ian@ssc-vax.UUCP (Ian R. Searle) (07/28/90)
I currently run SCO UNIX and a 386/25 with 8mb RAM and 125mb RSDI hard disk. I have both OS and DS liscenses, but I am very interested in X-windows. Instead of upgrading SCO I am considering ESIX. Can anybody provide answers to these questions (please e-mail). I have tried asking resellers but I usually get non-commital, vague responses. For the ESIX 2-user system. 1.) I have heard it comes with X11R3, does this include X-lib and the Xt-intrinsics so that I could do developement work. 2.) What flavor window manager and widget sets come with the system. 3.) Does the X-server support the ATI VGA wonder graphics card with a NEC-3D (256k memory, no biult in mouse, the mouse will be a MS serial mouse). 4.) How good are the supplied C compiler and libraries. COFF format? 5.) Does the OS support DOS partitions on the same hard disk. 6.) Does the OS come with utilities to copy files from/to the DOS/UNIX partitions. 7.) Does the system come with on-line man pages. 8.) I have heard many ggod things about their phone support. Can you really talk to someone without sitting on hold for an hour?? Thanks in advance. Ian Searle, uw-beaver!ssc-vax!ssc-bee!ian
beser@tron.UUCP (Eric Beser) (07/29/90)
In article <1510@ssc-bee.ssc-vax.UUCP>, ian@ssc-vax.UUCP (Ian R. Searle) writes: > I currently run SCO UNIX and a 386/25 with 8mb RAM and 125mb RSDI > hard disk. I have both OS and DS liscenses, but I am very interested > in X-windows. Instead of upgrading SCO I am considering ESIX. Can > anybody provide answers to these questions (please e-mail). I have > tried asking resellers but I usually get non-commital, vague > responses. > > For the ESIX 2-user system. > > 1.) I have heard it comes with X11R3, does this include X-lib and > the Xt-intrinsics so that I could do developement work. I have the unlimited user version, but the two user version is the same. You get all the xlibs, etc except for motif. I bought the ESIX GUI which is motif. Beware though, X is not X. Binaries compiled on other systems linking other xlibs will not work. You have to link your version of xlib with the obj files on your system. Even if you are runing stuff only at the client level. This is not a problem for the developer. This is a problem if you are buying canned software that runs on "386/ix" Incidentally, where these system dependent libs are not involved, you can run 386/ix compiled binaries no problem. > > 2.) What flavor window manager and widget sets come with the system. > UIM and twm come standard. you get the XT, AW, etc. with motif you get the MWM and UIL compiler. As stated above, some canned sets may not work. for example we were burned (not by ESIX) on the XVT Graphics toolkit. It doesn't work and the author won't port it unles we pay him to do so. > 3.) Does the X-server support the ATI VGA wonder graphics card with > a NEC-3D (256k memory, no biult in mouse, the mouse will be a MS > serial mouse). > Yes at 800 x 600. The 3d does not do well at 1024 x 700. The microsoft mouse works ok but get a three button. Logitek is good. > 4.) How good are the supplied C compiler and libraries. COFF > > format? > The C compiler and libraries (standard ones) are the same ones you get with interactive. You can buy other compilers. You get the C compiler and libraries as a part of the basic system, unlike interactive. ESIX did well by not unbundling their packages. The TCP/IP system works but you can get in trouble (software development wise) using the socket library. For some reason, they made the berkely socket calls different. You get memory segment errors if you call them unmodified (as found in some software packages taken off the net). Which is my next big beef. Why make the include files the same. The TCP/IP files are not in the same place as other versions of 386/nix and it takes some modification to get it right. GNU cc and debuger work fine. As does HCR's (now SCO Canada) C++ and dbxtra (a nice! debugger). Meridian's Ada compiler works OK but Oregon Software's products do not! It has to do with compiling everything on SCO's Xenix in their non-compatable format. If they had chosen the portible format, they too would work. I have not tried Alsys or Verdix's products for Ada on the 386 machine, I have tried Intel's Ada compiler (which is really Telesoft) and it too works nicely. The format of the files is standard COFF. GNU's loader does not work. I wish it did, but it doesn't work for any version of 386/nix. I would like to have runtime loading of obj files so I can use Scheme with the X windows bindings, but that too requires too much like the sun. I guest I have to wait for 4.0. > 5.) Does the OS support DOS partitions on the same hard disk. > I am not sure on this one, but I do run VPIX. I have a problem with reading my second floppy drive at 1.4 meg. Thats a VPIX problem. Which means that ESIX and everyone else who has this problem has to wait for the vendor to decide when to fix this. > 6.) Does the OS come with utilities to copy files from/to the > DOS/UNIX partitions. > Yes. a version of mcopy will copy dos disks from both a and b drive, mdir will read dos directories. mcopy will translate the files to and from dos. mtype, mren, mdel do the rest of the work. > 7.) Does the system come with on-line man pages. > NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! What a shame too. I have a hypertext reader that works on plain text files (or on man pages) and it would have worked nicely. I don't know why they don't. Maybe if enough people complain they will. You don't really have to buy the documenation. Order it from Prentice Hall, it comes better bound. My next biggest beef with ESIX is that they don't provide the documents on line. Hear that Ida! I can't really complain about anything else about their product, so I have to pick on something. Perhaps, when they want to be truly outstanding.... > 8.) I have heard many ggod things about their phone support. Can you > really talk to someone without sitting on hold for an hour?? > Their phone support and technical staff are the main reasons why we switched over to ESIX. They are competent, easy to talk to, friendly, concerned, caring, and easy to understand (most are far-eastern, but all are exceptionally fluent in English). We hit some unusual problems which required more support than normal (not paid for I may add). We have grown to trust these guys (and have even sent equipment down there when the telephone couldn't solve the problem). We are recommending them to our customers, and requiring them for our subcontractors. We have been using ESIX since rev A, and have seen the many problems that they started out with solved. Rev D is really solid. In summary, Yes there are bugs, some are agravating. Check with them before you order a SCSI disk to make sure it works. I have a disk that was 4 years old and worked great on REV C but does not work on REVD. But bugs can be worked around, and hopefully fixed. I have seen their X window server go from useless to usefull in full color mode. The NFS works nicely with the Xwindow Terminal, and the networking software finally works on the network. I think that in keeping the unix product with the R&D group, Everex has chosen wisely. They also hired a bunch of staff that really knows unix, and will even talk to you on the phone. The engineers really get upset if there are bugs and want to talk to you. They care about their product. I hope this doesn't go to their heads, but right now, they are doing something different that any other 386/nix vendor. When I called Interactive to get a question answered, that their salesman couldn't answer, I got the "I will help you this time but I find it hard to believe the salesman gave you this number. Next time you call, please have a support contract, or I won't be able to talk to you." I don't have a support contract, Interactive. I also don't have your product. Get the message. The opinions expressed are mine and not representative of my company officially. Unofficially half my staff support me. The other half wants to hang me. Eric Beser beser@tron.bwi.wec.com Westinghouse Aerospace Software Engineering (301)-765-1010 "Captain I think we can do it." "Make it so, number one!" > Thanks in advance. > > Ian Searle, uw-beaver!ssc-vax!ssc-bee!ian
seg@vicom.com (Scott E. Garfinkle) (07/29/90)
From article <1510@ssc-bee.ssc-vax.UUCP>, by ian@ssc-vax.UUCP (Ian R. Searle): > For the ESIX 2-user system. > 1.) I have heard it comes with X11R3, does this include X-lib and > the Xt-intrinsics so that I could do developement work. Yes, plus the other libs from the X11r3 distribution (e.g. Xaw). They should also have Motif available as a $300 (more or less) add-on by now, if you are so inclined. > 2.) What flavor window manager and widget sets come with the system. It comes with the stuff you get on the MIT tape -- twm, uwm, and Xaw. It took me very little time to bring up gwm here. > 3.) Does the X-server support the ATI VGA wonder graphics card with > a NEC-3D (256k memory, no biult in mouse, the mouse will be a MS > serial mouse). NEC-3d and mouse, yes. ATI Card at 640x480 definitely, at 800x600 I think so, and at 1024x768 I think not. > 4.) How good are the supplied C compiler and libraries. COFF > format? They're pretty much the same as everyone else's -- they all come from AT&T. You may want gcc. > 5.) Does the OS support DOS partitions on the same hard disk. Yes, I have one. > 6.) Does the OS come with utilities to copy files from/to the > DOS/UNIX partitions. Yes, but it doesn't seem to work well with DOS 4.01 partitions (even ones under 32mb). > 7.) Does the system come with on-line man pages. No. Not available. Too bad! > 8.) I have heard many ggod things about their phone support. Can you > really talk to someone without sitting on hold for an hour?? Absolutely. I almost never get put on hold. The longest I have *ever* been on hold there was a minute or two. They are also available via a BBS and usenet mail. I think that their support is terrific. > Thanks in advance. You're welcome. -Scott E. Garfinkle
davidsen@sixhub.UUCP (Wm E. Davidsen Jr) (08/02/90)
In article <947@segpc.UUCP> segpc!seg@vicom.com (Scott E. Garfinkle) writes: | > 7.) Does the system come with on-line man pages. | No. Not available. Too bad! Moreover the literature says clearly that they don't contemplate making them available. I don't contemplate buying a system without them. -- bill davidsen - davidsen@sixhub.uucp (uunet!crdgw1!sixhub!davidsen) sysop *IX BBS and Public Access UNIX moderator of comp.binaries.ibm.pc and 80386 mailing list "Stupidity, like virtue, is its own reward" -me