[comp.unix.i386] 80386 cache and VGA

dbullis@cognos.UUCP (Dave Bullis) (05/28/90)

In article <8343@cognos.UUCP> dbullis@cognos.UUCP (Dave Bullis) writes:
>I was told by one the local clone dealers that there are problems
>with mixing 80386 25MHz cache systems and VGA cards.
> ...

I talked to the dealer again for more details:  He says that some 8-bit
VGA cards caused the system to hang when booting.  16-bit cards are ok.

-- 
Dave Bullis        Cognos, Inc       VOICE: (613) 738-1440
3755 Riverside Dr. P.O. Box 9707       FAX: (613) 738-0002
Ottawa, Ontario,   CANADA  K1G 3Z4    UUCP: uunet!mitel!sce!cognos!dbullis
"I didn't know the terminals were haunted.  The salesman didn't tell us."

campbell@Thalatta.COM (Bill Campbell) (05/31/90)

In article <8415@cognos.UUCP> dbullis@cognos.UUCP (Dave Bullis) writes:
:>In article <8343@cognos.UUCP> dbullis@cognos.UUCP (Dave Bullis) writes:
:>>I was told by one the local clone dealers that there are problems
:>>with mixing 80386 25MHz cache systems and VGA cards.
:>> ...
:>
:>I talked to the dealer again for more details:  He says that some 8-bit
:>VGA cards caused the system to hang when booting.  16-bit cards are ok.
:>
I had exactly the opposite problem with a 33Mhz NIC Motherboard,
32K cache.  It wouldn't writefloppy disks properly when using a
16-bit Paradise board, but running with the board in an 8-bit
slot or substituting an 8-bit board cured the problem.  This
problem has also been reported on the HP-Vectra.  The article on
the Vectra implied that the problem was with any O/S running in
the 386 protected mode.

-- 
....microsoft--\                    Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
...uw-entropy----!thebes!camco!bill 6641 East Mercer Way
....fluke------/                    Mercer Island, Wa 98040
....hplsla----/                     (206) 232-4164

martin@hppcmart.HP.COM (Martin Croome) (05/31/90)

>campbell@Thalatta.COM (Bill Campbell) writes:
>In article <8415@cognos.UUCP> dbullis@cognos.UUCP (Dave Bullis) writes:
>:>In article <8343@cognos.UUCP> dbullis@cognos.UUCP (Dave Bullis) writes:
>:>>I was told by one the local clone dealers that there are problems
>:>>with mixing 80386 25MHz cache systems and VGA cards.
>:>> ...
>:>
>:>I talked to the dealer again for more details:  He says that some 8-bit
>:>VGA cards caused the system to hang when booting.  16-bit cards are ok.
>:>
>I had exactly the opposite problem with a 33Mhz NIC Motherboard,
>32K cache.  It wouldn't writefloppy disks properly when using a
>16-bit Paradise board, but running with the board in an 8-bit
>slot or substituting an 8-bit board cured the problem.  This
>problem has also been reported on the HP-Vectra.  The article on
>the Vectra implied that the problem was with any O/S running in
>the 386 protected mode.
>

The problem is that with the Paradise card in 16bit mode the video RAM is
not fully decoded so the card will appear in each 1Mb block of the PC's memory
space.

The cache should not be enabled over the VGA card's RAM. If it was it would
cause problems with the card. Most PC's disable the cache on writes and reads
to and from memory at addresses between 0xA0000 and 0xDFFFF to avoid this
problem.

>-- 
>....microsoft--\                    Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
>...uw-entropy----!thebes!camco!bill 6641 East Mercer Way
>....fluke------/                    Mercer Island, Wa 98040
>....hplsla----/                     (206) 232-4164
>----------

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Martin CROOME                        !'s    - hplabs!hpgnd!hppcmart!martin
Hewlett Packard                      @'s    - martin@hppcmart.grenoble.hp.com
Grenoble Personal Computer Division  HPDesk - Martin CROOME / HP6300/K1
Technical Mktg - Online Support
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

wtm@uhura.neoucom.EDU (Bill Mayhew) (06/02/90)

I know from experience that AT&T (about the same as ISC) Unix will
not boot unless you have a 16 bit VGA controller and that
controller is in a 16 bit slot.  It'll boot from an MDA card too,
of course.

Cruiously, AT&T's 6386 hardware service guide shows the VGA card
installed in an 8 bit slot.  One of our staff people received a
6386 that had been configured by AT&T.  Apparently, they must have
followed the service guide.  It would boot DOS, but when he tried
to install the Unix bundle that came with the machine it would gag.
He called, and I switched the card to a 16 bit slot, and all was
fine.


I can't really think of any reason why a VGA card would have
problems with a cache system.  I am running AT&T 3.2.1 on a JDR 33
MHz MCT board with a 64K cache and an OEM verison of the Paradise
VGA Plus/16.  No problems.


Unix does not use the DOS BIOS for anything except to read the
first level bootstrap loader from the hard drive.  The reason is
that DOS BIOSES use software interrupts for virtually everything.
INTs aren't available in protected mode, so the results would be a
real mess.  The DOS BIOS also in not at all reentrant, so the
kernel couldn't use the BIOS anyway.

IBM is an exception.  The model 80 (which the only one I have
personal experience with) has a second BIOS, called, 'ABIOS' which
is accessible from protected mode (A for advanced).  The regular
BIOS is called, 'CBIOS' (C for compatibility).  The ABIOS works by
calling the functions via long jumps sort of a-la CP/M, if any of
you old-timers remeber that.  Perhaps Xenix for PS/2s uses the
ABIOS; that wouldn't surprise me too much given my experiences with
SCO :-).

== Bill ==
-- 

Bill Mayhew  Northeastern Ohio Universities College of Medicine
Rootstown, OH  44272-9995  USA    216-325-2511
wtm@uhura.neoucom.edu   ....!uunet!aablue!neoucom!wtm