bill@chinet.chi.il.us (Bill Mitchell) (01/11/90)
zenith supersport 386 - 1.44 floppy, 1mb ram, 40mb hard drive is being closed out from various sources at $3000.00. sounds like a good deal? anybody have any opinions? $3000 is still above my threshold of pain, but i'm thinking about it.....
gmiller@udel.edu (Gregory Miller) (01/12/90)
In article <1990Jan11.004443.8795@chinet.chi.il.us> bill@chinet.chi.il.us (Bill Mitchell) writes: >zenith supersport 386 - 1.44 floppy, 1mb ram, 40mb hard drive is >being closed out from various sources at $3000.00. sounds like a >good deal? anybody have any opinions? $3000 is still above my >threshold of pain, but i'm thinking about it..... Wow! That sounds like a great deal to me. It's true that $3000 is big bucks, but I have to wonder whether you'll get more for your money anywhere else. I rushed out and bought the Zenith supersport 286 when it first came out (I got serial number 93!), and I've been thrilled with it since I've had it. Zenith gives substantial discounts (~40%) to schools, even to the point that their own dealers can't compete, so I bought mine through school. In 1988 I paid $2800 for my 286, and that's with the discount! Of course, I'm not very up on how much prices have dropped since then. Maybe someone else knows? The only complaint I have with the machine is the battery life seems to be rather short, but otherwise I love it. IMHO, it sounds like a good deal, but of course they could knock off another $500 tomorrow. It's a gamble, so if you do buy it, you might want to use my trick. After making the purchase, refuse to look at any advertisements or watch any commercials for several months. Ignorance is bliss! :-) :-) Greg gmiller@dewey.udel.edu
alex@oahu.cs.ucla.edu (Alex Quilici) (01/12/90)
gmiller@udel.edu (Gregory Miller) writes:
"I rushed out and bought the Zenith supersport 286 when
it first came out (I got serial number 93!), and I've been thrilled
with it since I've had it."
Well, here's a different opinion: stay away from Zenith laptops. I
bought a supersport 286 with a 40mb hard disk and an internal 2400 baud
modem for around $3500 just over a year ago. And, since then, it has
been in the shop over half of the time.
Why? The CPU failed once and needed to be replaced. That wasn't
bad; only a week in the shop once they figured out what was wrong.
The power supply failed once and needed to be replaced. That was
a little worse; it took about two weeks to get the parts. And
then things started to fall apart. In late August, the machine
suddenly started hanging at odd times. Then a few days later it
wouldn't boot anymore. I took it to Zenith's authorized repair shop
who ended up reseating most of its chips. That took a week or so,
and everything worked fine -- for all of another week. I took it
back and had the chips reseated again, and it worked again -- for
all of two weeks, this time. So I took it back and the shop said
the main board needed to be replaced. This was toward the middle
of October. The new board came in right around Thanksgiving and
I got my laptop back a few days later. And I was happy -- for
less than three days, before the board quit again. Since then
I've been waiting for a replacement board and my latest call
to Zenith has confirmed that they're backordered until the end of
this month. Sure, all this service has been performed with a smile
and for free, but since August I've had the use of the machine
for a little under a month.
And I haven't even gotten into the more minor irritations like
problems with screen adjustment and the exceedingly short life
of the battery pack.
I've written to Zenith complaining about the poor quality of
their product, asking for an extended warranty or a replacement
machine, and they haven't even bothered to respond. I'm not
planning on buying any more Zenith machines. There's no reason
to anymore anyways, since other manufacturers have considerably
better machines out for about the same price. Check out NEC's new
286 laptops--they're lighter, have a faster hard-disk, and
have VGA graphics.
Has anyone else had problems with Zenith? Especially with
their 286 supersports? The shop I've been taking it to has
seven other supersport 286's with the same set of problems,
so I imagine there must be others out there in the same boat.
Alexfuruta@crayola.cs.umd.edu (Richard Furuta) (01/12/90)
This posting reminds me of a problem I've had on and off with a Zenith SuperSport (the low-end model; I forget the number). As I type, from time to time, a previously typed character will be inserted again as if it were retyped. This isn't just pure key bounce; you can find things like "theh" or "the e", etc. The Zenith people tried changing the keyboard without particular effect. This occurs with dos, with micro emacs, and with kermit connections (about all I've tried). Since the thing is out of warranty these days I'm just living with it, but I wonder if anyone else has encountered it and if there is a solution? --Rick
fred@egrunix.UUCP (Manfred Prange) (01/12/90)
In article <30731@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU> alex@cs.ucla.edu (Alex Quilici) writes: >gmiller@udel.edu (Gregory Miller) writes: > "I rushed out and bought the Zenith supersport 286 when > it first came out (I got serial number 93!), and I've been thrilled > with it since I've had it." > >Well, here's a different opinion: stay away from Zenith laptops. I >bought a supersport 286 with a 40mb hard disk and an internal 2400 baud >modem for around $3500 just over a year ago. And, since then, it has >been in the shop over half of the time. > (Very unfortunate horror story deleted.) >Has anyone else had problems with Zenith? Especially with >their 286 supersports? The shop I've been taking it to has >seven other supersport 286's with the same set of problems, >so I imagine there must be others out there in the same boat. > It sounds to me like your machine, and the 7 others in the shop have come from a bad production run. I have a SS-286 w/40Mb and 2400 baud modem which I have been using for a number of months, and it is a real peach. I've owned and used ZDS computers of several types over the years, and never found the quality of their machines to be anything less than sterling. If your machine is defective - and from your description it certainly seems to be - give the ZDS head office in Chicago a call, give them all the unfortunate details, as you did in your post. This is very definitely something they will want to know about. A friend of mine had a recurring problem with a ZCM-1490 monitor, and the local shop was not handling things correctly, a call or two to Chicago cured the problem. Zenith now has VGA and page-white LCD equipped laptops, the SS-286e, and SS-SX386, as well as an upgraded 20Mhz version of the Turbosport. That is why the older Turbosports are on clearance. I've had the opportunity to experiment with them, and they are excellent laptops, particularily in the screen department, where ZDS remains unmatched. Good luck with your problem. Send me an e-mail reply with your progress. -MWP
ttak@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Timothy Takahashi) (01/12/90)
I have had terrible luck with a Zenith Z-386 desktop machine. It just isn't very compatible. Nothing ever runs quite right. ttak@uhura.cc.rochester.edu
jlohmeye@entec.Wichita.NCR.COM (John Lohmeyer) (01/12/90)
The real answer is: It depends. I am looking into buying a lunch box machine. They cost more, but you get a LOT more capacity, and you can upgrade later when you want to. They don't really weigh much more either. I am entering this article on a Zenith 183 laptop I've had for 2.5 years. It has been completely dependable (except when a flight attendant dumped a pot of coffee in the keyboard :-( ). That required cleaning each keyswitch with contact cleaner. Yesterday, I met a lady in Fry's Electronics who has a 181. One of the floppies died in September and Zenith still hasn't fixed it. Of course, you all know Zenith sold its computer line to Bull Systems, a French company. This may explain some of the service problems in the last few months... -- John Lohmeyer J.Lohmeyer@Wichita.NCR.COM NCR Corp. uunet!ncrlnk!ncrwic!entec!jlohmeye 3718 N. Rock Rd. Voice: 316-636-8703 Wichita, KS 67226 SCSI BBS 316-636-8700 300/1200/2400 24 hours
ignatz@chinet.chi.il.us (Dave Ihnat) (01/13/90)
In article <30731@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU> alex@cs.ucla.edu (Alex Quilici) writes: >Well, here's a different opinion: stay away from Zenith laptops. I >bought a supersport 286 with a 40mb hard disk and an internal 2400 baud >modem for around $3500 just over a year ago. And, since then, it has >been in the shop over half of the time. > > (marvelously detailed horror story elided for the faint of CPU) > >Alex Well, I've good news, and bad news. I've owned three Zenith laptops--the old Z-171 lunchbox, the Z-181 dual-floppy (early model), and just recently the Supersport 20Mb. In general, the machines have been--while not pushing the edge of the PC performance envelope, either in size, speed, or weight--rock solid. I can't even begin to tell you how I've abused the Z-171 or (especially!) the Z-181. I'm a consultant. I've carried these boxes into and out of client sites and airports for over 4 years, total. In all this time, and with serious heavy development usage--these have been my DOS development platforms--they've performed with no machine failures, and only one modem loss (which ZDS fixed ASAP.) The down side? Zenith has been--and is--very overpriced. Even allowing for their tendency to overprice and then offer a 40% discount, they cost too much. Also, their service and sales--at least in Chicago--is somewhat indifferent if you're not a large company. (I have to mention--they've been nice to me, usually, but that's usually only after I bring up that I'm a consultant, and gee, if you're not going to (get the part/look at my machine/etc.) for two weeks, maybe I shouldn't recommend you to my clients...) The laptops are rugged, in my experience. I've had one client complain that the Winchesters in the 286 machines were fragile; can't comment, as I've not owned one. But compatibility had been great, and the display beats hell out of any of the competition. Especially, they don't have the wierd aspect ratio of some other laptops (won't name names, but the initials are T*****a.) As for the sale on the 386, well...yes, Bull (formerly Honeywell Bull, part of the Honeywell we all know and love, then sold to the Europeans--a French concern, was it?) now owns Zenith Data Systems. However, that's only part of the reason you'll find the '386 on the discount market. It *is* a 386, and you can run Unix/Xenix on it--a portable USENET node! BUT. It eats hell out of batteries--the Zenith boxes have never been economical of battery power, and this is worse than you would wish; although it's not all Zenith's fault. There just ain't a 803C86 chip yet. Worse, though, I've got it on trust- worthy report that it doesn't deal well with VGA. The upshot? Don't short Zenith. They've given me reliable, rugged laptops to lug to client sites for the last 3-4 years. No program has failed, and I've been able to use their products for rugged, personal, portable communication and development platforms for a long time. What else should a laptop be?
riehm@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (Carl Riehm) (01/14/90)
In article <30731@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU> alex@cs.ucla.edu (Alex Quilici) writes: >Has anyone else had problems with Zenith? Especially with >their 286 supersports? The shop I've been taking it to has >seven other supersport 286's with the same set of problems, >so I imagine there must be others out there in the same boat. > >Alex Another opinion: I have been using a Zenith Z-183 laptop for two and a half yeears. It runs every day in my office for 8 hours, and it has done so without a hitch. More than once I have given it a severe jolt, but no problems have developed. I also know several people with 286 Supersports, and they have had no trouble at all. Carl Riehm.
erc@khijol.UUCP (Edwin R. Carp) (01/15/90)
Can anyone direct me to a place that sells a handle for a Zenith Z-181? The only gripe I have with the box (besides the lack of a good, cheap hard drive) is that it doesn't have an integral handle! Thanks for any replies. -- Ed Carp N7EKG/5 (28.3-28.5) uunet!cs.utexas.edu!khijol!erc Austin, Texas (512) 832-5884 "Good tea. Nice house." - Worf
al@escom.com (Al Donaldson) (01/15/90)
In article <1990Jan13.065536.10569@chinet.chi.il.us>, ignatz@chinet.chi.il.us (Dave Ihnat) writes: > In article <30731@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU> alex@cs.ucla.edu (Alex Quilici) writes: > >Well, here's a different opinion: stay away from Zenith laptops. > The laptops are rugged, in my experience. > It eats hell out of batteries I've had relatively good results with my Turbosport 386. I fried a power controller by inadvertently unplugging from and re-plugging into AC power, and Heath/Zenith cheerfully replaced it free of charge. And the modem would disconnect randomly both at 1200 and 2400, and they fixed that too. I've carried the box coast-to-coast twice in the last three months, and used it on the airplane both trips. Got in about three hours work a couple of times, and that was within the range of the battery. I even run Andy Tanenbaum's MINIX in protected mode on the machine -- in fact, it was one of the beta sites for the new 1.5.0 release. I talked with the operations manager at the Heath/Zenith store, and he said the reasons they'd dropped price down to $2999 was because: -- most people want VGA, especially on something this expensive. Hell, I don't care, all I want is plain old 24 x 80. They say the Turbosport supports CGA on an external monitor, but I'm not curious enough to try it. Apparently, ZDS had planned to incorporate VGA in the original Turbosport, but things just didn't come together in time. Fortunate for me, since it made it more affordable. -- Its damn heavy. Most people don't want to tote around a 20 pound "laptop" (as a friend said about the old Grid laptop that cooled itself through its metal case, "not in MY lap, you don't!") Maybe Zenith/Bull should get Arnold Schwarzenegger to demo the machine :-). Seriously, though, I consider this weight as a positive contribution to the overall sturdiness and reliability of the machine. I really love the machine, and now I note an advertiser (in Popular Science, I think) who's selling it at $2700 or $2800. Now if only someone can tell me where to get a converter that will run it in my car and a tech reference manual.. Al (one arm longer than the other..) Donaldson
pollack@toto.cis.ohio-state.edu (Jordan B Pollack) (01/16/90)
Yippee! Now I can stop reading comp.sys.ibm.pc I've had my supersport 286 in the same config (with and extra 1M) for a year with no downtime, thank goodness. It has overheated, which causes memory problems, if used for extended periods of time, especially in warm environments or when set up on a blanket or cushion rather than a well-ventilated desktop. My main two beefs are that the graphics capabilities of all the Zenith 'Sports are intentionally misrepresented and sold with MSWindows advertising iconography. They claim a display of 640 by 400 pixels but never qualify it by "In Text Mode ONLY!". Sure MSWindows works, but at almost useless 320 by 200. Secondly, they have never offered a pointing device which could plug into the useless aux.keyboard port. Does anybody know how difficult it would be to provide a mouse for aux.keyboard ports? -- Jordan Pollack Assistant Professor CIS Dept/OSU Laboratory for AI Research 2036 Neil Ave Email: pollack@cis.ohio-state.edu Columbus, OH 43210 Fax/Phone: (614) 292-4890
russ@prism.gatech.EDU (Russell Shackelford) (01/17/90)
I grabbed one, together with an extra meg of RAM and an expansion chasis from some closeout specialists in atlanta. I sold my well-liked Zenith 286 laptop to get it. Pro's: better screen, detachable keyboard (a BIG deal for me), 386 means that I can keep up my Desqview addiction in a way that makes my working environment the same on desktop and laptop machines. Con's: the darn thing isn't much faster than the 286; bulkier; shorter work session from battery. All in all, I'm glad I did it, especially since 386 cost me less than the 286 did even with a 40% discount...... -- Russell Shackelford School of Information and Computer Science Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta, GA, 30332 russ@prism.gatech.edu (404) 834-4759
malpass@vlsi.ll.mit.edu (Don Malpass) (01/18/90)
In article <509@escom.com> al@escom.com (Al Donaldson) writes: >[SuperSport 286 comments] ....Now if only someone can >tell me where to get a converter that will run it in my car and a tech >reference manual.. Doesn't Heath sell a car adapter for this machine? Seems to me I've seen reference to such somewhere. I'll look at home tonight. As for the tech ref, if you get a handle on that, I'm REALLY interested. I think I have an open connection in the wiring to the External Disk Drive connector, and I really don't want to take the trouble to open the beast up without SOME sort of paperwork ('specially since I have kluged a way around the problem for now). I'll re-ask a previous question: has anybody hooked up an external 5" drive to this laptop? I have it "working", but not without some problems in doing so, and as I say, I think I'm missing one connector signal. -- Don Malpass [malpass@LL-vlsi.arpa], [malpass@gandalf.LL.mit.edu] How do I know he is going into politics? Even when I finish talking to him on the PHONE my wallet is gone! 1/90