[soc.religion.christian] Paul and moral theology

hedrick@geneva.rutgers.edu (02/05/90)

Dave Davis asks how to deal with Paul's ethics, specifically his
comments on women.

The conclusion I've come to after going around this issue many times
in the past is that Paul didn't necessarily tell us (and may not have
seen himself) all the implications of his principles.  Let explain the
sense in which I mean that.  I am not an inerrantist, but I am
committed to Biblical authority.  The model I've come to is that Paul
was inspired, both directly and because he had good sources for what
Jesus said; but that when he gives advice in particular situations it
doesn't come with a guarantee that it's appropriate to use for our
time without careful consideration.  

In this case, it seems to me that his "neither Jew nor Greek, male nor
female" is the basic principle.  In fact he seems to have carried this
out most of the time.  If you look at his salutations, it seems that
he had warm relations with females who certainly look like Christian
leaders.  I Cor 11 seems to imply that women are speaking publically
in worship.

Yet we see passages like I Cor 14:33ff, which says that a woman should
not speak in church.  My conclusion is that his motivation here is
avoiding scandal by sticking with current social standards, rather
that anything intrinsic to the faith.  Note that he doesn't give any
reason that involves the Christian faith.  He simply says "that's the
way it's done in all churches, and even in Jewish practice."  We know
already that Paul (and for that matter Jesus) does not tend to suggest
changes in social institutions.  He's far more concerned with guiding
people to live appropriately within them.  This makes sense, because
at that time Christians had no chance of changing them.  Paul advises
slaves to obey their masters, and gives every appearance of endorsing
slavery.  Yet if you try to follow his principle of considering your
slave to be your brother in Christ, ultimately slavery becomes
impossible for you.  At least that's been the experience of the Church
in the last 100 years or so.  Similarly, he instructs people to obey
the current rules on the status of women, but he establishes the
principle that in Christ there is no male or female.  (Note how in I
Cor 11:11 he ends his discussion of women covering their heads by
reminding us that in Christ women and men are equally dependent upon
each other.)

My interpretation is that Paul is telling people to follow the current
standards, so as to avoid the sort of scandal that would detract from
the Christian message.  The true scandal of the Church should be the
scandal of the cross.  But now our society is beginning to treat women
as equal to men.  Now we create a scandal if we deny women leadership
roles.  That's an even worse scandal than the one that would have
happened in the 1st Cent.  It's worse because it denies the underlying
principle that there is no male nor female in Christ.

ian@essex.ac.uk (Crookston I) (02/09/90)

If I read one more time that Paul didn't allow women to speak in
Church, I'll scream. What about I Cor 11 5? Either Paul was a rank
charlatan or I Cor 14 34 has to be interpreted so as to be consistent
with I Cor 11 5. One possible such interpretation is suggested by I Cor
14 35 - it's wrong for women to slow a meeting down with questions that
can easily be answered at home. This puts women under the same
responsibility as men - if you've some thing to say worth saying, such as
a prophecy as mentioned in I Cor 11 5, say it, otherwise, keep quiet. But
whatever the eventual interpretation, I Cor 14 34 does not encapsulate
Paul's, let alone the Bible's teaching on women in meetings any more than
I Cor 7 32 encapsulates the Bible's teaching on marriage.