drezac@cis.ohio-state.edu (Duane L. Rezac) (11/30/89)
I'm looking for information on the compatability of Christianity and Freemasonry. I have a relative that is in Masonry, and I know that sometime in the near future we will have a conversation about it, So I'm starting to do some research. I would like to hear comments on this subject from both sides, preferably with Scripture references. Duane L. Rezac dsacg1!dcscg1!drezac drezac@dcscg1.dcsc.dla.mil [I am not a Mason, so I'm in no position to make detailed comments, but let me at least caution that it may be hard to developed a position about "Masonry" as a whole. There are a number of traditions that have masonic roots. Some of them have rather different attitudes towards religion and Christianity. It may be more fruitful to ask what kind of practices might or might not cause trouble, so as to help someone decide whether their participation in a particular group was appropriate for them. --clh]
thompson@athos.rutgers.edu (Marge Thompson) (12/04/89)
In response to your inquiry about masonry, I am involved with the women's group called Order of the Eastern Star. Most of the ritualistic ceremonies in both masonry and ES are based on the bible. Masons use more of the OT than the Eastern Star. We use both books of the bible. I do not feel qualified or at liberty to discuss this at length, but there are some excellent books on the subject that explain what masonry is about. I must tell you, however, that I personally have found some satisfaction in the good we have done for people in need. However, it is, by no means, a substitute for my church life. It probably enhances my beliefs, but it is in my Church that I find my most satisfaction. I have served as Worthy Matron (president) of my chapter and I also served as President of the Past Matrons and Past Patrons Association of the State. I believe my most satisfying year in star life was during this time because I was in a position to make some vital decisions to help people in need, not only financially, but with things they needed, i.e. wheelchairs, canes, etc. etc. This help is not just given to members, but to non-members. The masons are involved with children's hospitals, MD, burn centers, etc. I can only tell you that you must belong in a Supreme Being in order to belong to either masonry or Eastern Star. Your best bet would be to go to a local bookstore and thumb thru some books. You will find books pro and con. It will prove to be interesting research. Marge Thompson
conan@wish-bone.berkeley.edu (David Cruz-Uribe) (12/07/89)
For what it is worth on the subject of Masons: All Catholics are forbidden to belong to the Masons or any allied organization. The reasons for this ban have to do with the history of European Freemasonry. Masonic lodges in Europe had a sinister edge which often combined with anti-clerical politics. Numerous conspiracy theories have been woven around the Masons because of this--I don't buy any of them. This doesn't say much about Masons in America though. Perhaps more germane is that the Anglican church in England recently issued a statement (do they call them encyclicals?) questioning on theological grounds the propriety of Christians being Masons. This caused quite a stir as a member of the royal family is a leading Mason. Does any- one out there know exactly what the statement said? Yours in Christ, David Cruz-Uribe, SFO
jhpb@lancia.garage.att.com (12/11/89)
All Catholics are forbidden to belong to the Masons or any allied
organization. The reasons for this ban have to do with the history of
European Freemasonry. Masonic lodges in Europe had a sinister edge
which often combined with anti-clerical politics. Numerous conspiracy
theories have been woven around the Masons because of this--I don't
buy any of them.
The ban also has to do with what Freemasonic principles are all about.
They're inimical to Catholicism. According to the classic papal
encyclical on Freemasonry, Humanum Genus, Freemasonry is based on an
error called Naturalism. Basically, a denial that the supernatural
exists.
From an instruction of the Holy Office, May 10, 1884:
Status: RO
... it is especially certain that Freemasonry and other sects of this
kind which plot against the Church and lawful powers... are condemned
by automatic excommunication.
If you read the Papal encyclicals and various documents of the Holy
Office carefully, you will find that they clearly espouse the idea that,
as an organization, Freemasonry conspires against the Catholic Church.
Unfortunately, there is little serious history available in English that
has a Catholic viewpoint. I might suggest some of the books by Fr.
Fahey on the subject of Freemasonry and Naturalism.
I sympathize with the person who asked for information, but I'm not sure
what can be done at a practical level. Few Americans are of a mindset
that they will or will not do something just because of abstract
principles. The Mason involved probably sees little more than a social
club in Freemasonry.
Joe BuehlerMATH1H3@uhvax1.uh.edu (David H. Wagner) (12/15/89)
In article <Dec.11.03.48.17.1989.23480@athos.rutgers.edu>, jhpb@lancia.garage.att.com writes: > > The ban also has to do with what Freemasonic principles are all about. > They're inimical to Catholicism. According to the classic papal > encyclical on Freemasonry, Humanum Genus, Freemasonry is based on an > error called Naturalism. Basically, a denial that the supernatural > exists. Really, you ought to say that Freemasonry is antithetic to Christianity. Of course, if you believe that the Roman Catholics Church is *the* Christian church, then your statement would make more sense to me. As I understand it, Freemasons, in theory, believe that all religions teach an aproximation of the true faith, but that they of course have true understanding. They accept the Bible, the Koran, and other holy books as revelations of God, whom they call the Great Architect of the Universe. In a sense Freemasonry is a precursor to the modern ecumenical movement. Lutherans have traditionally taken a strong stand against Freemasonry, and not permitted their members to belong to the Masons or similar lodges. Some Lutheran churches have retreated from this stand, but not the WELS or ELS, David H. Wagner My opinions and beliefs are completely separated from my employer's lack thereof. [I am very reluctant to continue a discussion of someone else's beliefs based on rumors of what they believe. Marge Thompson seems to be the closest we have to a Mason (Eastern Star), and I guarantee you that she would not be involved in anything even slightly anti-Christian. On the other hand, there have certainly been Masonic groups ranging from free-thinkers to non-Christian. --clh]
tom@dvnspc1.Dev.Unisys.COM (Tom Albrecht) (12/21/89)
Our moderator writes: > > [I am very reluctant to continue a discussion of someone else's > beliefs based on rumors of what they believe. Marge Thompson seems to > be the closest we have to a Mason (Eastern Star), and I guarantee you > that she would not be involved in anything even slightly > anti-Christian. On the other hand, there have certainly been Masonic > groups ranging from free-thinkers to non-Christian. --clh] Our denomination (Presbyterian Church in America) has recently done a study of Freemasonry based on overtures from several presbyteries. Since the old Southern Presbyterian Church from which we sprang had many Freemasons as not only members, but also elders and deacons, we thought it important to investigate. There are many Freemasons in the PCA, especially in the South. Our basic determination was that Freemasonry is not compatible with biblical Christianity and that Freemasons in the PCA should be counseled to reconsider their affiliation. Much of this was based on our definition of "religion" and whether Freemasonry constitutes one. Since Freemasons admit to rituals and rites in which prayer and worship are offered, it appears that it could be considered a religion. The question then becomes is it biblical (i.e. Christian) religion. Part of the problem is that for most folks, Freemasonry is a cultural sort of thing, like being a Rotarian. Somebody belongs because their daddy belonged whose daddy belonged ... . And in many places Freemasonry is like the country club where folks go to "network". I've found in talking to folks who are Freemasons that most don't really understand the history and "theology" of the group. Freemasons are no different than most church members when it comes to understanding their "doctrine". There is the inner circle, maybe 10%, who are the activists, and then there is everyone else. Eastern Star may be another matter. My wife was in Rainbows as a girl, and my mother-in-law is an Eastern Star. My wife thinks that Eastern Star may be more Christian in its orientation than Freemasonry. However, she would counsel against anyone joining any of these secret societies. If anyone is interested in a copy of my denomination's study, I would be happy to mail it to them. -- Tom Albrecht [I'd be interested in your reaction to the official Masonic response, contained in a later posting within this group. (Those considering responding to this message might want to look at it first.) I could imagine any of - that you simply don't believe it - that you believe it is inappropriate for a group to speak on religious issues even as far as requiring belief in a supreme being (which they say they do) without being explicitly Christian - that you find some activity that they think is non-religious which you believe is so close to religion that it should only be done in an explicitly Christian context. Just out of curiosity, what role did your Masonic members play in your study? --clh]
PTREI@asgard.bbn.com (12/23/89)
> hedrick@cs.rutgers.edu writes: > [I'd be interested in your reaction to the official Masonic response, ^^^^^^^^ The only portion of my message which anyone could call "official" is the quoted pamphlet. The rest is mine. > [...] I could imagine any of > - that you simply don't believe it > - that you believe it is inappropriate for a group to speak on > religious issues even as far as requiring belief in a supreme > being (which they say they do) without being explicitly Christian > - that you find some activity that they think is non-religious which > you believe is so close to religion that it should only be done > in an explicitly Christian context. Well, I can imagine at least one other: - Accept it. Realize that your negative estimation of Freemasonry is based on ignorance and misinformation, and modify it accordingly. For those who wish to learn more about Masonry (even if only to argue from a position of knowledge :-), I recommend two books: "The Craft: A History of English Freemasonry." by John Hamill. Crucible '86. ISBN 0-85030-460-1. This scholarly history is well-written and very readable, but confines itself to England. It includes an interesting chapter about attacks on Masonry. "The Builders" by Rev. Joseph Fort Newton, Macoy Publishing and Masonic Supply Co., Richmond, VA. ISBN 0-88053-045-6. Originally published in 1914, it's still in print, and in many libraries. This is a somewhat tougher read, but goes much more into the religious aspects of Freemasonry from the point of view of a Christian minister (albeit in 1914). go with God (and merry Christmas), Peter Trei Senior Steward Wilder Lodge AF&AM Leominster, MA. ptrei@asgard.bbn.com Behold, how good and pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity! - Psalm 133 [disclaimer: The above are MY opinions, and do not neccesarily represent those of my employer or any Grand Lodge]