glenlee@brillig.umd.edu (Glen Lee) (10/23/89)
I'm not sure if this belongs to this newsgroup because I never see any discussions/interests in contemporary christian music (ccm). If it belongs somewhere else, please tell me what newsgroup. I found out that Amy Grant, Christian superstar sings the opening theme song to NBC's _Sister_Kate_ (which is pretty funny, IMO). I thought this was really great because she shows great variety in her God-given talents, like when she sang with secular ex-Chicago member, Peter Cetera in "Next Time I Fall". However, a friend of mine thinks she is sorta "falling out" in her mission to spread the gospel thru music since her music has really become more subtle than her early years. My belief is that she still has the goal in mind--after all, she made a lot of sacrifices to be in the position to put a "wholesome" message to kids everywhere. Besides, kids today are so materialistic, that voicing out their emotions for Christ is kinda "mushy"...Amy teaches you don't have to be an angel to do it...just human. Well, anyways, anyone feel the same way as my friend? How about with me? -Glen +---------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Glen Lee glenlee@brillig.umd.edu / uunet!brillig!glenlee | | Computer Science Dept., Univ. of Maryland, College Park, MD 20742 | +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
nelson@vax1.acs.udel.edu (Todd M Nelson) (10/27/89)
I'm don't know what Amy feels her mission is, but what I see now is an entertainer who is a Christian. I've listened to her newest album,_Lead_Me_On_, and I enjoy a lot of it, and it presents a godly message, however you have to look to find it. I mean she doesn't come out and bash you on the head with "Jesus is the way" or something similar. Whether this is good or not I don't know. But I like her anyway. Todd M. Nelson
mmcdanie@uunet.uu.net (Molly McDaniel) (10/27/89)
In article <Oct.22.13.43.26.1989.25386@athos.rutgers.edu>, glenlee@brillig.umd.edu (Glen Lee) writes: > > > I found out that Amy Grant, Christian superstar sings the opening > theme song to NBC's _Sister_Kate_ .... I thought this was really great > because she shows great variety in her God-given talents, ... > However, a friend of mine thinks she is sorta > "falling out" in her mission to spread the gospel thru music since > her music has really become more subtle than her early years. > Amy teaches you don't have to be an angel .... just human. I agree with you. Amy's message has not gotten more subtle, either, at least not on her latest albums ("Lead Me On" was very powerful, I thought). And what's important to me about her witness is that she is human, accepts that she's human, lives her life like we all do, making good and bad choices, but always with the desire and motivation of following Christ, of worshipping God in spirit and in truth. I guess you could say she's no pious Jim Bakker ..... I get a lot of inspiration from her songs and what I know of her life, and one of the main reasons is that I can identify so easily with her, with the triumphs and the struggles. P.S. I loved the "Next Time I Fall" video. -- Molly McDaniel UUCP: ...cvl!umabco!mmcdanie Internet: umabco!mmcdanie@cvl.umd.edu Snail Mail: UMAB, 511 West Lombard Street, Baltimore, MD. 21201
devries@ncar.ucar.edu (DEVRIES KEVIN K) (10/30/89)
I get much encouragement from her music. If nothing else, even if the message is "hidden" it leads me to focus on the lord. There has been many a nights where I study listening to her songs. And here in Boulder it helps to have a little extra help in the encouragement area. I thank God that Amy is willing to take a step for her Lord, and reach those that need to hear His word (or need a little encouragement.) Bullwinkle
rock@sun.com (Bill Petro) (11/10/89)
[This article has been reconstructed somewhat. About half the lines in it were duplicated. I trust this is what Bill intended. --clh] nelson@vax1.acs.udel.edu (Todd M Nelson) writes: >I'm don't know what Amy feels her mission is, but what I see >now is an entertainer who is a Christian. >I've listened to her newest album,_Lead_Me_On_, and I enjoy a lot >of it, and it presents a godly message, however you have to look >to find it. I mean she doesn't come out and bash you on the head >with "Jesus is the way" or something similar. Whether this is good >or not I don't know. But I like her anyway. > > Todd M. Nelson I too have enjoyed Amy's music for many years. In recent years, her work has evolved, if not matured. In any event, it has changed. Not only has she become a successful "cross-over" artist, crossing over from one style of music ("Gospel") to another ("Pop"), but her audience has changed. My wife and I attended one of her recent concerts at an open air amphitheater. Shortly after it began, I knew I was disappointed. Her music was LOUD. When I say LOUD, I mean that our throats vibrated and our clothes thumped. Her husband, on base, felt it was his ministry to aid those with pacemakers. And I have been to other concerts before and since, including the Guiness Book of World Eardrum Bursting Record group the WHO, but Amy was louder! Her music was so amplified that the lyrics were virtually indiscernible except to those teenyboppers who had memorized her latest album. For my part, I couldn't follow it. And even those recent tunes that I know and love, were sonicly distorted. "Angels Watching Over Me" was oppressive and dark, and its lyrics were drowned by bombastic music. She gave a quasi-relevant attribution to God by way of significance, but it was so ambiguous that most non-Christians wouldn't get the point, and Christians would find it to be mere token. I was most unclear about her intended audience. Her music was almost entirely without worshipfulness for mature Christians (with the possible "goosebump" exception of El Shaddai"). For the non-Christian, I imagine that her music was virtually indistinguishable from secular music; any difference the lyrics might have made was lost. It seemed to me to appeal only to the young people with whom hard driving "pop" (not far from rock) music is currently popular. I saw the Doobie Brothers in the same place a couple of months later. They were not as loud. Don't get me wrong, I love her music, especially her new stuff. But I didn't care for her performance, or her carriage on stage. Her warm-up group "First Call" (get their album!) I was much more impressed with. The display a wide range of styles and a kinetic presence on stage. And they involved me in the experience without violating my auditory organs. Bill Petro {decwrl,hplabs,ucbvax}!sun!Eng!rock "UNIX for the sake of the kingdom of heaven" Matthew 19:12
gjanti@att.att.com (11/10/89)
Personally, I feel that we spend too much time analyzing how "christian"
or not famous Christian artists are. What we really should do is look
for and apreciate the Christian messages in their music and not focus so
much on the artist. Amy Grant is a great musician, I agree, but she
shouldn't be put on such a pedistal. If we find fault with some of her
music we don't have to listen. Why judge her so much. We need to
remember she is only human.
plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) (05/02/91)
I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians down. She says you have to go with your gut feelings sometimes. I agree, but not when it goes against God's will and word. Any comments or complaints are welcom. --------------- Peter S. Lee e-mail: plee@cville.umd.edu
kday@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Kevin Day) (05/05/91)
In article <May.2.04.34.33.1991.2358@athos.rutgers.edu> plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) writes: >I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching >over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too I am totally thrilled at what Amy Grabt is doing. What is that, you ask? She's getting her backside off the church pew and getting out to where the people, who need to hear what she has to say, are. Several years ago, Amy had another hit single, "Find A Way". I went and saw one of her concerts on that tour. It was definitely a "secular" concert, though I really hate that distinction we feel we must put on evrything. The place (Merriweather Post Pavilion, outside of Baltimore) was packed to the rafters. Was the concert entertaining? You bet, it was great. But...Amy pulled know punches when it came to letting the crowd of the almost 20,000 people there know where she stood. And you know what happened when she did? They listened. They saw a normal person, telling them that Jesus had come and died for them. Many of them, I sure, thought Christians were just fat, loud mouthed, pompous no it alls that thought they could force the world to be Christians. Face it guys, that's how we come acrossed a lot of the time and that's all you see from the "tele-###### evangelists". Instead, they saw someone who basically said, "Hey, I don't have all of life figured out. I sometimes fall. But I know that Jesus died for my sins and he is Lord of my life, and I love him with all of my heart." Speaking of her newest songs: When did it become wrong to sing about your love for your wife/husband/children/mother/father/etc. Where does it say that all of our songs must have at least 4 Jesus', 3 Gods' and 2 holys' in it or we're misusing the talents God gave us. Guess what, it doesn't. God has given me the gift of writing music. I do use it to praise him. I also use it to admire and show love and appreciation to the people he has put in my life. Either usage of that gift praises God, the giver of the gift. I think it's time more Christians got outside the church walls with their music. I'd like to see the whole top 40 with nothing but Christians. Then the world would find out that you could love someone without jumping into bed with them. They would hear that you can thoroughly enjoy life without putting artificial substances in your body. Boy do they need to hear that. How will they find that out if the people who know that best of all won't tell them because they're afraid to sing songs about everyday life? I don't think Madonna can do it. I know Amy Grant can and does, and I thank God for her. K. Scott Day David Taylor Research Center Bethesda, Maryland ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "I am the inferior of any man whose rights I trample underfoot." -Robert Green Ingersoll ------------------------------------------------------------------------
rjb@akgua.att.com (Robert J Brown) (05/05/91)
In article <May.2.04.34.33.1991.2358@athos.rutgers.edu>, plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) writes: > I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching > over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too > close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line > when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians > down. She says you have to go with your gut feelings sometimes. I agree, > but not when it goes against God's will and word. > > Any comments or complaints are welcom. > > --------------- > Peter S. Lee > e-mail: plee@cville.umd.edu I have often thought how silly we are to hold people whose gift and talents put them in the entertainment field to a higher standard than the rest of us, professionally speaking. As an engineer who is a Christian, should I only work for a "Christian Engineering Company" instead of AT&T ?? Can I practice Godly engineering while working for the un-Godly beast that is AT&T ? Can the only songs we sing contain the lyrics "Jesus, Jesus, Jesus" in every verse ? When I write a SECULAR song which expresses my romantic love for another, or my family, or country can I not glorify God with my talent ? I think the "Devil invented Rock" line of reasoning is a colossal waste...but then perhaps he has got me where he wants me on this one. My experience and more importantly my spirit is at peace with any style of music. Bobby - akgua!rjb
st0o+@andrew.cmu.edu (Steven Timm) (05/05/91)
Discussion on this topic is raging in rec.music.christian on a ongoing basis. Personally I do not feel that Amy Grant is "walking the fine line", rather she has stepped boldly across it. She has wanted to be accepted in the main stream for a long time, and looks like she has made it this time, at least with one song. (Other songs of hers have been on the chart but never #1.) By so doing Amy moves into the same class as U2, groups who are Christian making not explicitly Christian music. The same phenomena has been going on for hundreds of years. We must ask, is there anything wrong with a Christian making good music without explicitly being religious? The danger is twofold, one that Amy will lose sight of where she came from (if she hasn't already), and second that seeing a known Christian artist in a secular medium will encourage people to sample other not-so-wholesome offerings in that vein. Amy Grant seems to think it's a risk worth taking, time will tell if it was. Steve Timm
johnw@stew.ssl.berkeley.edu (John Warren) (05/05/91)
In article <May.2.04.34.33.1991.2358@athos.rutgers.edu> plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) writes: >I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching >over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too >close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line >when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians >down. >--------------- >Peter S. Lee I'm not fed up. If she wants to make it big in the secular music charts, then more power to her. The world is the Lord's, and everything in it. Christians should excell at what they do, and if it brings them fame, then that's God's gift. (Now, do I have to give the balancing statement to that last sentence which goes something like, "Of course we can abuse our gifts and become proud like Saul, so we need to remain humble before the Lord and not let go to our heads"? Or can I let this go without saying, as something we all should know?) "Walking the line"? What does that mean? Jesus said we are to be in but not of the world. Now I haven't heard this new album of hers, but I know of all her previous stuff and from that she has demonstrated (at least to me) that musically she is in, not of, the world. I don't like that particular trend in Christianity that wants to retreat to monasteries of so-called 'holiness' (and, YES, I do believe that without holiness no one may see God) and that any delight that people may have in this world is held in suspicion by legalistic Christians who have lost the ability to experience any delight. I'm not flaming anyone in particular here. Just letting off a little steam about a phenomenon that has bothered me for many years. John Warren "is there someone in the shadows, someone that I might have missed?" -- Dylan [I think we've seen enough answers of this sort. I'm going to begin to be a bit more selective on this topic. --clh]
jimmc@obdient.chi.il.us (Jim McNicholas) (05/07/91)
In article <May.2.04.34.33.1991.2358@athos.rutgers.edu> plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) writes: >I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching >over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too >close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line >when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians >down. She says you have to go with your gut feelings sometimes. I agree, >but not when it goes against God's will and word. > Well Pete here goes a major flame-out.... Why do you think that the secular world all of a sudden is loving amy grant's music do you think it is: A:> She has a wonderful voice and sings from her heart, and the world likes to listen to music that is being sung from people's hearts! B:> Amy is a really hot babe who shows lots of cleavage and sings about how immoral she is! C:> Amy has a really bad voice and (LIKE BONNIE TYLER AND OTHERS) the world loves really interesting voices. Think about what your saying....Amy didn't do anything to get her album played on secular stations. I know I work at a big one in chicago!!! I am sick and tired of people thinking that amy did something like sell her soul to get on the secular music charts...they consist of albums that sell large amounts. Amy has been selling millions of albums for years. If Petra sold the same amount Petra would be on the secular charts. It is all based on sales and then after sales....radio starts playing it and after that it gets on the charts based on whether it sold and got played more or less than the other songs on the charts! It is simple cause and effect!! Amy is popular Amy sells albums...radio stations see that an artist named Grant is selling huge amounts so they play a song off the album....the song gets on the charts a video is then done by the record company...in this case they wanted a much more lewd video than Amy would allow so AMY did a pure and innocent video about young love. You all hate her now so she'll sell less albums now and hurt her chances to get the word out on album and in concert!!! Listen to HEART IN MOTION....If there is anything good in this world it's from JESUS Listen to the last cut on the CD....This namecalling is not good so I guess I know where it's coming from!!!!! You all ought to be ashamed of yourselves and pray for forgivness for having JUDGEMENTAL hearts!!! Led to Christ in 1977, Yes I'm an oldtimer. I'm walking for him in the world but not of the world Jim McNicholas [FLAME OFF] How's by you? -- I grew it out long to make room for my brain -Larry Norman Jim McNicholas Chicago, Illinois Y-108FM Doin' it in the 'burbs
@vm.cc.purdue.edu:XWUU@PURCCVM (05/07/91)
I don't begrudge Amy her music...it is not in my taste...What I object to is the commercialization of the gospel. An AG concert costs a local area $30K-$50K!!! Sounds like selling the gospel to me! BTW...Amy's "honorarium" for an evening's concert is now into the 1,000's of dollars. I am a musician and a christian - many of us consider our music a ministry. If people CANNOT pay - we play anyway. Yes...I know that Amy "gives" away a number of tickets to "underpriviledged" kids - but she does it out of her surplus! She never loses her honorarium in the giving. Yes... I know "a workman is worth his wages," but Paul was speaking of ministers and I have removed Amy from that rank since she does not own up to that description in interviews. Amy should read what Paul has to say about selling the gospel. Living a witness is one thing...getting paid to live that witness is another. Kirk xwuu@purccvm
chaplin@uunet.uu.net (chaplin) (05/07/91)
In article <May.2.04.34.33.1991.2358@athos.rutgers.edu> plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) writes: >I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching >over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too >close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line >when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians >down. She says you have to go with your gut feelings sometimes. I agree, >but not when it goes against God's will and word. > >Any comments or complaints are welcom. > >--------------- >Peter S. Lee >e-mail: plee@cville.umd.edu Suppose I as a believer who also happens to be a degreed engineer decided that the only suitable use of my God-given talent, intelligence, etc. was to go into some kind of full-time ministry. What would happen then to the influence which I (hopefully) am having on my associates? We are to be salt and light in a dark and rotting world. So then, is it any different for those believers to whom God has given talents and abilities in the arts instead of the sciences? I know of several respected jazz musicians who are Christians, and I pray that they take advantage of the doors which open to them because of their skill and popularity, doors which will *never* open to anyone else. But, since I don't observe these artists in their everyday lives, I must trust that they are living their lives according to the leading of the Holy Spirit, just as you must trust that I am following His leading in my life. -- Roger Chaplin / Instruments Division Engineering / uunet!keinstr!chaplin CI$: 76307,3506 / voice: (216) 498-2815 / FAX: (216) 248-6168 "In the last analysis the customer is the independent auditor. In the merciless light of real use, every flaw will show." - Frederick P. Brooks, Jr.
EFL0@ns.cc.lehigh.edu (Ed Lamb) (05/07/91)
I used to think that Amy Grant was wrong to switch over to secular
music. Now, I don't think so. If this allows her music to become
popular and people buy her albums (old and new), they will still be hit
with Christian ideas and messages. Another thing that was pointed out
to me is that Peter was told "it is not what goes into a man that makes
him unclean, but what comes out of him, for that shows what is in his
heart. (paraphrased)" Therefore, although I don't listen to secular
lyrics for other reasons (for me they are too tempting), I'm not
willing to condemn her. I do take exception with her video, however.
It totally changes the meaning of the song and may promote ideas which
shouldn't be promoted. God wants to be brought into all areas of our
life, even those where we don't explicitly give him credit. Jesus
provided wine to parties, David danced naked, and we must "be in the
world, but not of it." Amy Grant, although I don't agree totally with
what she is doing, is witnessing to the secular music world the best
way she knows how. She is our sister, and needs our support. "Let him
who is without sin cast the first stone."
Ed
________________________________________________________________________
Ed Lamb .387 average
Catcher 53 home runs
Philadelphia Phillies 157 runs batted in
National League MVP 67 stolen bases
World Series MVP
________________________________________________________________________
--Hey, I can dream, can't I ??????zslb0f@uunet.uu.net (Steven L. Boyls) (05/07/91)
> I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching >over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too >close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line >when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians >down. She says you have to go with your gut feelings sometimes. I agree, >but not when it goes against God's will and word. > >Any comments or complaints are welcom. --------------- >Peter S. Lee >e-mail: plee@cville.umd.edu My question is: Do all you people who put down secular music ever watch television? Do you only watch the christian channels on your cable-tv? If you watch anything other than christian stations then you have little room to be talking because secular music should be just as bad as secular music. Do you read anything other than christian books? Secular books should be just as bad as secular tv and music. In my opinion there is good and bad music whether secular or christian. The same goes for books and tv. I read, watch, and listen to both. Steve zslb0f@trc.amoco.com
smittie@beach.csulb.edu (Mark Smith) (05/08/91)
Of course, the other side of that argument is that Amy Grant is a professional musician, not a minister. Now, I don't listen to Amy Grant. The lady doesn't play Jazz and I don't listen to much other than Jazz. But I am not sure that we have the right to sit in judgement of others unless they are in obvious conflict with God's word. Amy is responsible to God for her stewardship. It is, quite thankfully, none of my business how much she makes or what she does with it. As far as selling the Gospel is concerned, if you choose to give away your work in an effort to bring others to Christ that's your choice. If I choose to get paid for my work that's my choice. As others have pointed out, if Amy were a carpenter selling hers labor no one would be saying a word. Even if her labor consisted of "One Way" signs and Crosses to hang on our walls. I see so many people preaching good stewardship while they have $1000 crosses hanging on the wall. I hope and pray that Amy does well. I also pray that Amy is able to keep sight of her faith in the face of fame. I pray for Amy. That she will continue in the path that God calls her to. smittie
hilli@bohra.cpg.oz.au (Hilli Gibson) (05/08/91)
In article <May.4.22.12.35.1991.21790@athos.rutgers.edu> rjb@akgua.att.com (Robert J Brown) writes: > In article <May.2.04.34.33.1991.2358@athos.rutgers.edu>, plee@wam.umd.edu (Peter S. Lee) writes: >> I'm wondering how many of you out there are fed up with Amy Grant switching >> over to secular music charts. Her new album, "Heart in Motion", is too >> close to the secluar music world. I think she is really walking the line >> when she does this. I also feel that she is letting a lot of Christians >> down. She says you have to go with your gut feelings sometimes. I agree, >> but not when it goes against God's will and word. > Hi, Peter : Judge and Yow won't be judged ! Only God knows and see Amy's Heart > I have often thought how silly we are to hold people whose gift and > talents put them in the entertainment field to a higher standard > than the rest of us, professionally speaking. As an engineer who > is a Christian, should I only work for a "Christian Engineering > Company" instead of AT&T ?? Can I practice Godly engineering while > working for the un-Godly beast that is AT&T ? I agree with you that we can work with the Un-godly firm even we are christians. I aslo agree that we do not always need to mention God God in Christian songs; Howver, I have got to disagree about you in one thing : To write songs about what the world can offer you, for instance if you break up with your girl friend, infactuate or romance instead of Love and Peace, in my opinion , I consider "Rubbish " WHY ? Those secular musics that have been written by many non christian artists tell you that you can depend upon on your strength instead of God . As a result, instead of seeking God's way to solve the problem , you are seeking your own way, feeling and emotion. I used to experience all of these before when I was not a christian. But again judge not and you won't be judged of what other Christian artists do. If they are doing wrong then God will speak to them !! -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hilli Gibson |\/\/\/\/\/| Computer Power Software Pty Ltd Australia | |
hilli@bohra.cpg.oz.au (Hilli Gibson) (05/08/91)
In article <May.4.22.20.04.1991.21866@athos.rutgers.edu> st0o+@andrew.cmu.edu (Steven Timm) writes: > Discussion on this topic is raging in rec.music.christian on a ongoing > basis. Personally I do not feel that Amy Grant is "walking the fine line", I hope you are wrong that AMY is still walking the Light ! Cuz' only God can see her motivation !!! > The danger is twofold, one that Amy will lose sight of where she came from > (if she hasn't already), and second that seeing a known Christian artist > in a secular medium will encourage people to sample other not-so-wholesome > offerings in that vein. Amy Grant seems to think it's a risk worth taking, > time will tell if it was. > However I have to give you this 100 % credit !!! There is a danger of trying to sing in a secular musics as you said before. (you can't serve TWO GODS), Artists like Whitney Houston , M.C. Hammer (I saw both concerts!!) though they claimed to be Christians, I can't see how thei songs will call many people to Christ. Why, because the lyrics are quite weak to do so !! Furthermore, their dances are more erotic dances rather than dances that are meant to be for Christ !!! But I believe God can use these people as well if they open their hearts and follow God's Way !!! -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hilli Gibson |\/\/\/\/\/| Computer Power Software Pty Ltd Australia | |
johnw@stew.ssl.berkeley.edu (John Warren) (05/11/91)
In article <May.7.00.19.16.1991.14310@athos.rutgers.edu> @vm.cc.purdue.edu:XWUU@PURCCVM writes: >I don't begrudge Amy her music...it is not in my taste...What I object to >is the commercialization of the gospel. An AG concert costs a local area >$30K-$50K!!! Sounds like selling the gospel to me! BTW...Amy's "honorarium" >for an evening's concert is now into the 1,000's of dollars. I am a musician >and a christian - many of us consider our music a ministry. If people CANNOT >pay - we play anyway. > Once again, the legalism that says, 'Christians should not make a lot of money,' pops its head. I believe that money is a very dangerous tool, and can be corrosive; but life is corrosive. If you're going to argue that a Christian musician should not prosper in what they do best, you might as well go to the logical extreme and argue that a christian should avoid physical life and become some kind of gnostic. Greater is He that is in us than he that is in the world. If God can catapult servants to great heights of fame, he is able to put his Spirit in them to withstand the temptations that this fame and money bring. Be careful not to judge Amy by what might cause YOU to stumble. Perhaps you, by the discernment God has given you, perceive that you would not be able to handle such wealth and popularity; however, that doesn't mean Amy can't handle it. > >Kirk > John Warren ----------- "Into the narrow lanes, I can't stumble or stay put." -- from 'I and I', by Dylan
hudson@athena.cs.uga.edu (Paul Hudson Jr) (05/11/91)
In article <May.7.00.46.51.1991.14968@athos.rutgers.edu> EFL0@ns.cc.lehigh.edu (Ed Lamb) writes: Jesus >provided wine to parties, David danced naked, and we must "be in the >world, but not of it." Amy Grant, although I don't agree totally with >what she is doing, is witnessing to the secular music world the best >way she knows how. She is our sister, and needs our support. "Let him >who is without sin cast the first stone." I don't want to imply anthing false about you here, but are you insinuating that Jesus was not without sin for turning water into wine, or were you trying to compare this miracle to Amy Grant's music. It was my understanding that David was wearing his underwear while dancing (a linnen ephod that would probably cover as much as his royal robes.) I thought that Micah despised him because she thought his actions were inappropriate for a king, not because they were immoral. I read in a book about old Semetic coustoms that a person could be called "naked" if he was not wearing his mantle, but was wearing his ephod. The author felt that Peter might have been wearing an ephod when he jumped in the water to swim out to meet the ressurected Lord (St. John.) If David was wearing an ephod, I think it would have covered him well. According to this book, the undergarmets of the rich were longer and even had sleaves. Link Hudson student at UGA
florian@convex.csd.uwm.edu (Chris Florian) (05/11/91)
There is all this talk about Amy Grant going from one type of music to another. But think about it this way... I know the songs that have reached the top 10 are not talking about God, but there are songs on the cd that do. If people by the cd to listen to the top 10 song, they will also be listening to the others too. I know Amy's latest recordings are not a very strong witness. But how many people do you think hear this new cd, and decide to buy some of her older stuff, which is very christian. If even one person comes to know the Lord because they heard Amy Grant on the radio, then it was worth it. All things work for the good of God.
EFL0@ns.cc.lehigh.edu (Ed Lamb) (05/13/91)
By mentioning that Jesus turned water into wine, I was not implying
anything about Christ's perfect character. I was pointing out that he
did go to parties (celebrations) and did participate in providing the
wine. I think that we must be very careful saying that a certain
Christian shouldn't go out among "pagans." Jesus did. He provided the
wine, though we know drunkeness is a sin, and we know he is perfect.
By the same line, just because Amy goes out into the secular music
world does not necessarily mean she is doing wrong. If we are to go to
the lost, must we not go to where they are?
I am not saying we should compromise one single stroke of biblical
morality. I am saying that until Amy does something blatantly wrong
(ie DIRECTLY against scripture -- not against today's christian
community), we should support her every way we can. Although I am not
thrilled about her video, it is not blatantly wrong, and if just one
person buys the album and begins taking Christianity seriously, then it
is worth it.
As a side note: Although for my own comfort, I enjoy the
distinction between Christian and secular music, sometimes I wish it
would cease to be that way. I am sure more people would listen to it
more if it weren't labeled as such. But, because of our weakness (in
resisting temptation -- remember, "it is not what goes into a man which
makes him unclean, but what comes out"), and our desire to stand out
(instead of just doing it), we have a christian label. ** I am not
saying standing out is wrong, I am saying that if I want to be a car,
going into a garage doesn't make it so -- I must undergo a change. **
Ed
________________________________________________________________________
Ed Lamb .387 average
Catcher 53 home runs
Philadelphia Phillies 157 runs batted in
National League MVP 67 stolen bases
World Series MVP
________________________________________________________________________
--Hey, I can dream, can't I ??????burke@susan.cs.andrews.edu (Byron Burke) (05/18/91)
One item that hasn't been mentioned in this thread is that two albums
ago ("Unguarded") there was a song that made it part way up the charts
but the next album ("Lead Me On") was (in my humble _personal_ opinion)
more religious than either "Unguarded" or "Heart in Motion".
In other words, wait & see what the next album will be, she may want to
produce both secular & religious music.
BTW I see a difference between music that glorifies God & brings me closer
to Him (which I call religious) and music that promotes good values and
christian ideals while not directly speaking about religious topics (which
I call good secular music).
Just a thought,
byron
--
I think, therefore I am. -- Descartes
I think I think, therefore I might be. -- burke@peter.cs.andrews.edu