And finally, I purchased this record from Marin Compact Disc in San Anselmo, a store which specializes in import CDs, and which does not stock anything that looks like bootlegs to me. The price was thirty dollars, I believe. -- Tim Maroney, Mac Software Consultant, sun!hoptoad!tim, tim@toad.com Postal: 424 Tehama, SF CA 94103; Phone: (415) 495-2934 "The negro slaves of the South are the happiest, and, in some sense, the freest people in the world. The children and the aged and infirm work not at all, and yet have all the comforts and neccessaries of life provided for them." -- George Fitzhugh, CANNIBALS ALL! OR, SLAVES WITHOUT MASTERS, 1857
datta@VACS.UWP.WISC.EDU (David Datta) (07/08/89)
In article <8907080243.AA13991@hop.toad.com> tim@toad.COM (Tim Maroney) writes: >My question is, is this a bootleg? It certainly Is a Bootleg >I have what appears to be a legitimate import edition of this CD. > [comments about disc deleted] > "Compact Disc Digital Audio" logo that seems to appear on >almost all compact discs, as well as an AAD marking and a notice that >"All rights of the producer and of the owner of the work reproduced >reserved. Unauthorized copying, hiring, lending, public performance >and broadcasting of this record prohibited." Did you happen to notice that there is NO mention of KT on the disc itself? My copy says "Kathy, Live From Wuthering Heights" Anyone who manufactures a CD that is up to standards can use the logo, but then they probably don't really care do they? Hmmm, re-read that statement again, it doesn't really say anything does it? "all rights of the producer and of the owner of the work reproduced reserved" If you have EVER looked at authorized reprints they will have the source of the recording all over with copyrights and messages about how the rights to the music are liscensed from EMI or Kate Bush. The royalties from the "Running Up The Hill" cut are supposed to go to Amnesty International, and even on "The Secret Policeman's Third Ball", it is published by Kate Bush Music Ltd Courtesy of EMI Records Ltd. Good luck on finding any mention of that on the Neutral Zone CD >There is not a hint of >amateurism or knock-off about the whole package. I haven't seen any Who says that bootlegs have to be amaturisitc? I HAVE seen other CD bootlegs, they seem to be in much better shape than LP bootlegs I have seen. All it takes is a coupla bucks to make a negative from a publicity shot and bingo, there are your "professional" looking so-called liner notes. Or hadn't you noticed that the back pictures were fuzzy and KT has fangs on the top left picture. >If there is a bootleg edition, it is probably a knock-off of this. On >this edition, the sound is quite clear throughout. I don't know what >quality it would have on a bootleg. And finally, I purchased this Well, the first 12 tracks came from the 'Live at Hammersmith Odeon' Video, what a good place to get a clean HI-FI master from.... >a store which >specializes in import CDs, and which does not stock anything that looks >like bootlegs to me. Well, guess you have to look more carefully, an address on the disc does not an official release make. If you go back there again, look for "Pink Floyd, Bytes of the Talisman", gee, looks familiar doesn't it hmmm the CD has no mention of Pink Floyd, hmmm the discs says "The Archetectural Abdabs - One of these Days", gee, weren't they called that once a looong time ago? Wow, look at that artwork, looks professional. Well, look in any book about Pink Floyd, see any mention of this album? I have read how you feel on copyrights, I hope that you go out and BUY the Hammersmith Odeon video, at present, thats the "official" release, Heck, I bought it, I prefer watching the video. Sorry you got skinned, this disc is one of the reasons that bootlegs are illegal, people might think that the release is benifiting the artist, I'll bet that any profit from this disc don't arrive anywhere near KT. Any official release will be widely announced, there is no way that an artist like KT could possibly release an album, even re-issue an album especially one with "bonus tracks" without publicity. -Dave Datta
csbrkaac@ARIEL.UNM.EDU (Lazlo Nibble) (07/08/89)
>> Me > Tim Maroney >> Comments are requested on the CD-boot "Kate Bush Live At Hammersmith". > > I think you already know how I feel about knowingly buying a bootleg, > so I'll leave that issue alone. In general, I agree with you . . . but since I already own a (legitimate) copy of the concert video I don't see *too* much of a moral problem with buying this disc (aside from the obvious fact that someone else is unauthorizedly making money off Kate's work). > My question is, is this a bootleg? . . . There is not a hint of > amateurism or knock-off about the whole package. I haven't seen any > other CD bootlegs, but the LP bootlegs I've seen were generally pretty > shoddy in packaging and bore no traceable identifying marks. I agree that it's a slick package, but the store where I saw this disc also had a Neutral Zone release of Prince's _Black Album_ on CD, and I think we're all aware of the legal status of *that* disc. There were also about a dozen other NZCD's that were obviously bootlegs -- live Led Zep and G'n'R, for example, as well as *lots* of live Beatles stuff. Neutral Zone are clearly bootleggers, and this disc is *definitely* a bootleg. > I believe this is a legitimate CD edition of the old "Kate Bush Live" > LP, with three bonus tracks. They are, as mentioned, live 1988 > recordings of "Running Up That Hill" and "Breathing", and a 1988 > studio version of "This Woman's Work". There never was a "Kate Bush Live" LP. The _Live On Stage_ EP had only four tracks, as opposed to this disc's 12 + 3 bonus tracks, and has never been released legitimately on CD. (If it had been, it would have been on EMI, just like the rest of Kate's catalog.) > If there is a bootleg edition, it is probably a knock-off of this. On > this edition, the sound is quite clear throughout. I don't know what > quality it would have on a bootleg. The sound quality would depend on the source of the recording, and if dubbed off the newly-remastered laserdisc of _Live At Hammersmith_ the sound quality of a boot could be just as good as a legit release. All three of the bonus tracks in question are available legitimately on CD either here or in the UK ("Breathing" on the UK COMIC RELIEF disc, "Running Up That Hill" from THE SECRET POLICEMAN'S THIRD BALL, and "This Woman's Work" from the SHE'S HAVING A BABY soundtrack). I'm afraid you *do* own a bootleg, Tim. (If, knowing that, you're interested in getting rid of it, let me know. :-) Lazlo (csbrkaac@ariel.unm.edu) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "I could stand and talk about industrialization and men's fashions all day long, but work must intrude . . ."
tim@toad.COM (Tim Maroney) (07/10/89)
In article <3261@csd4.milw.wisc.edu> David Datta wrote: >Who says that bootlegs have to be amaturisitc? I HAVE seen other CD >bootlegs, they seem to be in much better shape than LP bootlegs I have >seen. Thanks for the information. This is the first CD bootleg I've seen. The LP bootlegs I've seen were in white cardboard jackets with ineptly reproduced sheets of paper in at most one color glued to the front and back. I suppose the greater expense of manufacturing CDs practically guarantees that the bootleggers will have more resources to expend on packaging. In the future I'll be considerably more cautious when purchasing CDs from unknown labels. It's not at all unusual to find imports that are not available in the States (I have lots of European Barking Pumpkin Zappa releases that Ryko hasn't gotten to yet, for instance). From now on I won't take the lack of amateurism and the presence of phony label identifications as evidence of authenticity of an import. >Or hadn't you noticed that the back pictures >were fuzzy and KT has fangs on the top left picture. No, I hadn't examined the pictures with this microscopic level of scrutiny. But you're certainly correct. >I have read how you feel on copyrights, I hope that you go out and BUY >the Hammersmith Odeon video, at present, thats the "official" release, >Heck, I bought it, I prefer watching the video. One of my first videotape purchases was this video. I thought it was dreadful -- KT can't dance, can't act, and certainly can't choreograph. But we've been over this before here. In any case, I traded the video in for credit at my favorite used CDs, LPs, and videos store. >Sorry you got skinned, >this disc is one of the reasons that bootlegs are illegal, people might >think that the release is benifiting the artist, I'll bet that any >profit from this disc don't arrive anywhere near KT. Clearly so. This seems to be a new thing, bootlegs which try to look as much as possible like authentic releases to fool ethical buyers. Pretty scummy. But I don't intend to get bitten twice. >Any official release will be widely announced, there is no way that an >artist like KT could possibly release an album, even re-issue an album >especially one with "bonus tracks" without publicity. That's not necessarily true. There could be overseas releases that escaped publicity in the States, as frequently happens with other artists. Now, I've got to figure out what to do about the guy who offered me a cassette of KT's B-sides. Does anyone know if this is a legitimate release? It has a white paper insert with hand-lettered track identifications. :-) -- Tim Maroney, Mac Software Consultant, sun!hoptoad!tim, tim@toad.com Postal: 424 Tehama, SF CA 94103; Phone: (415) 495-2934 These are not my opinions, those of my ex-employers, my old schools, my relatives, my friends, or really any rational person whatsoever.